If only there was something we could do...

[J. Barron DeJong]

https://twitter.com/shannonrwatts/st...sR_NcRK2VkCfkg

[J. Barron DeJong]

It’s a polite society.



https://twitter.com/well_regulated_/...sR_NcRK2VkCfkg

[skaredshtles]

It’s a polite society.



https://twitter.com/well_regulated_/...sR_NcRK2VkCfkg

I blame the cartels.

[SumJongGuy]

Dipshit looks at gun deaths maps to see most in rural mountain areas and concludes that rural people only kill themselves when depressed. Urban people kill others. I submit to you El Paso, Uvalde, Fort Hood, and this week New Mexico..

[leroy jenkins]

Two kids killed by lighting in 2022 - https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning_fatalities22

1,676 kids killed by guns in 2002 - https://www.verifythis.com/article/n...f-b5e3e47aa639

Can't wait for the whataboutism reply.....

I said school shootings. "kids" in general includes gang shootings.

You're more than twice as likely to get struck by lighting as die in a school shooting. That is correct.

Lets take a look, 10 years of school shootings, 356 deaths. https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2019...hootings-trnd/

Chances of getting struck by lighting in ones entire lifetime, 1 in 15k. https://www.bing.com/search?q=chance...3f1f4a4e5e982b

So 356 out of current US population 332 million is pretty close to one in a million. This math isn't perfect, I couldn't find a stat for total number of school shooting deaths in all US history, can you? Kindof hard to calculate chances of dying in a school shooting in ones entire life, but over the course of a lifetime its roughly one in a million. But its obviously way less than half the people who get struck by lightning.

[SumJongGuy]

All the kids killed by bullets were the result of a failure on some level by a totally legal gun owner. None of these guns that kill kids, suicide, street crime, or public massacres/schools/malls/etc were done by someone who forged the steel to make their own gun. It all started with a legally owned and likely legally sold gun that went rogue due to either being unsecured (stolen) or outright misused by the fully legal owner.. THE NUMBER ONE CAUSE OF DEATH IN CHILDREN TODAY. People like leroy who fight common sense gun control measures. The blood is on your hands.

[leroy jenkins]

Two kids killed by lighting in 2022 - https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning_fatalities22

1,676 kids killed by guns in 2002 - https://www.verifythis.com/article/n...f-b5e3e47aa639

Can't wait for the whataboutism reply.....

I clicked your link and the link it contained.

Did you read it? It makes no distinction between school shootings and gang shootings involving multiple victims.

So yea, like 300 something people die in school shootings a decade.

Cops are killing a couple thousand a year. Your link also makes no distinction how many of those are minors. Also, around 1200 a year are killed in valid self defense shootings. No indication given how many of those are minors and make up some of the overall numbers of mortality of minors.

Still it is interesting data, but could absolutely be better differentiated. There absolutely is a problem with violence in this country.

[leroy jenkins]

All the kids killed by bullets were the result of a failure on some level by a totally legal gun owner. None of these guns that kill kids, suicide, street crime, or public massacres/schools/malls/etc were done by someone who forged the steel to make their own gun. It all started with a legally owned and likely legally sold gun that went rogue due to either being unsecured (stolen) or outright misused by the fully legal owner.. THE NUMBER ONE CAUSE OF DEATH IN CHILDREN TODAY. People like leroy who fight common sense gun control measures. The blood is on your hands.

No minors are ever killed in legit self defense shootings, or by cops whether wrongfully or rightly? Seriously? you believe that? No 17 year olds every possibly attack cops or other people? What world do you live in?

Like I get there is a problem, but to think its absolutely impossible anyone would ever need to defend themselves from a 17 year old is just not reality. The youngest serial killer was what, like 9? There is enough of aproblem you dont need to misconstrue reality to a bpd level of binary thinking to make it worse,

[Peruvian]

All the kids killed by bullets were the result of a failure on some level by a totally legal gun owner. None of these guns that kill kids, suicide, street crime, or public massacres/schools/malls/etc were done by someone who forged the steel to make their own gun. It all started with a legally owned and likely legally sold gun that went rogue due to either being unsecured (stolen) or outright misused by the fully legal owner.. THE NUMBER ONE CAUSE OF DEATH IN CHILDREN TODAY. People like leroy who fight common sense gun control measures. The blood is on your hands.

Yup - I'm sorry I went down the rabbit hole with leroy. He feels his rights are more important than kindergartners' lives, so I'm done with him. I need to take a shower.

[leroy jenkins]

Yup - I'm sorry I went down the rabbit hole with leroy. He feels his rights are more important than kindergartners' lives, so I'm done with him. I need to take a shower.

Never said that. Absolute strawman.

Listen you guys obviously have some ground to stand on with your beliefs violence is a problem and guns are a part of that, but that is a reason NOT to distort reality with misconstrued stats. You have enough of a point you should be able to argue it based in the reality that actually exists.

[MagnificentUnicorn]

“I’m the King of Gaslighting”
-Leroy Jenkins


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Cisco Kid]

Sure you did Leroy. You don't think you did but you did.

I think the GQP or NRA should award posthumous medals to children who sacrificed their life defending 2A

[CarlMega]

My bias is showing: but aside from children killed in school shootings, there are non-fatal wounded victims and, personally, I'd argue that sphere of victims and traumatized kids extends out quite a bit. Getting spattered with your friend's brain from a headshot = "not hit? not killed? glad you're fine! walk it off over to the lavatory to clean up"

But, hey, let's arguable about probability of lightening strikes over one's lifetime.

[Cisco Kid]

Maybe award the mentally and physically wounded the equivilent of a Combat Infantry Badge.

[Ted Striker]

You're right Leroy, your math is terrible. US gov says approx 50 million public school kids. Last year 40 were killed at school and 100 injured in school shootings. K-12 is thirteen years. So if that number is static, 520 will be in their graves instead of graduation. So the experience of attending grade school in America has a chance of execution by bullet of 1 in 100k

Additionally, your assertion that "300 something people die in school shootings a decade" is rendered irrelevant by the trend.

[californiagrown]

I bet if we made gun ownership like a video game, a lot of problems would be solved. You start out only being able to buy a musket or blunderbuss, and if you want access to more guns you must complete training challenges which open up access to more bigger, badder, cooler guns. E.g. if you want access to a double barrel break action 20 gauge shotgun, all you have to do is take a hunters safety course and a 4 hour wilderness first aid course. But if you want an AR15, then you have to score 400 on the Army's physical fitness test, take 40 hours of tactical strategery classroom courses, 16 hours of firearm and self defense law classses, and 40 hours of practical field courses with a live-fire competency test at the end.

[CarlMega]

Oh yeah, there you go again, using data. I'm on to you. Now do something we can control - like weather.

[J. Barron DeJong]

I bet if we made gun ownership like a video game, a lot of problems would be solved. You start out only being able to buy a musket or blunderbuss, and if you want access to more guns you must complete training challenges which open up access to more bigger, badder, cooler guns. E.g. if you want access to a double barrel break action 20 gauge shotgun, all you have to do is take a hunters safety course and a 4 hour wilderness first aid course. But if you want an AR15, then you have to score 400 on the Army's physical fitness test, take 40 hours of tactical strategery classroom courses, 16 hours of firearm and self defense law classses, and 40 hours of practical field courses with a live-fire competency test at the end.

I don’t think I’ve said it here, but if people can’t tolerate a full ban on assault weapons because of gun enthusiasts, then I think I could accept something less than a full ban.

But, you’re going to have to prove you’re an enthusiast, and a responsible one. So you will have needed to be a gun owner in good standing for many years, go through regular training/licensing, mental health evaluation, higher bar to avoid red flag laws, proper storage (weapon and ammo locked separately),etc. If you’re a true enthusiast, have a real passion, then those sound like hurdles you’d be willing to clear, but it would keep 18-25 year olds from just heading to the shop to pick one up.

[PNWbrit]

If you’re a true enthusiast, have a real passion

Nah.

Fuck 'em.

[SumJongGuy]

No minors are ever killed in legit self defense shootings, or by cops whether wrongfully or rightly?

The only way there is a legit self defense shooting of a child is if the attacker has a gun.. so right there is a gun that started out as a totally legal gun somewhere that has now caused the death of a child.. perhaps the person holding it in this instance. Your debate skills suck.

[californiagrown]

I don’t think I’ve said it here, but if people can’t tolerate a full ban on assault weapons because of gun enthusiasts, then I think I could accept something less than a full ban.

But, you’re going to have to prove you’re an enthusiast, and a responsible one. So you will have needed to be a gun owner in good standing for many years, go through regular training/licensing, mental health evaluation, higher bar to avoid red flag laws, proper storage (weapon and ammo locked separately),etc. If you’re a true enthusiast, have a real passion, then those sound like hurdles you’d be willing to clear, but it would keep 18-25 year olds from just heading to the shop to pick one up.

with great power, comes great responsibility. Except in America where great power is just a quick swipe of the credit card at the gun store away!

[toast2266]

I don’t think I’ve said it here, but if people can’t tolerate a full ban on assault weapons because of gun enthusiasts, then I think I could accept something less than a full ban.

But, you’re going to have to prove you’re an enthusiast, and a responsible one. So you will have needed to be a gun owner in good standing for many years, go through regular training/licensing, mental health evaluation, higher bar to avoid red flag laws, proper storage (weapon and ammo locked separately),etc. If you’re a true enthusiast, have a real passion, then those sound like hurdles you’d be willing to clear, but it would keep 18-25 year olds from just heading to the shop to pick one up.

Shouldn't matter if you're an enthusiast or not. Per the 2A, what matters is that you're a dedicated member of a well regulated militia. So if you want access to whatever guns you want, you're gonna have to go through (and pass) basic training. 10 weeks. Run a bunch with heavy packs. Lots of weapons training. Etc. Do all that, and sure, you can go buy whatever guns you want.

If you don't want to do all that, then you're not a useful member of a well regulated militia and therefore you are not benefitting the security of the state. You can apply for a permit to get a bolt action rifle for hunting.

[byates1]

I don’t think I’ve said it here, but if people can’t tolerate a full ban on assault weapons because of gun enthusiasts, then I think I could accept something less than a full ban.

But, you’re going to have to prove you’re an enthusiast, and a responsible one. So you will have needed to be a gun owner in good standing for many years, go through regular training/licensing, mental health evaluation, higher bar to avoid red flag laws, proper storage (weapon and ammo locked separately),etc. If you’re a true enthusiast, have a real passion, then those sound like hurdles you’d be willing to clear, but it would keep 18-25 year olds from just heading to the shop to pick one up.

Yeah good luck w that.

[J. Barron DeJong]

Shouldn't matter if you're an enthusiast or not. Per the 2A, what matters is that you're a dedicated member of a well regulated militia. So if you want access to whatever guns you want, you're gonna have to go through (and pass) basic training. 10 weeks. Run a bunch with heavy packs. Lots of weapons training. Etc. Do all that, and sure, you can go buy whatever guns you want.

If you don't want to do all that, then you're not a useful member of a well regulated militia and therefore you are not benefitting the security of the state. You can apply for a permit to get a bolt action rifle for hunting.

I could accept something like that too. Or, make both routes available.

Point is, very high bar to obtain, and keep, assault style weapons. Handguns too.

That assumes a compromise like that would be acceptable, but I haven’t seen any suggestion that a certain group of lawmakers is interested in anything other than loosening current laws.

[SumJongGuy]