50 years to the day

[J. Barron DeJong]

I disagree with basically everything Rod ever says in the Ukraine thread (and it may actually be everything, I just don’t remember), but I have to give him credit: he at least seems to a have a moral compass, based on what he’s saying in here.

Unlike Cono apparently.

[Core Shot]

For those wondering "Hey. How come Gaza doesn't have their own water and stuff? Didn't the EU (and the rest of the world) give them a shit ton of money and supplies over the last 20 years to build out their infrastructure?!", then wonder no more. This is what Hamas was up to with the pipes...



Ohhhh yeah. THAT'S what those guys have been up to. Along with barring its citizens from drilling their own water wells of course. It ain't Israel's fault these guys don't have reliable water & power. That fault lies squarely with their shitty ELECTED Hamas leadership who would rather pour all their resources into weaponry than water. If you listen to the leaders of Hamas over the years, they would rather foster death than life. They've said so. For the umpteenth time, they've always been quite clear about their intentions.

Wtf is that video.
Watch it again. And again

Low budget intifada doesn’t have money for awesome red nose cones and shiny black gloss coat missiles. Wtf. Maybe it’s true.

More likely. Build them cheap and send them. But wtf on that video.

[MontuckyFried]

Wtf is that video.
Watch it again. And again

Seriously. EVERYBODY needs to watch that. For all those bitching about water getting shut off, well there ya have it. The EU literally had the pipes installed, then Hamas (again, the elected governing body there) DUG THEM BACK UP, and reworked them up into rockets. You can literally give these assholes EVERYTHING and they'll still find a way to undo the work done, screw over their own people, and then go blaming Israel and the West for their lack of infrastructure.

But morans in the West be like "Y U NO GIVE GAZA WATER?!" Brussells HAS to be pretty annoyed by Hamas undoing all their hard work and expense.

[Cisco Kid]

Once again, I'm surprised that people are surprised about the resourcefulness of the other side. We called it Yankee Ingenuity at one time. Bibi was supposed to be seeing that shit happening. I'm fearing his motive is going to be Cover My Ass on some levels.

[Cono Este]

How about restraint means not being willing to kill civilians without any moral qualms, as terrorists do.

Tell us how you’d do that?

You say nothing while Israelis lived under rocket attack for 20 yrs.

The difference here, is that Americans we’re killed and kidnapped. You’d have had us had the keys to the pentagon over to Ukraine for a spring offensive that went no where. You’d put our pants completely around our ankles. But you don’t care about Americans? Some probably children?

am I reading this right?

thread drift, penalty on J Blowhard

[dunfree]

Once again, I'm surprised that people are surprised about the resourcefulness of the other side. We called it Yankee Ingenuity at one time. Bibi was supposed to be seeing that shit happening. I'm fearing his motive is going to be Cover My Ass on some levels.

Yankees made money, it’s not surprise as much as sadness

[J. Barron DeJong]

Tell us how you’d do that?

You say nothing while Israelis lived under rocket attack for 20 yrs.

The difference here, is that Americans we’re killed and kidnapped. You’d have had us had the keys to the pentagon over to Ukraine for a spring offensive that went no where. You’d put our pants completely around our ankles. But you don’t care about Americans? Some probably children?

am I reading this right?

thread drift, penalty on J Blowhard

Go read the thread I posted about how they make decisions about hitting targets earlier today. I may not fully agree with their calculations, but they aren’t indiscriminate.

[Cono Este]

They’ve had six days to leave since Hamas was dragging female hostages with bloody crotches through the streets. And many others cheering.

27 dead Americans. 14 missing. What do you propose? Send more money?

[J. Barron DeJong]

They’ve had six days to leave since Hamas was dragging female hostages with bloody crotches through the streets. And many others cheering.

27 dead Americans. 14 missing. What do you propose? Send more money?

Do you actually read anything that is said here?

[MultiVerse]

More than 400,000 Palestinians in Gaza already fled from their homes. In response Hamas set up roadblocks. At minimum civilian corridors should be established.

[LongShortLong]

Imagine the world we could be living in if the USA had done this after 9/11

Imagine.

Speaking of Iran... where is Hamas' terror funding really from? This smells a lot like the 9/11 leader was from Saudi Arabia, 15 of 19 hijackers were from Saudi Arabia, the funding was from Saudi Arabia. So, let's invade Iraq! Go USA! Freedom fries!

I poked around a little and found a US Congress doc (so hopelessly political and not good information) that fingered Qatar in 2014. Most Google results point to US media (also badly biased) saying "allegedly Iran." Sometimes referencing an Israeli security source (no bias there /s).

From wiki (might also be biased), though I flipped back to an August version:

Hamas used to be strongly allied with both Iran and Syria. Iran gave Hamas an estimated $13–15 million in 2011 as well as access to long-range missiles. Hamas's political bureau was once located in the Syrian capital of Damascus before the start of the Syrian civil war. Relations between Hamas, Iran, and Syria began to turn cold when Hamas refused to back the government of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad. Instead, Hamas backed the Sunni rebels fighting against Assad. As a result, Iran cut funding to Hamas, and Iranian ally Hezbollah ordered Hamas members out of Lebanon

$13-15 million isn't much, surely there's private citizens who've given more.

Maybe Iran isn't the primary bad guy here. Well not today anyway.

[Cono Este]

Do you actually read anything that is said here?

Dude, all I know is, your commander in chief, is 110% behind this.

All BS aside, do you read what I write? I’m critical of how we got here, critical of Israel, but we’re here, and its ghastly. As if our nation is not divided enough. We’re gonna have shit go down here.

They could have released the American hostages, but they didn’t. So we basically have 41/dead Americans. Some children. Some raped. When was the last time that happened?

Biden has no choice.

[MultiVerse]

Think of Hamas as a mafia state like Russia. Their leaders started out as refugees themselves and are now billionaires living in Qatar. They become rich by siphoning off a percentage of foreign aid along with a percentage of trade & commerce in Gaza. Hamas themselves say Iran helps smuggle and provide weapons, it's not a conspiracy it's out in the open. The United States Navy routinely interdicts ships smuggling Iranian weapons:

Iran continued to be the leading state sponsor of terrorism, facilitating a wide range of terrorist and other illicit activities around the world. Regionally, Iran supported acts of terrorism in Bahrain, Iraq, Lebanon, Syria, and Yemen through proxies and partner groups such as Hizballah and Hamas. Additionally, senior AQ leaders continued to reside in Iran and engaged with other AQ elements from the country. Globally, the Ministry of Intelligence and Security remained Iran’s primary actor involved in supporting terrorist recruitment, financing, and plots across Africa, Asia, Europe, and North and South America. Iran also maintained a near-global procurement network, obtaining cutting-edge technology from companies and locales around the world to bolster its terrorist and military capabilities.

https://www.state.gov/wp-content/upl...Accessible.pdf


And FWIW, even though the idea of Palestinians overthrowing Hamas was ridiculed Hamas and Hezbollah are unpopular among key Arab publics. That's one of the reasons why Hamas claims they are fighting for the Al Aksa Mosque and not for the Palestinians. Polls show a majority of Gazans were against breaking the ceasefire. 50% of Gazans agree with the following: Hamas should stop calling for Israel’s destruction, and instead accept a permanent two-state solution:

https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/...-and-hezbollah

[J. Barron DeJong]

Dude, all I know is, your commander in chief, is 110% behind this.

All BS aside, do you read what I write? I’m critical of how we got here, critical of Israel, but we’re here, and its ghastly. As if our nation is not divided enough. We’re gonna have shit go down here.

They could have released the American hostages, but they didn’t. So we basically have 41/dead Americans. Some children. Some raped. When was the last time that happened?

Biden has no choice.

I honestly have no idea what your point is, or how you got here.

[Cono Este]

Think of Hamas as a mafia state like Russia. Their leaders started out as refugees themselves and are now billionaires living in Qatar. They become rich by siphoning off a percentage of foreign aid along with a percentage of trade & commerce in Gaza. Hamas themselves say Iran helps smuggle and provide weapons, it's not a conspiracy it's out in the open. The United States Navy routinely interdicts ships smuggling Iranian weapons:

Iran continued to be the leading state sponsor of terrorism, facilitating a wide range of terrorist and other illicit activities around the world. Regionally, Iran supported acts of terrorism in Bahrain, Iraq, Lebanon, Syria, and Yemen through proxies and partner groups such as Hizballah and Hamas. Additionally, senior AQ leaders continued to reside in Iran and engaged with other AQ elements from the country. Globally, the Ministry of Intelligence and Security remained Iran’s primary actor involved in supporting terrorist recruitment, financing, and plots across Africa, Asia, Europe, and North and South America. Iran also maintained a near-global procurement network, obtaining cutting-edge technology from companies and locales around the world to bolster its terrorist and military capabilities.

https://www.state.gov/wp-content/upl...Accessible.pdf

When we invaded Iraq, the only sense I could make of it was that it would give us a 10,000 ft runway to take out Iran with. Of course, Jr. make a total mess of it, and it instead played into irans hands.but a one eyed monkey, hanging from a 10 cent ballon, could see without Iran, this would probably not have happened. Palestinians are just pawns to them, and the rest of the Arab world. Sad.

We did end up with that runway, but we’ll probably be fighting off Iraqis and scrambling out of there soon, at least that’s my worry now.

I realize, cooler heads should prevail, j blow hard, but I can’t even look at these videos, I’d say why, but some clown would just mock me. It’s just fucking ridiculous what happened, I don’t think Nazis were as ruthless.

[J. Barron DeJong]

“A major benefactor for Hamas is Iran, which has provided up to $100 million annually to Palestinian terrorist groups, including Hamas and Palestine Islamic Jihad, according to a US State Department report from 2021. That report noted that Hamas has raised funds in other Gulf Arab countries and from its own charity organizations.”

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/10/12/u...nvs/index.html

[dunfree]

What magic would get Hamas to release hostages? They haven’t released any. This is like thinking a woman with a bullet hold in her temple that was dead in the back of a truck is still alive

[MultiVerse]

, I don’t think Nazis were as ruthless.

At least the Nazis knew what they were doing was criminal and tried to hide their crimes. For Hamas cruelty is the point. They lievestream their crimes to the world.

[J. Barron DeJong]

When we invaded Iraq, the only sense I could make of it was that it would give us a 10,000 ft runway to take out Iran with. Of course, Jr. make a total mess of it, and it instead played into irans hands.but a one eyed monkey, hanging from a 10 cent ballon, could see without Iran, this would probably not have happened. Palestinians are just pawns to them, and the rest of the Arab world. Sad.

We did end up with that runway, but we’ll probably be fighting off Iraqis and scrambling out of there soon, at least that’s my worry now.

I realize, cooler heads should prevail, j blow hard, but I can’t even look at these videos, I’d say why, but some clown would just mock me. It’s just fucking ridiculous what happened, I don’t think Nazis were as ruthless.

I haven’t watched a single video. I trust that they’re every bit as horrific as described, if not more.

I also know that responding to an amoral act by throwing away all your own morals is not the correct response.

[LongShortLong]

https://www.state.gov/wp-content/upl...Accessible.pdf

Well isn't that an unbiased and accurate source in the context of 9/11 and Iraq? As I recall, our Secretary of State went to the UN and lied. Didn't even respect us or himself enough to badly stretch the truth.

Thanks for posting it up. It is a source. An official one.

[Cono Este]

I haven’t watched a single video. I trust that they’re every bit as horrific as described, if not more.

I also know that responding to an amoral act by throwing away all your own morals is not the correct response.

I get it. But I think you should watch the videos.

We’re not talking about a few crazies hijacking a plane and chuck norris showing up.

It’s an army of 30-40k, and the videos I saw, outside of kitted up guys, you had regular guys. Plus all those that cheered. Cheering is enough for me. Remove the children, old people, and thr women, you’re talking a a couple hundred thousand fuckers. Then the tunnels, etc..

There’s been warnings since they roof knocked the head quarters.

I do believe there should be a humanitarian effort. But remember, fucking eygpt closed its border a decade ago, they built a similar wall. Little mention of that. And the asshats claiming they won’t take any refugees because they ll never be allowed back? we’ll, maybe, but they broken violin doesn’t help anyone right now. Where is that outrage?

Palestinians are pawns.

[Core Shot]

Seriously. EVERYBODY needs to watch that. For all those bitching about water getting shut off, well there ya have it. The EU literally had the pipes installed, then Hamas (again, the elected governing body there) DUG THEM BACK UP, and reworked them up into rockets. You can literally give these assholes EVERYTHING and they'll still find a way to undo the work done, screw over their own people, and then go blaming Israel and the West for their lack of infrastructure.

But morans in the West be like "Y U NO GIVE GAZA WATER?!" Brussells HAS to be pretty annoyed by Hamas undoing all their hard work and expense.

You missed my wtf.
Why paint a missile? Obviously Lockheed Martin does to justify the cost and make it all shiny.
If I made missiles and bombs in my garage I’m not sure I’d be painting them.
Just send it.
Also. As for science. Can you actually do projectile combustion in a pvc pipe? Maybe. Dunno. Estes rocket engines are paper.

Aside from the water pipes to missile shit. It sucks that all water and electric for Gaza has to be from Israel. I understand the water if all the water tables are way west. But electric? Gas fired peakers would work. But I guess they aren’t allowed to play with nat gas.

[boltonoutlaw]

More than 400,000 Palestinians in Gaza already fled from their homes. In response Hamas set up roadblocks. At minimum civilian corridors should be established.

If I am reading correctly this states that Hamas set up roadblocks inside Gaza? Hindering its own citizens?

[mcphee]

Why paint a missile? Obviously Lockheed Martin does to justify the cost and make it all shiny.
If I made missiles and bombs in my garage I’m not sure I’d be painting them.
Just send it.

Because rockets and missiles rightfully sit around after manufacturing. It’s called a stockpile. Do you want them to corrode and be useless when needed? Are you suggesting a demand based military weapons manufacturing model? Are you fucking stupid or something?

[subtle plague]

Are you fucking stupid or something?

Is that a rhetoric question?