Edelweiss Chair and beyond... Alpental , The valley and the rest of snocrummy

[CHAIR_97]

I sincerely hope there isn't any grunt-cam involved here.

Pm incoming

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[waveshello]

Attachment 473926


Im hoping that maybe blewett will be in play the second half of next week when i have some time off work. I can always hope.

Bring your rock skis [emoji51]

[Stairmaster]

I heard a rumor that Chair 2 will not be running this season. Mainly due to the new footers being built and the cable having to be dropped.

Please tell me this a dumb rumor [emoji24]

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[californiagrown]

I heard a rumor that Chair 2 will not be running this season. Mainly due to the new footers being built and the cable having to be dropped.

Please tell me this a dumb rumor [emoji24]

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I would be shocked if that was the case. If so, they will be absolutely inundated with season pass refund demands.

[AK47bp]

I heard a rumor that Chair 2 will not be running this season. Mainly due to the new footers being built and the cable having to be dropped.

Please tell me this a dumb rumor [emoji24]

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That’s not funny.

I have a pit in stomach now and hope you are wrong.

[waveshello]

Don't think so, unless they just dropped the cable this week? They've been using chair 2 to access the upper mountain.

[Dromond]

That is an outcome so insane that I would discount it immediately if this were any other place

[Power_Sauce]

Hope this isn’t true, but if you’re allowed to skin up from the top of Armstrong it might not be all bad. Probably an equal amount of time on an average weekend anymore.


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[AK47bp]

Hope this isn’t true, but if you’re allowed to skin up from the top of Armstrong it might not be all bad. Probably an equal amount of time on an average weekend anymore.


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Doubt they would allow it unless patrol could get up there for avy control.

[BaseFloopy]

No way. This has to be fake news.

[californiagrown]

It doesnt make any sense that new footings would cause the cable needing to be dropped from the existing chair. However, i am all for continuing this salacious rumor. Chair 2 is closed for 23/24! All the hordes will get is Armstong and Sessel!!


Personally i really think they should make Chair 2 a mandatory beacon check like at Schlasmans at Bridger.

[Buster Highmen]

Personally i really think they should make Chair 2 a mandatory beacon check like at Schlasmans at Bridger.

Hi Mr. Scopic ,

Thanks so much for taking the time to write up and send a comment. I always have an opportunity to learn when I truly listen to the thoughts and perspective of others.
I’m copying the Guest Services Director and also the Patrol Assistant Director. B and I have both had our roles include Snow Safety management at A in our past.
I’ll apologize in advance for any grammatical errors and I hope the message itself comes through.

>>>>

Likelihood to Recommend: 2

Overall Satisfaction: 2

Additional Feedback: The BC gate access policy is stupid. First, I can't get the online form to work. Second, the policy encourages rope ducking. Third, the virtual permissions card does nothing to protect users in the bc and provides a flimsy and hopefully inadequate liability protection.

If you're going to have a policy, require beacons, shovels, probes and partners like any other sane bc access policy.

<<<<

For clarification, we are discussing access to the Alpental Back Bowls, and in this instance I’m going to respectfully disagree with your stated position.
That terrain is managed in a somewhat unique fashion due to the complex nature of the terrain, and the desire to leave it uncluttered by ropes and signs; even hazard marking. It is also quite rugged and steep, with hundreds of individual avalanche prone slopes from very small to quite large.
It’s very important to try and prepare guests for what they will encounter before they find themselves at a gate. Often their companions have a fairly limited understanding of how to manage exposure to truly expert terrain. Being the best skier or rider is not always equal to being the best partner.

I have been to many, many commercial ski and snowboard operations and I think we have one of the most well considered and respectful programs.

I’ll apologize for your troubles on the technology front. If this continues to escape your successful compliance I’m fully willing to set up a link so you can just sign the waiver and we will issue you a registration.

I don’t want to skip the importance of the opportunity for some really valuable information though. The video is intended to be required to watch prior to agreeing to conditions of use. To put a fine point on it, that terrain has significant potential to get an unprepared rider in trouble. That’s the real point of doing our permissions in this way. We get the opportunity to educate our users on the importance of not just rescue tools, but the need for training, practice, and appropriate partners.
None of the gear matters if you don’t ski or ride with someone who takes it seriously.
We may at some point install a beacon checkpoint at the gates so patrollers can watch for folks who choose not to carry. But really, that’s just another opportunity for a chat. As I’ve heard patrollers at other resorts say, please carry a beacon so we can more easily find your remains. That sounds harsh, and that’s not me talking, but as a higher level user I’m sure you’re aware that your only real chance of rescue in the event of a full burial is from within your party, or another nearby group or individual. Organized rescue after a call for help is often just too late.

But we run into many customers who are willing to accept the risk of riding alone, and tell us to stay out of their choices as adults. Not quite the same as the helmet argument, but I have a friend who only skis at Summit West who is continually lobbying the resort to create a helmet required policy for every customer, and enforce it. I will not dive any deeper into freedom of choices, I’m sure you have heard similar discussions.
One last point, the Back Bowls are not the backcountry. They do contain many similar hazards and we have attempted to retain much of the attraction of open and natural terrain, but there are distinct differences. It requires special management to properly address those differences.
Much as other specialized zones, like Terrain Parks, it’s important for the area operator to communicate to the users the value added, and also other distinctions. And I feel somewhat vindicated when positive feedback far outweighs the negative, which it continually does. A couple avalanche education providers use our policy as an exercise in challenging students to think about hazards and choices in a different light. What it means to accept risk, and how extremely important decision making is. Rescue is actually a relatively small piece of group safety. Conversely, route selection, travel techniques, and preparation contribute a great deal more to a successful trip.
Thanks again for your comments. I was involved in the creation of this policy over 30 years ago.
We have picked it apart at least a dozen times over the years and considered virtually every alternative. We have had it scrutinized by top industry risk specialists and it always comes down to how we can do our best to provide access and our best to protect customers. Requiring 3 pieces of rescue gear is great. We certainly want everyone to carry. You must agree though, just a flashing light from a beacon checker at a gate wouldn’t ensure very much. Trying to engage a safety mindset is a step up. I appreciate your reminder that our customer is changing. Years ago it was a considerably smaller user group and their skills were generally much more advanced. Thanks for listening.

[californiagrown]

Hi Mr. Scopic ,

Thanks so much for taking the time to write up and send a comment. I always have an opportunity to learn when I truly listen to the thoughts and perspective of others.
I’m copying the Guest Services Director and also the Patrol Assistant Director. B and I have both had our roles include Snow Safety management at A in our past.
I’ll apologize in advance for any grammatical errors and I hope the message itself comes through.

>>>>

Likelihood to Recommend: 2

Overall Satisfaction: 2

Additional Feedback: The BC gate access policy is stupid. First, I can't get the online form to work. Second, the policy encourages rope ducking. Third, the virtual permissions card does nothing to protect users in the bc and provides a flimsy and hopefully inadequate liability protection.

If you're going to have a policy, require beacons, shovels, probes and partners like any other sane bc access policy.

<<<<

For clarification, we are discussing access to the Alpental Back Bowls, and in this instance I’m going to respectfully disagree with your stated position.
That terrain is managed in a somewhat unique fashion due to the complex nature of the terrain, and the desire to leave it uncluttered by ropes and signs; even hazard marking. It is also quite rugged and steep, with hundreds of individual avalanche prone slopes from very small to quite large.
It’s very important to try and prepare guests for what they will encounter before they find themselves at a gate. Often their companions have a fairly limited understanding of how to manage exposure to truly expert terrain. Being the best skier or rider is not always equal to being the best partner.

I have been to many, many commercial ski and snowboard operations and I think we have one of the most well considered and respectful programs.

I’ll apologize for your troubles on the technology front. If this continues to escape your successful compliance I’m fully willing to set up a link so you can just sign the waiver and we will issue you a registration.

I don’t want to skip the importance of the opportunity for some really valuable information though. The video is intended to be required to watch prior to agreeing to conditions of use. To put a fine point on it, that terrain has significant potential to get an unprepared rider in trouble. That’s the real point of doing our permissions in this way. We get the opportunity to educate our users on the importance of not just rescue tools, but the need for training, practice, and appropriate partners.
None of the gear matters if you don’t ski or ride with someone who takes it seriously.
We may at some point install a beacon checkpoint at the gates so patrollers can watch for folks who choose not to carry. But really, that’s just another opportunity for a chat. As I’ve heard patrollers at other resorts say, please carry a beacon so we can more easily find your remains. That sounds harsh, and that’s not me talking, but as a higher level user I’m sure you’re aware that your only real chance of rescue in the event of a full burial is from within your party, or another nearby group or individual. Organized rescue after a call for help is often just too late.

But we run into many customers who are willing to accept the risk of riding alone, and tell us to stay out of their choices as adults. Not quite the same as the helmet argument, but I have a friend who only skis at Summit West who is continually lobbying the resort to create a helmet required policy for every customer, and enforce it. I will not dive any deeper into freedom of choices, I’m sure you have heard similar discussions.
One last point, the Back Bowls are not the backcountry. They do contain many similar hazards and we have attempted to retain much of the attraction of open and natural terrain, but there are distinct differences. It requires special management to properly address those differences.
Much as other specialized zones, like Terrain Parks, it’s important for the area operator to communicate to the users the value added, and also other distinctions. And I feel somewhat vindicated when positive feedback far outweighs the negative, which it continually does. A couple avalanche education providers use our policy as an exercise in challenging students to think about hazards and choices in a different light. What it means to accept risk, and how extremely important decision making is. Rescue is actually a relatively small piece of group safety. Conversely, route selection, travel techniques, and preparation contribute a great deal more to a successful trip.
Thanks again for your comments. I was involved in the creation of this policy over 30 years ago.
We have picked it apart at least a dozen times over the years and considered virtually every alternative. We have had it scrutinized by top industry risk specialists and it always comes down to how we can do our best to provide access and our best to protect customers. Requiring 3 pieces of rescue gear is great. We certainly want everyone to carry. You must agree though, just a flashing light from a beacon checker at a gate wouldn’t ensure very much. Trying to engage a safety mindset is a step up. I appreciate your reminder that our customer is changing. Years ago it was a considerably smaller user group and their skills were generally much more advanced. Thanks for listening.

Thats good background on the backbowls policy ...i just wanted the beacon check to reduce the lift line back to manageable levels.

[Buster Highmen]

Thats good background on the backbowls policy ...i just wanted the beacon check to reduce the lift line back to manageable levels.

OK, I was more interested in a beacon check for the safety of others.

[californiagrown]

OK, I was more interested in a beacon check for the safety of others.

Thats cause you're a better man than me.

[Buster Highmen]

Thats cause you're a better man than me.

We are both at least being honest, huh?

Well, that and I always bring avie gear and only get stopped by a lack of the stupid qr code.

[californiagrown]

Welp the padded seats still appear to be hanging:

[3pin]

I heard a rumor that Chair 2 will not be running this season. Mainly due to the new footers being built and the cable having to be dropped.

Please tell me this a dumb rumor [emoji24]

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They just posted a photo on FB of a snowy Chair 2 with chairs on it. It seems highly unlikely that they’d be building new footers or dropping the cable at any point from now on.


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[Stairmaster]

They just posted a photo on FB of a snowy Chair 2 with chairs on it. It seems highly unlikely that they’d be building new footers or dropping the cable at any point from now on.


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>Be me
>Dreaming of deep days off the padded seats
>Hear dumb fucking rumor about Chair 2 not opening this winter
>Panik
>Immediately email summit at Snoqualmie
>Nice lady says that's a dumb rumor and chair 2 will be open all season for the boys.
>Kalm

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[AK47bp]

Toying with my emotions.

I didn’t realize how bad my mental health was tied to a fucking chairlift.

[Stairmaster]

Toying with my emotions.

I didn’t realize how bad my mental health was tied to a fucking chairlift.

You might be an Alpenholic. But seriously I almost shit a brick when I heard the rumor.

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[BaseFloopy]

Oh thank goodness! I was having this recurring nightmare of roving bands of angry Alpentolics showing up to crustal and schralping/slashing all the pow whilst simultaneously using their ski edges to slice the jugulars of my unsuspecting country club brethren. Afterwards, rounding up our women and taking them back to some kind of pagan ritual at their fire pits where our stolen skis fed the flames.

[AK47bp]

Oh thank goodness! I was having this recurring nightmare of roving bands of angry Alpentolics showing up to crustal and schralping/slashing all the pow whilst simultaneously using their ski edges to slice the jugulars of my unsuspecting country club brethren. Afterwards, rounding up our women and taking them back to some kind of pagan ritual at their fire pits where our stolen skis fed the flames.

Still might.

[snoqpass]

The top terminal for the new chair is up on Knoll 1 ish

[snoqpass]