The baseball thread.

**smmokan** · 06-13-2007, 08:19 AM

Brock- I didn't even notice that about the Rockies run total... damn. I guess they need a little more timely hitting from Helton/Hawpe/Atkins. I dont' know what the hell is up with Atkins, but I hope he wasn't a one-year wonder.

**Brock Landers** · 06-13-2007, 08:23 AM

Yeah they can hit, but cant score. Helton is really tapering off at this point in his career it seems. Hawpe is good, Atkins is not showing much power either. He was a real surprise last year.

**Steven S. Dallas** · 06-13-2007, 08:28 AM

Forget the fucking Rockies, why the hell can't the Sox score some runs? Nice at-bat in the 8th last night notwithstanding, I think we need to sign Stephen Drew, Tim Drew, Drew Brees, Nancy Drew, and Dr. Drew, since obviously the only thing that gets J.D. Drew motivated is the opportunity to prove he's the #1 Drew in baseball (I'm looking at you, Drew Henson!). Apparently $14 mil per year isn't enough.

**Brock Landers** · 06-13-2007, 08:31 AM

Drew Bledsoe is available. Probably throws heat too.

**MassLiberal** · 06-13-2007, 08:41 AM

Originally Posted by Brock Landers

Drew Bledsoe is available. Probably throws heat too.

Now that would be something else.

Plus, we never score runs when wakefield is pitching. The 1-2-3 punch of Crisp -Mirabelli- Lugo is murderous.

**Steven S. Dallas** · 06-13-2007, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by MassLiberal

Crisp -Mirabelli- Lugo

Does that sound like a group that gets playing time on a World Series-caliber team?

Paging Jacoby Ellsbury... Jacoby Ellsbury to the red courtesy phone.

**steve** · 06-13-2007, 08:51 AM

Originally Posted by Jackie Treehorn

steve, I think you take this whole internet message board thing way too seriously.

Umm, I wasn't the one who told someone to go hang themself...

edit to say: ... over a childish superstition.

**steve** · 06-13-2007, 08:52 AM

Originally Posted by Nick Pappagiorgio

Hey Steve, do you pray at all? Even if you don't, what are your thoughts about people that pray to some non-existent being? Is that considered bullshit? Because in the end, it's all the same. Just curious.

are you honestly, seriously, comparing superstition in baseball to God?
are you fucking kidding me??

remember when I said we should discuss this over a beer? forget it.

**pappag** · 06-13-2007, 08:58 AM

Originally Posted by steve

are you honestly, seriously, comparing superstition in baseball to God?
are you fucking kidding me??

Yeah, because the two are THAT vastly different.

**steve** · 06-13-2007, 08:59 AM

Originally Posted by Nick Pappagiorgio

Yeah, because the two are THAT vastly different.

yes, actually, they are.

-steve

**smmokan** · 06-13-2007, 09:01 AM

Not that I'm condoning the use of Coco Crisp, but looking at Ellsbury's numbers in AAA, it appears that he could use another month or so of "grooming" down in Pawtucket. .292 with 8 XBHs in 137 ABs isn't exactly tearing it up.

**Steven S. Dallas** · 06-13-2007, 09:05 AM

Nobody puts up big numbers down there- it's a pitcher's park in a pitcher's league. But no, he's not ready, although he was great in Portland.

**CUBUCK** · 06-13-2007, 09:13 AM

Originally Posted by steve

yes, actually, they are.

-steve

They are both are focused on the belief that you are part of something much bigger than yourself. While perhaps on a scale baseball superstition and faith in god don't seem to balance the premise behind both is the same.

**steve** · 06-13-2007, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by CUBUCK

They are both are focused on the belief that you are part of something much bigger than yourself. While perhaps on a scale baseball superstition and faith in god don't seem to balance the premise behind both is the same.

this is not the time or the place to get into a theological debate (and what good would that do anyway?)

But if you must go completely off the deep end by comparing them, then recognize that i'm not going to force my religious beliefs on you.. so don't try to apply your superstitious beliefs on me.

**pappag** · 06-13-2007, 09:30 AM

Originally Posted by steve

this is not the time or the place to get into a theological debate (and what good would that do anyway?)

Why not? This is the Padded Room after all and it's always the time and place for discussions like these.

Since both religion and superstition is about belief, well then, you have no choice but to lump in baseball, which is about superstition.

Again I ask: do you pray? If you do or don't, what are your thoughts about praying? Are you not attempting to speak to some non-existent (and presumably supernatural) being? Are you not hoping that the more you pray (be it every Saturday or every Sunday), the greater chance there is of your prayers being answered? Yeah, that's about as logical as not believing that you can jinx a team. If you choose to acknowledge and accept the foundation of one and not the other, well then, aren't we being hypocritical?

**steve** · 06-13-2007, 09:42 AM

Originally Posted by Nick Pappagiorgio

Why not? This is the Padded Room after all and it's always the time and place for discussions like these.

Fine. If you insist on being an asshole, I point you to libraries worth of books that attempt to explain, validate, and prove the existence and validity of a supernatural being. Many come from a scientific perspective, and are quite persuasive. Even if you don't agree with them, even a brief skimming of many of them will show that there is something to it.

You show me one serious book how some shmuck like me saying "the mets are doing well" is going to cause them to lose 9 out of 11. Show me the book.

**smmokan** · 06-13-2007, 09:45 AM

Haven't you guys ever watched Bull Durham, with the Church of Baseball? You can have the best of both worlds.

I believe in the Church of Baseball. I've tried all the major religions, and most of the minor ones. I've worshipped Buddha, Allah, Brahma, Vishnu, Siva, trees, mushrooms, and Isadora Duncan. I know things. For instance, there are 108 beads in a Catholic rosary and there are 108 stitches in a baseball. When I heard that, I gave Jesus a chance. But it just didn't work out between us. The Lord laid too much guilt on me. I prefer metaphysics to theology. You see, there's no guilt in baseball, and it's never boring... which makes it like sex. There's never been a ballplayer slept with me who didn't have the best year of his career. Making love is like hitting a baseball: you just gotta relax and concentrate. Besides, I'd never sleep with a player hitting under .250... not unless he had a lot of RBIs and was a great glove man up the middle. You see, there's a certain amount of life wisdom I give these boys. I can expand their minds. Sometimes when I've got a ballplayer alone, I'll just read Emily Dickinson or Walt Whitman to him, and the guys are so sweet, they always stay and listen. 'Course, a guy'll listen to anything if he thinks it's foreplay. I make them feel confident, and they make me feel safe, and pretty. 'Course, what I give them lasts a lifetime; what they give me lasts 142 games. Sometimes it seems like a bad trade. But bad trades are part of baseball - now who can forget Frank Robinson for Milt Pappas, for God's sake? It's a long season and you gotta trust. I've tried 'em all, I really have, and the only church that truly feeds the soul, day in, day out, is the Church of Baseball

**pappag** · 06-13-2007, 09:49 AM

Originally Posted by steve

Fine. If you insist on being an asshole, I point you to libraries worth of books that attempt to explain, validate, and prove the existence and validity of a supernatural being. Many come from a scientific perspective, and are quite persuasive. Even if you don't agree with them, even a brief skimming of many of them will show that there is something to it.

If these books validate and prove the existence of a supernatural being, then they would certainly be more than persuasive. But that's just me.

Give me two books to read. And I'm being serious here. I take back the hanging yourself bit ... that was just for kicks.

**Brock Landers** · 06-13-2007, 09:50 AM

Ho-lee shit. What is this debate about? Its not about the existence of God or religion or whatever. Its about people believing in superstition. Noone is saying God and baseball superstition are the same. But the premise that an intangible greater being or force is present in superstition AND praying/religion/God.

The number of books written doesnt matter- God is bigger than the theory of superstition, in general. Noone is arguing that. But the premise is the same. Dont get into a hissy fit cause youre being seen as the mush cause after a comment you made the Mets lost. Was it because of you? Prob not, but you never know. Does God exist? Again, thats a personal question of faith and what YOU believe.

EDIT- And fuck the Mets anyway

**Steven S. Dallas** · 06-13-2007, 09:53 AM

Originally Posted by Brock Landers

Again, thats a personal question of faith and what YOU believe.

Or, as was said in Bull Durham, "If you believe you're playing well because you're getting laid, or because you're not getting laid, or because you wear women's underwear, then you are."

**pappag** · 06-13-2007, 09:53 AM

My reconciliation with Steve will now allow the Mets to win 13 of the next 17 games.

**steve** · 06-13-2007, 10:05 AM

Originally Posted by Nick Pappagiorgio

If these books validate and prove the existence of a supernatural being, then they would certainly be more than persuasive. But that's just me.

Give me two books to read. And I'm being serious here. I take back the hanging yourself bit ... that was just for kicks.

ok two books:
When Skeptics Ask by Geisler, Norman L.
Evidence That Demands A Verdict by Josh McDowell

For a more philosophical approach, try
Mere Christianity by CS Lewis

if you want a layman oriented quick read..
The Case for Christ by Lee Strobel.

**steve** · 06-13-2007, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by Steven S. Dallas

Or, as was said in Bull Durham, "If you believe you're playing well because you're getting laid, or because you're not getting laid, or because you wear women's underwear, then you are."

As said earlier in the thread, I like Major League.
"fuck you jo-bu, I do it myself."

**ECbum** · 06-13-2007, 11:53 AM

Time for a change in subject...

So I ask, best piece of fiction involving baseball (either as main plot or subplot)?

I say, The Brothers K by David James Duncan. Aside from being an incredible story of one familys growth through the 50s and 60s, the way he captures the intricacies and culture of baseball is unparralled.

Discuss...

**The AD** · 06-13-2007, 12:12 PM

The Natural is good. Haven't read The Brothers K yet, but that David James Duncan was really good in The Green Mile. I didn't know he could write, too!

Getting back to baseball, how about Verlander's no hitter last night? The Tigers are looking good again after a shaky week or two in May.