Ask the experts

[volklpowdermaniac]

I've used carbon bars on all my bikes for last 7 or so years, never had one fail, don't even really think about it much, just go along using them whatever. But for whatever reason, cost? maybe just morbid curiosity, and some cool bars available in metal, I'm considering going to some alloy bars for the bird forge I'm building, have modern alloy bars gotten good damping wise
At all? Of course specialized products like the spank, but how but your runofthemill stuff from chromag and raceface one up and the like etc? I mean the outgoing bar on prior hard tail was rf sixC - from what I read that's one of the least compliant more harsh carbon bars made? So can't be that much better than a decent alloy bars? My others basis of comparison are my two sets of Next R, again they've just been fine solid good whatever don't think about them much.

[bagtagley]

I've used carbon bars on all my bikes for last 7 or so years, never had one fail, don't even really think about it much, just go along using them whatever. But for whatever reason, cost? maybe just morbid curiosity, and some cool bars available in metal, I'm considering going to some alloy bars for the bird forge I'm building, have modern alloy bars gotten good damping wise
At all? Of course specialized products like the spank, but how but your runofthemill stuff from chromag and raceface one up and the like etc? I mean the outgoing bar on prior hard tail was rf sixC - from what I read that's one of the least compliant more harsh carbon bars made? So can't be that much better than a decent alloy bars? My others basis of comparison are my two sets of Next R, again they've just been fine solid good whatever don't think about them much.

I run Chromag on my bikes. I don't have a big issue with arm pump or hand/wrist pain, so I'm not a great judge of damping, but the shape is dead-on for me.

No experience with these, but have heard they're pretty close to the carbon version.
https://www.oneupcomponents.com/prod...inum-handlebar

[nickwm21]

After years of riding carbon bars… I had AL bars on a new build for about 3 rides before I gave in and ordered a carbon bars….


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[volklpowdermaniac]

After years of riding carbon bars… I had AL bars on a new build for about 3 rides before I gave in and ordered a carbon bars….


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

This is my fear.

[Andeh]

I think it depends on which carbon bar you're coming from. If you're coming from a OneUp, there's a good chance alu will feel really harsh. I tried Renthal in both 35mm dia carbon and 31.8mm alu to try out 7* sweep, and while I liked the sweep, they both hurt tremendously (the 31.8 alu felt better of those 2 though). I sold the 35 carbon, and put the 31.8 alu on my pump track bike. I rode a rental bike over the summer that was the same frame as my main bike but had some random alu bars (e13?) and even with my normal grips, my hands hurt.

Edit: but if you're coming from some stiff as hell carbon like Race Face SixC or Renthal, then some alu might feel better.

[XXX-er]

I have always just ridden whatever came on the bike

https://nsmb.com/articles/introducin...on-handlebars/

nerding out on carbon bars

[zion zig zag]

After riding in Oaxaca and realizing that I really enjoy steep tech trails, I've been wringing hands over getting a new bike. Currently ride a 2020 140/120 Smuggler, and while I ride everything on it and had a blast on those steep trails, I was thinking that something a little slacker with more travel may be more fun.

But I also want a bike that doesn't feel ponderous and too overbiked for my average rides around N. Utah/Teton Valley, and doesn't feel like too much of a chore for bigger days. I'm not all that concerned about climbing speed. There are a few bikes that I can get deals on either through hook ups or end of season close outs locally and I was curious about peoples thoughts:

Norco Sight
SC Bronson
SC Hightower

I'm mullet curious and the Bronson seems like it would be the biggest change from what I have, but at 6 feet tall maybe the advantage isn't great for me? Hightower gets great reviews and seems to fit the bill, and the Sight has less reviews than the others, but almost seems like it's getting into that Enduro territory? All advice appreciated.

[smmokan]

If you're not against the Big S, I'd take a hard look at the Stumpy EVO. I rode mine on everything from BC double blacks to 30mi/5000'+ days in the Colorado high country. Otherwise, I have a riding buddy on the Sight and he absolutely loves the bike so far.

[zion zig zag]

If you're not against the Big S, I'd take a hard look at the Stumpy EVO. I rode mine on everything from BC double blacks to 30mi/5000'+ days in the Colorado high country. Otherwise, I have a riding buddy on the Sight and he absolutely loves the bike so far.

Not against it, and can score a deal on Stumpy as well. For whatever reason I thought people were saying it was too much bike for day to day pedal rides.

[volklpowdermaniac]

After riding in Oaxaca and realizing that I really enjoy steep tech trails, I've been wringing hands over getting a new bike. Currently ride a 2020 140/120 Smuggler, and while I ride everything on it and had a blast on those steep trails, I was thinking that something a little slacker with more travel may be more fun.

But I also want a bike that doesn't feel ponderous and too overbiked for my average rides around N. Utah/Teton Valley, and doesn't feel like too much of a chore for bigger days. I'm not all that concerned about climbing speed. There are a few bikes that I can get deals on either through hook ups or end of season close outs locally and I was curious about peoples thoughts:

Norco Sight
SC Bronson
SC Hightower

I'm mullet curious and the Bronson seems like it would be the biggest change from what I have, but at 6 feet tall maybe the advantage isn't great for me? Hightower gets great reviews and seems to fit the bill, and the Sight has less reviews than the others, but almost seems like it's getting into that Enduro territory? All advice appreciated.

Don't know if there are any deals , but man the fuel ex seems to fit the bill and people rave aboutnir

[toast2266]

Not against it, and can score a deal on Stumpy as well. For whatever reason I thought people were saying it was too much bike for day to day pedal rides.

Compared to an xc race whip, the stumpy evo is a pig. Compared to a garden variety trail bike, it's more or less comparable to pedal uphill. Compared to the smuggler, it's maybe a *little* more piggish, but not terrible. Kinda depends on the build / tires.

I know tons of people that pedal their evos all over the place and on big rides. I've got a sentinel, which is very similar to the evo, and I'm totally fine with pedaling it on longer rides.

[Dantheman]

For whatever reason I thought people were saying it was too much bike for day to day pedal rides.

"People" will say that about any bike that has more than 120 mm of travel. Liz loves hers, never once has complained about being overbiked. I pedaled it up Days once, no complaints, would have happily kept going up.

[zion zig zag]

Compared to an xc race whip, the stumpy evo is a pig. Compared to a garden variety trail bike, it's more or less comparable to pedal uphill. Compared to the smuggler, it's maybe a *little* more piggish, but not terrible. Kinda depends on the build / tires.

I know tons of people that pedal their evos all over the place and on big rides. I've got a sentinel, which is very similar to the evo, and I'm totally fine with pedaling it on longer rides.

Just checked the Specialized website. What is the T-type? Does that just mean mix wheel size? Looks like they are all T-type/mullet now?
So if I add the stumpy to the mix, is there a standout? Or all bikes are good now and they'll all make me ride 30% faster and have 100% more fun? OR do I just have vacation induced new-bike-itis that will resolve with time and make me realize the Smuggler is good enough.....

Norco Sight
SC Bronson
SC Hightower
Specialized Stumpy EVO

[zion zig zag]

"People" will say that about any bike that has more than 120 mm of travel. Liz loves hers, never once has complained about being overbiked. I pedaled it up Days once, no complaints, would have happily kept going up.

Good to know. My concern was more that it wasn't 'fun' on local trails due to it being too much bike (too slack, too long, not sure?)

I'm rarely the slowest climber in my group, but I am the slowest downhill often, so I'd tend to like the help that direction if that makes sense.

[toast2266]

Just checked the Specialized website. What is the T-type? Does that just mean mix wheel size? Looks like they are all T-type/mullet now?
So if I add the stumpy to the mix, is there a standout? Or all bikes are good now and they'll all make me ride 30% faster and have 100% more fun? OR do I just have vacation induced new-bike-itis that will resolve with time and make me realize the Smuggler is good enough.....

Norco Sight
SC Bronson
SC Hightower
Specialized Stumpy EVO

T-type just means it has the new wireless sram transmission drivetrain.

[Canada1]

I’ve ridden the sight and Evo. I’d lean towards the better build on either. They both are do everything bikes. Norc o has better Shimano options, which would push me there.

[Dantheman]

Good to know. My concern was more that it wasn't 'fun' on local trails due to it being too much bike (too slack, too long, not sure?)

If your main jam is cruising BST then, yeah, it won't be as much fun. I basically make it up it to Ogden once a year to ride Ben Lomond so I'm not that versed on your day-to-day options, but if you have steeper rowdier trails available your "day-to-day" may change to suit the bigger bike.

Is this an n+1 scenario or would you sell the Smuggler? I'd offer to let you borrow Liz's but it's S2.

[Spencer123]

I am putting a set of code R brakes on my bike and after shortening the rear brake (they have been sitting with the levers off for a year) went to reinstall the hosing, olive barb lever etc.... and no oil will push through the lever side when bleeding it. I removed the olive and barb to see if there was anything obvious, and no oil will come out of the lever even with no hose attached so it seems to be something with the lever itself. Never had any issues with the brakes previously. Any ideas?

[Eluder]

"People" will say that about any bike that has more than 120 mm of travel. Liz loves hers, never once has complained about being overbiked. I pedaled it up Days once, no complaints, would have happily kept going up.

Agreed, I have a Sentinel, and Mrs. Eluder is on an Evo. We ride all over on them. The only time I ever want less bike is in an XC race setting. Never once have I started a 2-4000 foot descent wishing I had a smaller rig... I get people warranting 120mm-130 travel bikes in some locations, but the do-all travel is still 140-150mm.

[Andeh]

Good to know. My concern was more that it wasn't 'fun' on local trails due to it being too much bike (too slack, too long, not sure?)

I'm rarely the slowest climber in my group, but I am the slowest downhill often, so I'd tend to like the help that direction if that makes sense.

The nice thing about the Evo is it's got a ton of adjustability built in so you can tune it one way or another. You can set the headset angle anywhere from ~63 to ~64.5, move BB up and down by like 6mm. From what I've heard of people who own them, the Specialized mullet link does make the bike too linear, so if you're used to riding 29, stick with that option though. If you want it to feel more efficient, there's nothing wrong with adding a few psi to the shock/fork and/or adding a few clicks of LSC.

I love Santa Cruz bikes but the prices right now on Specialized right now make a really compelling argument for anyone on a bit of a budget. The SJ Evo Expert builds get you much better components than anything in that price tier from SC. Weakest spec choice on the Expert is the Code RS brakes. Stepping up to the Pro will get you carbon wheels & bars, RSC brakes, and bleep bloop shifting (the old AXS style). Looks like they're only selling Transmission (T-Type) on mullet builds.

[smmokan]

Looks like they're only selling Transmission (T-Type) on mullet builds.

Which is fucking stupid. I'd love to hear the reasoning behind that, as all higher level EVOs are mullets for 2024. Ugh.

[Boissal]

Having been on a regular Stumpy all season, and coming from something that was close to an Evo (beefed up Orbea Occam), I'd recommend the Evo for Wasatch-land. There's not much difference in weight, pedaling is going to feel about the same, and while I can ride everything on the Stumpy that I've ridden on the Occam I sometimes wish for a bit of extra plush, not so much for myself but for the sake of the bike. Both feel equally snappy but the bigger bike will save your ass in oh-shit moments while it's easier to get right up to the limit on the small bike and fuck up. I've never wished for a smaller bike than the Stumpy (I'd probably be 1% faster on the up with an Evo and hate every second of the down before exploding something) but I've had a few moments this season where I would have been happier with a bigger steed.

As an aside, I occasionally find myself doings miles of BST on my Gnarvana, and while 160mm of coil travel is definitely way too much for that kind of terrain it's never not fun. Sure it's not as snappy but you can learn to be quick on a big bike if the terrain dictates it, and when you get back on something with a more reasonable geo/travel it turns you into an absolute menace.

[beaterdit]

Good to know. My concern was more that it wasn't 'fun' on local trails due to it being too much bike (too slack, too long, not sure?)

I'm rarely the slowest climber in my group, but I am the slowest downhill often, so I'd tend to like the help that direction if that makes sense.

If you have a new love of steeps, I might steer toward the Sight. Errybody loves that bike and it's made for that stuff. Might not the Sentinel get consideration too?

Personally I ride every day on a metal, coil-sprung 163/170 29er with no regrets. I like the trails that suit that bike and gravitate toward that type of riding but I'm riding it all. I seek out vertical instead of horizontal even if it means hike-a-bike, and I *feel* like I have more fun in less time. It's a bit of a handful on bigger days but that's got more to do with my fitness. More travel tends to beat you up a bit less too.

[XtrPickels]

The nice thing about the Evo is it's got a ton of adjustability built in so you can tune it one way or another. You can set the headset angle anywhere from ~63 to ~64.5, move BB up and down by like 6mm.

I'll second this. A stumpy Evo set steep head tube and short chainstays feels like a different bike than slack and long. You can quickly dial it into your preference and for me it was eye opening to see how the geometry changes affected each other.

For instance, in the slacker HTA I liked it with longer chainstays because it felt more balanced while cornering.

Set steeper and shorter and it's a fun bike to pop and play.

[zion zig zag]

Ok, you guys have me convinced to check out the StumpyEVO. I’m a little disappointed that all of the available ones are now mullet, but maybe that would be a fun change? I mean, I was considering a Bronson.

DTM, since you asked, the Smuggler would need to go away to fund a new bike.