'14/'15 Magic Shitshow aka Everybody's an Expert thread

[Dexter Rutecki]

Those were points I had in mind as well--this is really not fair or respectful toward the skiers who want to plan and the locals who also want to plan and might be employed. This really is bullshit all the way through.

[lynchdogger]

Oh boy^^^^ valid questions but not sure it's the proper forum. Literally, I found out about the shareholder blowup online and that was it. Hoping for the best.

Not the "proper forum" ??? Since when? Is this Epic? If you know something share it. If you can put pressure on the twats who backed out on the deal (probably in bad faith) then do it. Nothing personal philth but c'mon dude?!

[MyNameIsAugustWest]

Not 100% on this but 98%...Barker isn't in control. A guy named Rob Lysczarz, a real estate broker from NJ, is calling the shots. He mortgaged a significant share of the mountain from the Nelsons. The Nelsons wanted the purchase to happen but Rob wasn't getting enough money based on the mortgage balance so he cock-blocked it. Rob is reportedly in cahoots with Aicholz who all but ran the place into the ground.

Rumors:

Rob may not have Barker running the operation as everyone expects.

Assuming the place operates at all. It doesn't make a lot of sense that they would spend the money to repair and certify the chairlifts but this is Magic, so it doesn't have to make sense I guess.

The deal isn't dead yet but is on life support. The purchasers are still pursuing it but Rob has been mostly non-responsive to their overtures.

[krp8128]

Can someone please explain to me the ownership/management roles last season vs. What deal was planned this season?

I know a few of you are in the kknow, and I am fairly certain I have met all involved parties. Trying To Keep Shit Straight Here And On FB is near impossible. Seems like everyone is a tom, jim, or jeff

[steamboat1]

You want to know what's going on? I'll tell you exactly what's going on. Nobody knows whats's going on. That's what's going on.

[Dexter Rutecki]

Not 100% on this but 98%...Barker isn't in control. A guy named Rob Lysczarz, a real estate broker from NJ, is calling the shots. He mortgaged a significant share of the mountain from the Nelsons. The Nelsons wanted the purchase to happen but Rob wasn't getting enough money based on the mortgage balance so he cock-blocked it. Rob is reportedly in cahoots with Aicholz who all but ran the place into the ground.

While my understanding is that you're right on part of this I also don't believe that Rob is calling the shots in terms of what happens this season (he has the ability to kill the deal but isn't, AFAIK, overseeing anything Barker does). From Rob's POV there is arguably a good reason that he held everything up...not defending (or commenting on) him in any way, but based on his own interests it's understandable that he stopped the sale (you could actually say in some ways he had no choice).

[MyNameIsAugustWest]

Can someone please explain to me the ownership/management roles last season vs. What deal was planned this season?

I know a few of you are in the kknow, and I am fairly certain I have met all involved parties. Trying To Keep Shit Straight Here And On FB is near impossible. Seems like everyone is a tom, jim, or jeff

It's complicated...

There are essentially 3 parties that currently have an ownership interest in the mountain and all of its infrastructure. The Nelson family, Rob Lysczarz who mortgaged his share from the Nelsons, and Tom Barker. Tom has a very minority share.

A group of 3 buyers (I don't know who they are or if it is 3, 4, or more) who are also skiers at Magic agreed to put up a sum of money (Let's call it 1.5 million to use round numbers) to purchase the whole shebang. They wanted to spend $1 million (round numbers) to buy it and put the rest of the money into infrastructure improvements to get the place on a solid footing. This group was led by Geoff Hatheway; I'm not sure, but I don't think Geoff put up much if any of the money.

Because of the sale price that was "agreed to" Rob wouldn't have come away with much money so he backed out at the 11th hour.

While my understanding is that you're right on part of this I also don't believe that Rob is calling the shots in terms of what happens this season (he has the ability to kill the deal but isn't, AFAIK, overseeing anything Barker does). From Rob's POV there is arguably a good reason that he held everything up...not defending (or commenting on) him in any way, but based on his own interests it's understandable that he stopped the sale (you could actually say in some ways he had no choice).

The people I talk to say that Rob is absolutely calling the shots. He told the Nelsons he would run the place and would actually be at Magic 4 days per week this winter. I do know that he has talked to other people about being the GM for the season but none of those other people is Tom Barker. I'm not going to name names but I know someone that Rob asked to run the place. As was reported earlier this summer, Barker dissolved the management LLC that he started last year to operate the mountain. Barker doesn't have enough of an ownership share to do anything without Lysczarz's and the Nelsons' agreement. His control last year was based on the Nelsons and Lysczarz leasing that right to his management LLC. It was the same scenario when Jim Sullivan ran the place.

[Kwnelson]

Can someone please explain to me the ownership/management roles last season vs. What deal was planned this season?

I know a few of you are in the kknow, and I am fairly certain I have met all involved parties. Trying To Keep Shit Straight Here And On FB is near impossible. Seems like everyone is a tom, jim, or jeff

Magic is owned by MMM (which is Rob L and Tom B). Last year, Tom leased the mountain to operate (thru MMR). The Nelsons are no longer owners of Magic - they just hold the majority share of mortgages.

[Peruvian]

...but based on his own interests it's understandable that he stopped the sale (you could actually say in some ways he had no choice).

Being made whole on a property (or mortgaged or however you want to put it) is no guarantee. Does the property gain any more value if it's not operational for a winter or two? He might be cutting off his nose to spite his face. But I don't have any further insight into what went down. I hope Kwnelson can provide more info on Ski Magic, LLC and if they plan on leasing/operating the mountain this winter.

[Timberridge]

Thanks for the update everyone, I was trying to figure this out 4 pages ago.

So, the bottom line is the hill may or may not be open this season depending on Rob L and Tom B's penchant to run it and fund it. I assume the money hasn't been exactly piling up this season from pass sales due to the uncertainty, so this is going to require more than the normal financial commitment from the two owners to fund it, even if the winter kicks off to a solid start by Christmas.

[Kwnelson]

Being made whole on a property (or mortgaged or however you want to put it) is no guarantee. Does the property gain any more value if it's not operational for a winter or two? He might be cutting off his nose to spite his face. But I don't have any further insight into what went down. I hope Kwnelson can provide more info on Ski Magic, LLC and if they plan on leasing/operating the mountain this winter.

A closed mountain sounds very bad, for everyone. Unfortunately, I know nothing about the plans, except the same speculation heard by others.

[MMP]

Hopefully you can force them into receivership the second they don't make a payment. Have a receiver lined up that can operate the mountain and husband the asset until the sale can be closed. I don't know these guys personally, Rob and Tom, but if this is how things are going to be it's definitely a wait and see situation over here. My heart is at Magic but between the partnership, MF club, and now this, confidence is low and loyalty to the entity magic is waning, though certainly not my feeling for the community. There are options. Blind faith days are done.

[Dexter Rutecki]

The Nelsons are no longer owners of Magic - they just hold the majority share of mortgages.

And you would know this about the Nelsons how, exactly??

Being made whole on a property (or mortgaged or however you want to put it) is no guarantee. Does the property gain any more value if it's not operational for a winter or two? He might be cutting off his nose to spite his face. But I don't have any further insight into what went down. I hope Kwnelson can provide more info on Ski Magic, LLC and if they plan on leasing/operating the mountain this winter.

I guess I'll just add, to explain what I didn't earlier, that the explanation for the sale stopping when it did is going forward would have required an outlay of cash up-front from Rob, and this was simply not going to happen under any realistically foreseeable circumstances. If this remains a requirement I understand that there is little to no chance for the sale to be revived. Obviously hearsay since I am in no way a party to any of this, but I am getting my info from people who are involved directly and indirectly.

On the Rob calling the shots thing--I misunderstood MNIAW's point. I thought he was saying Rob had been calling the shots (last year and up to this point) during the Barker tenure. Now that I think about it I did hear something consistent with the idea of Rob being involved in running the mountain this year, so what MNIAW said matches what at least one other Magicment type (I'm still hoping everyone keeps using that awesome term) mentioned. I really don't have an opinion on what that might mean for Magic except that virtually anyone who isn't Barker would be preferable (but will Barker actually listen to someone else? His reputation is that he doesn't.).

[Dexter Rutecki]

Hopefully you can force them into receivership the second they don't make a payment. Have a receiver lined up that can operate the mountain and husband the asset until the sale can be closed.

Are you talking about a foreclosure? Because I had a conversation related to that idea with another person up there and, at least in this person's opinion, foreclosure would almost necessarily mean the mountain being closed for a season.

[MMP]

not necessarily. A creditor can have the assets seized and the bank accounts frozen in some cases, if the value of the business will be destroyed by closing it. A receiver pays the bills, controls the money and tries to work out a solution, be it a compromise deal or a sale of assets at auction. In essence the business operates without the people that fucked it up having access to the money.

[jgb@etree]

And you would know this about the Nelsons how, exactly??

Look at his name.... kwnelson

[Timberridge]

Lets hope for a fabulously profitable wedding season in October.

[Peruvian]

On the Rob calling the shots thing-I misunderstood MNIAW's point. I thought he was saying Rob had been calling the shots (last year and up to this point) during the Barker tenure. Now that I think about it I did hear something consistent with the idea of Rob being involved in running the mountain this year, so what MNIAW said matches what at least one other Magicment type (I'm still hoping everyone keeps using that awesome term) mentioned. I really don't have an opinion on what that might mean for Magic except that virtually anyone who isn't Barker would be preferable (but will Barker actually listen to someone else? His reputation is that he doesn't.).

MMR was terminated in the spring, so Barker would have to start a new LLC in order to operate the mountain this winter.

[Dexter Rutecki]

Look at his name.... kwnelson

Thus you understand my reason for asking the question...I think.

Lets hope for a fabulously profitable wedding season in October.

Please tell me that photo is real.

[MyNameIsAugustWest]

Look at his name.... kwnelson

It might be "her" name.

[Timberridge]

Please tell me that photo is real.

I raise my right hand and swear on DW's new loppers.

[Dexter Rutecki]

I never get invited to anything cool.

[jgb@etree]

It might be "her" name.

Yeah, that too. My bad.

[Timberridge]

Yeah, that too. My bad.

To avoid these embarassments, just go with "look at 'the' name" from now on.

That said, kwnelson could just be another slaagmaster alias.

[DBdude]

edited:
Thomas Barker's Magic Mountain Resorts, LLC, which operated the cash-strapped area during the 2014-15 season, was quietly terminated as a Vermont business entity on March 16, 2015. After a September 3, 2015 filing, the business entity is now active again.

So it seems that MMR wants to be involved with the mountain this year.

So right now if the mountain where to open it would be run by MMM.