AT Binding group buy

[couloirman]

If i can get in on the CO group buy for some medium freeride plus Id be happy to pick up any Boulder mags binders from Gregaur in Golden and help distribute around here if some people cant make it out to there to pick up their own

PM me if you would like to arrange this.

[Frito00]

sent a pm yesturday morning so hopefully got on extended list. but also in fort collins so would be down for a colorado buy.

[Atrain505]

A canada or tahoe/canada group buy would be sweet. The only problem is paying duty for shipping to canada.
I've got three mags in Vancouver interested. Perhaps try a candian store to avoid the shipping hassle? Maybe I should start a new thread.

[BreckRider]

I'm up for the Denver buy for TLTs or Comforts

[col_surfer]

I haven`t heard anyone ask about possible import duties, aka Customs tax.
You think they won`t notice a large shipment like this? I know small orders (ie. Telemark Pyrenees) that have a set or two of bindings can pass unnoticed, but even those get an occasional 10% added by the man.

Also, who is going to warranty the product? Should Life-link and Black Diamond lose money on returns/replacements? Remember, they are merely the distributors, not the manufacturers.

Just some things to ponder.

[upallnight]

officially, the import duty on bindings is 2.8%. now, whether or not that is collected is an altogether different matter.

[Pow4Brains]

officially, the import duty on bindings is 2.8%. now, whether or not that is collected is an altogether different matter.

Alpine, yes. Cross Country, no. A binding for going UP HILL is what kind?

[upallnight]

Alpine, yes. Cross Country, no. A binding for going UP HILL is what kind?

i never thought of that angle!

[couloirman]

i think some peoples are talking smack on us...

http://www.backcountryworld.com/showthread.php?t=2548

who is this rpolk, and why would the people on the couloirmag website know any more than we do... reveal yourself!

[my_alta_ego]

Mmm, looks like he`s just asking some questions about the industry. How`s that talking smack if nothing is untrue? Others are chiming in with their opinions also. Anyway, I`ve heard he`s a BC guy in Ak and gets lots of days.

[PulverSchwein]

This just shows that AT bindings (and a bunch of other ski gear) are overpriced here. The dollar is pretty weak right now compared with the euro and still it is much cheaper to buy there and ship it here (group buy primarily just lowers the shipping). It should be far cheaper for the distributor to ship a whole bunch over here on a boat. Hopefully stuff like this will cause the manufactures/distributors to stop shafting us. Yes, I've heard the tired arguments I'm sure will be dragged out, but the bottom line is that they charge more in the US cause we pay it. Nothing more to it than that.

sounds like Bob has it figured out. I understand that there is a risk associated with buying overseas but the savings are just too attractive to be ignored. Equalizing the value of the item NA vs EU would eliminate the temptation to go overseas.

[Greguar]

I'd say that they have some very legitimate points there. I have been feeling a little guilty lately. I have gotten 13 replies now and 3 have been from brand new Jongs, I mean like they just joined TGR this month specifically for this group buy. I for one support my local shop by buying as much stuff as I can possibly justify. Big ticket items like skis, boots, and bindings I just can't afford unless they are used or I am getting a serious hook up. I refer everyone from the "outside" world to the local shops, but man I've been skiing, biking, etc forever, worked at shops since I was 16 until I got out of college. I'd go broke, as if I am not all ready, buying my toys. Since I worked at shops before I don't need to use the local shop for warranties and if I need them to put on some bindings or do some repair work I hook them up with some beer and extra cash.

I can relate to the local shops and appreciate their support. I think that it is important for us to consider the ramifications of hooking up the outsiders that may have ended up going to local shops. What do you guys think?

Below is a list of qtys, descriptions, and user details that I have so far.

ONLY PM ME IF THERE IS A DISCREPANCY AND DO NOT PM ME IN RESPONSE TO THE ABOVE ISSUE/QUESTION.

Yossarian 1 x Dynafit comfort Join date May 2002 posts 2,719
Spthompson 1 x Dynafit comfort Join date Feb 2004 posts 476
Danadog 1 x freeride plus medium Join date Dec 2003 posts 469
DJMingus 1 x Naxo21 Med Join date Mar 2005 posts 339
Couloirman 1 x freeride plus medium Join date Nov 2005 posts 226
Greguar 1 x freeride plus med Join date Oct 2005 posts 177
Red Squirrel 1 x Naxo21 small Join date Mar 2006 posts 33
The Dark Side 1 x Dynafit TLT no brakes & Freeride plus med Join date Jan 2005 posts 27
Loren (roommate) 2 x freeride plus med Join date June 2006 posts 12
Pascoe 1 x Med Freerides w/ wide brakes Join date Apr 2005 posts 6
Agentorange 1 x freeride plus small Join date Sep 2006 posts 6
Frito00 1 x Naxo21 Large Join date Sep 2006 posts 2
Drex27 Naxo21 Med Join date Sep 2006 posts 1
ThisIsRockAndRoll Freeride plus size large Join date Sep 2006 posts 0

[couloirman]

Mmm, looks like he`s just asking some questions about the industry. How`s that talking smack if nothing is untrue? Others are chiming in with their opinions also. Anyway, I`ve heard he`s a BC guy in Ak and gets lots of days.

damn, i was burned by a JONG! Youre right though, I was a little tipsy celebrating my AFF level 4 jump from earlier that day and just read that they were questioning our actions like that and i got a little defensive and acted too quickly to post before thinking. On further review, you are very correct, it is a thoughtful discussion they are having over there, and one we all should think about(however I am not going to be paying 425 for something were getting here for so much cheaper). Way to put me in my place alta ego!

[The Dark Side]

Well, I doubt they have infinite supply or want to pack too many pairs of bindings so this may be a moot point. About the above question, I would not buy them at list price here anyway. I would wait for a late season sale or a good ebay or bro deal find. So the shops are not losing a sale from me. Since you are leading it you can make an executive decision on whether to allow low number posters. I joined to take advantage of str8lines maggot camp and he let me slide, but I'm still a bit of a lurker (even though I've skied with the CO crowd, something I want to do more of this year).

[powdercow]

As the initiator of this madness I should probably chime in. I agree with Alta_ego that the couloirs discussions is a good one, and great points are being raised some of which I considered before I posted the buy and some of which I didn’t. I am a little bit of an organization freak so in my mind I broke the issue down to these:

1) “Tech” support – I guess I see this as a buyer beware situation. It is up to every one who purchases to figure out if the money they save is worth hassle of having an out of country retailer. It really depends on your personal money/time tradeoff. I also agree with whoever said that they will take internet bought items into a local shop for support but then pay them for the time. I usually just try to be upfront, tell them where I got the stuff, ask them if they are interested in fixing it, and then pay them a fair rate.

2) Support local shops – This is the only “money” one that nags at my conscious. The only justification I have is that when I have talked to shop owners locally they have all told me the same thing. “We don’t make any money off of the big stuff, that’s just to get people in the door, the profit is in services, stickers, apparel etc.” Since I heard that I have tried to buy all of my “accessories” from these guys even if I get my big stuff as cheap as possible. My only other thought is something that my father in law told me “My duty as a consumer is to consider ALL the factors and spend my money the wisest way possible, that’s the only way capitalism will work”. Not sure why but that still doesn’t settle the argument for me.

3) The economics – Like bob on the other board the numbers just don’t add up for me (maybe because I don’t understand the whole situation). If the shop owners aren’t making much if anything on this stuff and the distributors are going as low as they can then where does the margin go. Are North American distributors paying more for the bindings then consumers in Europe?

4) And finally the one that made me shiver a little last night as I was falling asleep. BC skiing isn’t the most expensive sport in the world but there is a barrier to entry for sure. By lowering the barrier to entry do we get people in the backcountry that “don’t belong” myself included. I am a big believer in people being responsible for their own actions especially in the outdoors but there is no denying that it would shake me if I found out someone died riding bindings that I helped them get.

The question I still have to decided is Where does it stop?. After pulling the trigger yesterday I thought I would be “nice” and write up a how-to on the order, to make it easier for others to do the same. Now I am not sure, and frankly I would appreciate some feedback.

In the end I am ok with my decision to do the buy and to help others get in on it but its certainly not a black and white issue.

[mday]

2) Support local shops – This is the only “money” one that nags at my conscious. The only justification I have is that when I have talked to shop owners locally they have all told me the same thing. “We don’t make any money off of the big stuff, that’s just to get people in the door, the profit is in services, stickers, apparel etc.” Since I heard that I have tried to buy all of my “accessories” from these guys even if I get my big stuff as cheap as possible.

I'm not participating in this buy (as much as I'd like to go to a Dynafit setup, I can't justify new bindings and compatible boots). However, the 'local' shops I trust for this kind of stuff are The Backcountry'in Truckee (3 hours away) and 'Mammoth Mountaineering (6 hours away in the winter). I buy gear from these shops because I want them to still be around when I need them, but given the logistics, I also buy a ton of gear off of the Internet. I'm sure that there are a lot of people in the same boat where 'specialty' AT gear isn't available with a reasonable selection locally. Although I will favor maggot businesses like backcountry.com, once I've gone to the Internet, I don't see any difference in participating in a group buy, buying from a US online business or a European one.

The question I still have to decided is Where does it stop?. After pulling the trigger yesterday I thought I would be “nice” and write up a how-to on the order, to make it easier for others to do the same. Now I am not sure, and frankly I would appreciate some feedback.

Information wants to be free. Let others benefit from your experiences and it's up to them to decide what to do. I really doubt that this level of small-scale purchase will affect inter-continental price discrepancies, but if it does, you've done a good thing. Markets figure out where there are price ineffeciencies, and makes them more efficient. That's what capitalism is supposed to do.

[Loren]

After reading the thread here and on Couloir, it seems to me that the money we are saving is really coming out of the pockets of the importers, BD for the freerides and BCA for Naxos, etc. The fact is, those companies have the capability of importing bindings MUCH cheaper than us (shipping, wharehousing, purchasing directly from the manufacturer), yet when we purchase through them the bindings are significantly more expensive. We aren't cutting out retail shops though we are unfortunately transfering that business from a local shop to a German shop.

Of course, Black Diamond and BCA add some value to the products, they support warranty. Is the warranty service they provide worth the extra expense? I don't think so, that's why I'm buying here. If you disagree, by all means support your local shop and your American importers.

I think, in the long term, the way you could support your local shop is by making them aware that as a thoughtful consumer you are choosing to buy some products from foreign shops, despite whatever interest you have in seeing your local shop succeed. They should be aware of the amount of money we are saving by avoiding the importing companies so that they can pressure the industry to provide them with imported products that are more reasonably priced.

As for the valid point that Greguar makes, I'll leave that to you maggots to determine the level of JONGdom that can participate.

[grapedrink]

maybe this has been mentionned before, i haven't read the whole thread but why have multiple bulk orders? why doesn't the OP (or someone else) just take -everyones- orders (be it 10, 20, 30 or 40 pairs of bindings) and then everyone just send him an extra $5-10 with their payment so that whoevers doing all the work ends up with a free pair of bindings? one giant order makes things much more simple, no one gets left out, and you should be able to negotiate an even better price.. for orders in canada just ship ups ground with a declared value of $10.. no fees or taxes of any kind. maybe combine shipments to the same town/area if people want to save on shipping..

[upallnight]

does anyone know if that $186 price for dynafits is for TLTs or comforts?

does the $252 price for FR+ include wide brakes (i assume no)?

thanks so much! trying to make a decision here...

[powdercow]

does anyone know if that $186 price for dynafits is for TLTs or comforts?

does the $252 price for FR+ include wide brakes (i assume no)?

thanks so much! trying to make a decision here...

Final price we got quoted after 10% discount and VAT taken out was

Comforts- 135 euro
TLT- not sure but they started 10 euro less
All bindings except TLT speed come with brake and can be upgraded to wide at no additional cost


disclamer: This is all based on what they TOLD me, I haven't seen my credit card bill yet nothing is for sure yet.

[upallnight]

thanks, powdercow. that is helpful!

[Pow4Brains]

does the $252 price for FR+ include wide brakes (i assume no)?

Includes wide brakes.

[Pow4Brains]

whoevers doing all the work ends up with a free pair of bindings.

Plan on sending an extra 6 pack. Thanks for doing all the legwork powdercow.

[ski_faster]

Plan on sending an extra 6 pack. Thanks for doing all the legwork powdercow.

I plan on the same. Big Props to Powdercow

[soul_skier]

ya, what type of beer do you want? if you really want, i can send a growler of magic hat to you from VT