Intuition liners

[icelanticskier]

On my 3rd set of intuitions. The most recent only having undergone a partial mold with the hot-rice sock method. Snuggest fit intitially, but better that the two previous heat-molded liners after about 10 days.

Full-tilt was saying "molding optional" on their intuition liners for a while, which I think translates to "if you insist, but you might be better served by just skiing in them". IMO, unless a person has a big-ol 6th toe, or heel spurs, or some other non-conformity, no-mold will work just fine, but proper molding shouldn't cause undo compression, or shrinkage either, so "whatever the customer wants".

Also IMO, Re-molding several times will have undesireable consequences, no matter how good you are as a fitter.

Did I just agree with Rog?

You are a smart cookie

My good friend who works for intuition doesn't mold his or his better half's liners either.
They ski them in.

I just did a mold for a customer with a very happy outcome. Biz is now up 25% over last year.

Rog

[nickwm21]

I never molded mine in my fulltilts... the boots have over 300 days on them now and are starting to fall apart. Liners are still good....

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using TGR Forums

[icelanticskier]

^^^^^^^^no mold=they love you long time

rog

[XXX-er]

http://www.fischersports.com/en/Alpi...hts/VACUUM-FIT

hey rog you gona mold these ?

[DudeLebowSKI]

http://www.fischersports.com/en/Alpi...hts/VACUUM-FIT

hey rog you gona mold these ?

I have the RC4 Vacuums with Intuitions. Best fitting combo ever. I voluntarily suffered for years, cramming my feet into downsized low volume Langes but this is the tightest fitting combo I`ve ever had and I can wear them fully clamped all day.

[XXX-er]

I am asking if buddy is gona mold THE boot, I am just gona go ahead & assume he wouldn't mold an intution liner in that boot...you didn't mold the liner did you ?

[bendtheski]

my goal is to have the tightest shell fit possible so that the boot performance isn't dependent on the liner.

Nonsense. Liner performance is an integral component of boot performance, regardless of how tight your shell fit.

Don't believe me? Try running the softest liner intuition makes, even in a properly fitted shell, and tell me it doesn't effect the way the boot performs, or the stiffest liner for that matter.

Shell fit is important, but based on my somewhat brief stint as a boot fitter, about 90% of average skiers find a "correct" shell sizing, as defined by every manufacturer fitting demo I've ever attended, to be way too fucking tight. That same 90% will insist that they belong in at least one full shell size bigger than what you know they belong in, based on your training and own experience, but good luck convincing that 90% otherwise.

Maybe 10% get it, and will either follow your advice, and let you sell/fit them in the right size, or ask for the right size specifically. The other 90% will insist on the "comfort" fit, and trash you and your shop for any discomfort they experience in the correct shell size, and insist you didn't know what you were doing, selling them too small a boot.

After a while you get sick of exchanging boots that have already been molded and skied in for the next size up, and being told you don't know what you're talking about. Just give the rubes what they want; a boot that's too big for them, that when, if by some fluke they actually begin to seek performance, they will wish they had downsized, and may try to compensate for by purchasing an aftermarket liner that takes up more space. Either way, as the boot fitter, it's your fault they 're uncomfortable, or aren't getting the performance they wanted, and you better fix it, or they will trash you and your shop to anyone who'll listen.

/rant/ blog

[Wild4umlauts]

Nonsense. Liner performance is an integral component of boot performance, regardless of how tight your shell fit.

Don't believe me? Try running the softest liner intuition makes, even in a properly fitted shell, and tell me it doesn't effect the way the boot performs, or the stiffest liner for that matter.

Shell fit is important, but based on my somewhat brief stint as a boot fitter, about 90% of average skiers find a "correct" shell sizing, as defined by every manufacturer fitting demo I've ever attended, to be way too fucking tight. That same 90% will insist that they belong in at least one full shell size bigger than what you know they belong in, based on your training and own experience, but good luck convincing that 90% otherwise.

Maybe 10% get it, and will either follow your advice, and let you sell/fit them in the right size, or ask for the right size specifically. The other 90% will insist on the "comfort" fit, and trash you and your shop for any discomfort they experience in the correct shell size, and insist you didn't know what you were doing, selling them too small a boot.

After a while you get sick of exchanging boots that have already been molded and skied in for the next size up, and being told you don't know what you're talking about. Just give the rubes what they want; a boot that's too big for them, that when, if by some fluke they actually begin to seek performance, they will wish they had downsized, and may try to compensate for by purchasing an aftermarket liner that takes up more space. Either way, as the boot fitter, it's your fault they 're uncomfortable, or aren't getting the performance they wanted, and you better fix it, or they will trash you and your shop to anyone who'll listen.

/rant/ blog

I absolutely agree with everything you posted. I didn't mean to imply that the liner isn't part of the performance of the boot, but if you have a poor shell fit and try to make up for that with the liner, then you are most likely destined for problems for the life of the setup. That's what I was trying to get at.

[bendtheski]

Oh yeah, got it.
It's just kind of funny to me; people avoid a performance fit in favor of comfort, and IME get neither.

[PlayItLeo]

Think I jonged myself last night - after the jong move of leaving my boots in the back of the truck after skiing on Saturday, I further jonged myself by throwing my boots by the floor board heater on the way to the hill. Well, I guess one of them was too close to the heater because as I slipped my boots on in the lot one of them seemd to have gotten hot enough to partially un-mold itself The tongue was all soft and puffy like when I initially molded them and the fit in the forefoot was sloppy as hell, heel hold was still money though. Thought about standing still in the lot to try and let them reform, but the lift was only spinning for another hour and there was 8" of soft chop to shred, so I buckled them up and hit the hill.

I wouldn't have thought they could get hot enough from the truck heater to un-mold, but guess I was wrong. Probably going to have to re-bake that one boot (will be the third cook).

Haven't read through the whole thread, but has this happened to anyone else? Common knowledge?

[skimaxpower]

^ bummer dude. I haven't heard of this before, but I have heard of people putting boots on a heated boot dryer and accidentally remolding the liners. I'm always careful to make sure my boot dryer is set to "no heat" mode.

Ski them once more before re-baking. You might find that the newly molded liner actually fits better, since you had the rare opportunity to mold it to your foot while actually skiing.

[EEC]

Looking like a pair of power tongues are going to be in my near future to help stiffen up, improve heel hold and hopefully take up some volume in the calf of my cochise pros. Would be nice to have warm feet too

I wouldn't have thought they could get hot enough from the truck heater to un-mold, but guess I was wrong. Probably going to have to re-bake that one boot (will be the third cook).

Haven't read through the whole thread, but has this happened to anyone else? Common knowledge?

I did this to a pair of intuitions that came stock in kryptons a couple years ago, was trying to dry out the liners on the way to the resort, stuffed my feet in them and they felt so nice and warm yet suspiciously soft/puffy. Decided to ignore it and go skiing anyways...the fit definitely got sloppy after that. I never tried re-baking as the shells were too big anyways, I just sucked it up for the season and got new boots over the summer.

[PlayItLeo]

stuffed my feet in them and they felt so nice and warm yet suspiciously soft

Yep, the instant I put my feet in I was like, "oh fuck". Felt good, but I knew it was no bueno.

Ski them once more before re-baking. You might find that the newly molded liner actually fits better, since you had the rare opportunity to mold it to your foot while actually skiing.

I'll definitely give em one more day (I was heavily kushed last night when I hit the hill, so my perception of my feet may not have been at the highest level)
All that moving around and walking to the lift can't have been good, though. Pretty much the exact opposite of standing still for 10 min while the liners cool.

[gramboh]

Do most people pull out their liners every day to dry out? I have sweaty feet and ski in a damp climate. They are in overlap boots and I feel like I am damaging the liners pulling them out/putting them in (even pulling the plastic open as far as I can at the instep).

The tongues on my Luxury's are turning a bit blue, not sure if it's from my shells or moisture?

[Gripen]

Do most people pull out their liners every day to dry out? I have sweaty feet and ski in a damp climate. They are in overlap boots and I feel like I am damaging the liners pulling them out/putting them in (even pulling the plastic open as far as I can at the instep).

The tongues on my Luxury's are turning a bit blue, not sure if it's from my shells or moisture?

I pull mine out every night but I have the same issue with then getting wedged in the Shell sometimes.

[nyskirat]

I do the same. So far, no issues, but its only been a month

[Meadow Skipper]

Do most people pull out their liners every day to dry out? I have sweaty feet and ski in a damp climate. They are in overlap boots and I feel like I am damaging the liners pulling them out/putting them in (even pulling the plastic open as far as I can at the instep).

Make a shoe horn out of a one gallon water jug or a 2 liter soda bottle - that might help you slip the liner back in.

[skuff]

So everything gets dry after skiing, I take my liners out of the shells and footbeds out of the liners every time. If I don't, they'll still be wet the next day and smell kind of funky.

[old goat]

I contacted Intuition and was told it wouldn't hurt the liners to remove daily. I do it every few days--depending on how wet the snow is (leaky boots)

[Wild4umlauts]

I remove my liners every time. They don't seem any worse for the wear over the years of doing this.

[gramboh]

Thanks guys, been removing liners and footbeds daily the past couple of weeks. They dry within a few hours and it helps keep the stink down for sure. After about 10 days on my Luxury they seem to have settled as I've ratcheted my top two buckles one setting. Super happy with these.

[bones get broke]

Question for the masses:
I'm replacing the liners in a set of Sally Quest 14s (should have done it a long time ago because the stock liners are the suck) and I'm torn between the Luxery liners and one of the wrap liner options. First, the quests are a 100mm last wich is a bit wide for my narrow foot so I'm wondering if I should go with the high or medium volume if I get the luxurys. I also tend to get shin bang (shin splints) from time to time, hence the interest in the wrap liners so my question is, do the wrap liners help with shin bang or does it matter.

For reference, I wear a size 13 or 14 street shoe and a mondo 29.0 bootie and desire as snug of a fit as I can get.

Thanks mags

[opusak]

I replaced some beat ZipFits in my Titans last year with some medium volume PowerWraps. They did not take up enough volume and I got shin bang. Replaced those with the high volume Luxury..., much better fit and no shin bang (so far). I tried on the high volume PowerWrap and the Luxury just fit better. The Luxury tours better as well. Your mileage may very..., and my shin bang was due to a high-speed crash with no eject, I don't usually have shin bang issues.

[Lindahl]

Powerwraps are really low volume in the leg compared to Intuition tongue liners. There's no way I could ever get one to work in certain boots.

[icelanticskier]

Question for the masses:
I'm replacing the liners in a set of Sally Quest 14s (should have done it a long time ago because the stock liners are the suck) and I'm torn between the Luxery liners and one of the wrap liner options. First, the quests are a 100mm last wich is a bit wide for my narrow foot so I'm wondering if I should go with the high or medium volume if I get the luxurys. I also tend to get shin bang (shin splints) from time to time, hence the interest in the wrap liners so my question is, do the wrap liners help with shin bang or does it matter.

For reference, I wear a size 13 or 14 street shoe and a mondo 29.0 bootie and desire as snug of a fit as I can get.

Thanks mags

1st thing. get a proper boot for yer foot.

then we'll talk liners

rog