50 years to the day

[summit]

You think the US government is on par with Iran for religious insanity? You think a raw number of churches per ME country carries some meaning? There are a lot of well meaning folks who just cannot fathom the radically different mindsets that exist in this world of ours. Learn about 12er Shia.

You think they are rational actors? Look at how they have acted and are acting. What drives them to base their national policy around international terror and trying to crush a tiny ass nation 1000mi away with two multiple countries inbetween? It ain't cuz the Izzies started shit with them. Their nuclear ambitions aren't about security except in as much as it gives them a free hand to be an aggressor. It is absolutely about religious fervor whether it is at the level of believing they should lead and dominate the Islamic world, or wipe it clean of infidels, or trigger the end times to end the occultation and fulfil the prophecy of the Mahdi.

[highangle]

You are a really smart guy. School me about Muslim v Jewish armed conflicts prior to 1945 or 1845 and 1045

You know it all bro. Shitpost me something on tensor decomposition algos in llm topologies.

[summit]

If years ago, someone said bin Laden was a radical religious monster who needed to be put down, the mindset exhibited by some here would be "what about the Christian fundie fucktards want to teach creation and ban abortion!"

Whataboutism is almost automatic. It is possible to have a scale that goes from bad to worse. Different problems have different solutions.

But one thing is for sure:

The bad thing does not excuse the worse thing, much less invalidate its dangers.

[highangle]

I disagree with too many Democrats on this whole ME thing, find them reactionary and far too willing to accept not only Palestine's unsound methods, but their river-to-the-sea metaphysic, however sanewashed or dankly-memed.

[highangle]

They're fucking horrible warmongers. How do people countenance that?

[Bunion 2020]

So tolerant of differing viewpoints..... /S

[Cisco Kid]

Summit. I'm a big time RC so I follow the RC's in the Trump government. There is a faction if Catholics in power that believe the goal and end game is to kill all the Muzzies until they accept Jesus Christ a Savior and Son of God. . Bill Barr is one. Steve Bannon is another believer. Knights Templar ring a bell? So please don't think I'm just pulling stuff out of my ass. Time for me to start the Ask a Catholic thread soon. PR or PA?

[highangle]

So tolerant of differing viewpoints..... /S

Yeah Im intolerant of shoddy work and faulty logic too. Theres a lot of good evidence its bad, so it might take a lot to change my heart on the subjects.

[Bunion 2020]

What if no one cares enough about you or your opinions to want to bother? Asking for a friend.

[highangle]

Ive fucked a few cowgirls, and make excellent points.

[MultiVerse]

The Mullahs' nuclear weapons program is not analogous to Saddam's dismantled post Desert Storm Gulf War program. A better analogy for the Islamic Republic of Iran's nuclear weapon program is with North Korea's nuclear weapons program.

In 1992, North Korea signed a comprehensive safeguards agreement with the IAEA, allowing inspections of declared nuclear facilities. In 1994, North Korea and the United States signed the Agreed Framework, under which North Korea agreed to freeze its plutonium program in exchange for energy assistance and light-water reactors. In 2003, multilateral talks (Six-Party Talks) were held in an attempt to halt North Korea's nuclear weapons program.

In 2006 despite inspections, international pressure, sanctions and the rest North Korea completed its first nuclear bomb test saying was a necessary step to counter the "nuclear threat" from the US and other countries.

[LongShortLong]

If you're trying to make out an Iranian bomb as a great threat, perhaps North Korea is a bad example. Almost 20 years since and their international relations are about the same. No bombing campaigns, no invasions, no occupations. Maybe Israel is a better example https://www.dw.com/en/fact-check-vir...eal/a-72968972. They got the bomb, and regularly bomb their neighbors, invade their neighbors, and lead occupations. Though again arguably Israel did that before the bomb too. Maybe the bomb isn't the big boogey man some think it is.

Israel's destruction of civilian infrastructure is so severe, it's regularly removed from internet platforms for violating terms of service. Having Israel as a neighbor is a bigger disaster than the worst earthquakes, tornadoes, or industrial accidents.

[MultiVerse]

North Korea know-nothing apologist joins the chat. The rapid brain-wilting descent of already dim people from losing a foreign policy argument is a weird phenomenon. Might as well be mini-me Tucker Carlsons' at this point.

Because all those so called neighbors who got bombed tried to destroy the world’s only Jewish State. Look at the fate of Hezbollah, Bashar al Assad, the Sinwar family, the leadership of the IRGC and ask yourself: was it worth it? Israel isn’t going anywhere. But where is Ismail Haniyeh? Where is Hassan Nasrallah? Where is the IRGC's leadership?

Meanwhile Jordan and Egypt, who also tried in the past to destroy Israel, made peace with Israel and they've benefited as a result.

[highangle]

If you're trying to make out an Iranian bomb as a great threat, perhaps North Korea is a bad example. Almost 20 years since and their international relations are about the same. No bombing campaigns, no invasions, no occupations. Maybe Israel is a better example They got the bomb, and regularly bomb their neighbors, invade their neighbors, and lead occupations.

You think Israel randomly blows the fuck out of shit for no reason?

[MultiVerse]

People arguing North Korea and Revolutionary Iran are better than Israel have lost their minds. This is what it's like in Tehran right now: Pro regime forces are marching through the streets literally praising Hitler and chanting "death to Israel" "death to America," while the average Iranian gets arrested and taken away by the secret police



"Suppressive forces (basijis) are patrolling through the streets, harassing everyone just like in previous uprisings and massacres (2022, 2019).

You can’t walk through streets without facing trouble.

If even one of Khamenei's dogs suspects you and checks your phone, they’ll handcuff you on the spot and take you away.

They accuse you of collaborating with Israel. Why? Because you're happy that the murderers of Mahsa, Nika and Hamidreza (well known victims of the IR) are finally dead.

I spit on the grave of all the so-called 'fellow Iranians' abroad who are trying to keep these bastards in power."

https://x.com/NiohBerg/status/1936394559765770629

[liv2ski]

OPINION
|
Israel-Iran conflict
The real reason Israel attacked Iran

Israel has not struck Iran for all these previously mentioned reasons (see article). So, what drove the attack? Amid the genocidal campaign in Gaza, Netanyahu is very much aware that his government is running out of options. The international community, as well as regional allies, have started to criticise Israel vocally. Some have also been preparing to carry out unilateral measures, like the mass recognition of a Palestinian state.

The International Criminal Court’s warrant of arrest for Netanyahu is looming, and the decision of the International Court of Justice about the legality of Israel’s occupation is waiting to be fulfilled. Israel and its military have continuously carried out massacres, denied them, and have been found to be lying.

There is no doubt that Netanyahu planned the strike on Iran for years, waiting for just the right time. This time came on Friday. It is a desperate attempt to rally the world behind Israel, just as preparations are made to deny it the absolute impunity it has enjoyed since its creation.

Iran is still considered a potential threat by many leading powers of the Global North. By invoking the known tropes associated with unilateral lethal Israeli action – from divine promises to the Holocaust – Netanyahu hoped to re-establish the status quo; Israel can still do whatever it wants.

This is Israel’s current definition of “security”, the most hallowed principle at its core. It is the seemingly apolitical genesis of Israeliness, the site devoted wholly to Jewish supremacy, which is the only “real” way to ensure the integrity of Jewish lives. “Security” means that Israel can kill whoever it wants for as long as it wants and wherever and whenever it wants without paying any sort of price for its actions.

This “security” is what has motivated Israel’s actions from Gaza to Yemen to Lebanon and Syria, and now in Iran. Such a “security regime” must expand continuously, of course. It can never stop. By striking Iran, Netanyahu has gone for broke, staking a claim for complete and absolute impunity for Israel as well as for himself, in The Hague as well as in domestic courts.

Will this be Netanyahu’s salvation? Will the Israeli public forgive him for his abject failures at home and horrid transgressions in Gaza? When observing the current sense of jubilation in public Israeli discourse, this may very well be the case.

https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2...-attacked-iran

Nuttyahoo has been crying wolf about Iran getting nuclear weapon capabilities for at least the last 25 years, so why hit Iran now? To cover his ass, as the article suggests, because the guy is a war criminal. Your opinion may vary.

[S_jenks]

^ not a bad lens to view the conflict through. The domestic politics of Israel are clearly divided, and Bibi’s administration seems to keep upping the ante with its foreign incursions ever since the Oct 7th attack.

A good chunk of the world is fucking pissed at Israel for the scale of destruction it caused in Gaza. But I can also understand the frustrations of the Israel people, who have been living under rocket threat for so long they created an iron dome to live under.

The shittiest part of this is that religion plays a central role in all of this, intertwined through cultures and politics. Israel sits on some of the most sites of the Abrahamic religions, and there has been 1000s of years of spilled blood and grudges. Every shot fired and new death just perpetuates the hatred.

So where can peace even be achieved now there? Is this part of the Middle East doomed to perpetual conflict?


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[highangle]

^ not a bad lens to view the conflict through. The domestic politics of Israel are clearly divided, and Bibi’s administration seems to keep upping the ante with its foreign incursions ever since the Oct 7th attack. A good chunk of the world is fucking pissed at Israel for the scale of destruction it caused in Gaza. But I can also understand the frustrations of the Israel people, who have been living under rocket threat for so long they created an iron dome to live under. The shittiest part of this is that religion plays a central role in all of this, intertwined through cultures and politics. Israel sits on some of the most sites of the Abrahamic religions, and there has been 1000s of years of spilled blood and grudges. Every shot fired and new death just perpetuates the hatred. So where can peace even be achieved now there? Is this part of the Middle East doomed to perpetual conflict? Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

I noped tf out at ...Amid the genocidal campaign in Gaza...

"Is this part of the Middle East doomed to perpetual conflict?"

Bro you must be one of them Original Thinker thinking such original thoughts and asking such original questions? Goddamn I can't for the life of me answer why some other lazy fucking douche hasn't come in here to throw up his hands at the whole MidEast in one stylized way or another?

[S_jenks]

I noped tf out at ...Amid the genocidal campaign in Gaza...

"Is this part of the Middle East doomed to perpetual conflict?"

Bro you must be one of them Original Thinker thinking such original thoughts and asking such original questions? Goddamn I can't for the life of me answer why some other lazy fucking douche hasn't come in here to throw up his hands at the whole MidEast in one stylized way or another?

Take a deep breath. And then post.

It will help.

[highangle]

If you recognized Israels right to exist, Jenks, you might not have to work so hard to make your mundane thinking sound worthwhile.

[MultiVerse]

Contra the editorial/comments above, "Israeli opposition leader Lapid rallies behind Iran operation, after months of criticizing Netanyahu"

It’s a sharp about-face for a constellation of parties that have criticized Netanyahu throughout the war for what they have charged is his politically motivated decision-making.

“It’s not the right moment to do politics,” opposition leader and former Prime Minister Yair Lapid told The Associated Press on Monday in his first international media interview since the start of the operation against Iran.

The latest conflict began when Israel launched an assault on Iran’s top military leaders, uranium enrichment sites and nuclear scientists that it said was necessary to prevent its longtime adversary from getting any closer to building an atomic weapon — which Israel says would pose an existential threat. Iran maintains that its nuclear program is peaceful.

“Yes, this government needs to be toppled, but not in the midst of an existential fight,” Lapid said.

https://apnews.com/article/netanyahu...c6759ee2fbb0d9

[jono]

So it's confirmed again that dog wagging works. Ok.

[MultiVerse]

Another illiterate using words like "confirmed" that he doesn't really understand. But don't take my word for it here's what CNN's Van Jones said about it on the air:

"I think progressives underestimate how dangerous Iran is. Iran is not a normal country. Normal countries don‘t blind women because they showed some hair. They don't empower little gangs and proxies to surround a country and fire rockets and r*pe people."

"They cannot have a bomb ... Because they say death to America, death to Israel and death to all the Jews. One of those should offend you if you're progressives — at least one should offend you."

"We cannot have a nuclear-armed Iran."

[summit]

US bombs the nuclear sites at Fordow, Natanz, and Esfahanz

Nimitz CSG joins Carl Vinson CSG in the CENTCOM AOR adding its air wing and 5 destroyers with 480 VLS cells (which each contain 1-4 missiles).

Iran has been launching more drones at Israel.

We'll now see if Iran wants to escalate by attacking Gulf states oil infrastructure, US bases, or closing Hormuz. There is an absolutely massive US presence in the area to intercept and suppress.

[jono]

Bombs away.