Official ATK Binding Thread

[normie17]

For some yes, for others no.

for all, you sound like you've never skied 0 delta before.

[turnfarmer]

for all, you sound like you've never skied 0 delta before.

Shim all my setups to zero. Spastic if I don’t.

[kid-kapow]

The HY's toes have 18mm of elasticity for a 300mm sole according to ATK. That - together with a non-rotating heel - should yield a pretty comfortable ride with very good power transfer. Regular ATK toes have what like 3-4-5mm or so of "elasticy" up front? Where the "elasticity is just the clamping force (movement under the break away threshold for release) pre-release. HYs should ski significantly better in difficult snow.

Again, nobody is saying that the current offering skis poorly for what they are, so if the added weight savings and simplicity (or stack height) is more important than having ride characteristics closer to a regular alpine binding the current offerings are still killer

[Name Redacted]

Just ordered some Raider 13 Evo's to replace some Shifts. Looking forward to trying em out.

[LeeLau]

The HY's toes have 18mm of elasticity for a 300mm sole according to ATK. That - together with a non-rotating heel - should yield a pretty comfortable ride with very good power transfer. Regular ATK toes have what like 3-4-5mm or so of "elasticy" up front? Where the "elasticity is just the clamping force (movement under the break away threshold for release) pre-release. HYs should ski significantly better in difficult snow.

18mm would be a lot! 26mm for Tecton. More for Shift (can't recall what I measured)

That OG ATK toe "elasticity" claim is strange. Salomon/ Atomic Backland toe clamping force is also strong. It's strong enough that you can skin uphill without putting toe lever up. That isn't touted by Atomic/ Solly as elasticity .

The new Atk....now that sounds like true elasticity

[kid-kapow]

18mm would be a lot! 26mm for Tecton. More for Shift (can't recall what I measured)

That OG ATK toe "elasticity" claim is strange. Salomon/ Atomic Backland toe clamping force is also strong. It's strong enough that you can skin uphill without putting toe lever up. That isn't touted by Atomic/ Solly as elasticity .

The new Atk....now that sounds like true elasticity

to be fair - I can't recall ATK ever calling it elasticity for their regular toes - it was more to pre-emptively cancel out anybody else from calling a regular tech toe elastic, which it is, but to such a miniscule amount that it is closer to negligible than not imho.

Some brand - was it G3 when the Zeb came out? I can't recall - made this graph of the clamping force and I seem to remember that they labeled it as elasticity because their break away threshold was higher (more travel by a mm or two) than other tech bindings on the market - hence the binding was more elastic. So yeah...

[mr_pretzel]

I’m as big of a ATK fanboy as anybody, but I can’t see how this is better than the shift. Way less elasticity at the toe, less at the heel. Sure it’s lighter but it’s still not 2000m day after day light.

The tecton has a vital flaw in it’s release IMO so I don’t care about it.

[kid-kapow]

my bad - 18mm each way, so 36mm elasticity in the toe.

[harig]

I was wondering if it is possible (or already has been done) to convert the previous generation Crest10 to the "magnet heel flaps" as seen on the latest version of the Crest.
One can not just exchange the flaps but if the whole "tower" on the heel unit is exchanged I imagine it should work-maybe also with parts from another model like RT11 or something similar...

Wondering which parts could be used here?

[westoxified]

my bad - 18mm each way, so 36mm elasticity in the toe.

elasticity is measured in a single direction. it doesn’t get added together to produce an elasticity ‘total’

it is measured at the highest retention value setting to maximize the range for return to center

shift was communicated as 47mm in the toe, just shy of the sth2 16s 52mm, mostly related to the din range

big wing levers generally mean big toe elasticity. hence horizontal spring design’s challenges in this department

[Westcoaster]

ATK doesn't recommend user adjustment of the tower. It's possible, but no way to procure the parts.

[LeeLau]

elasticity is measured in a single direction. it doesn’t get added together to produce an elasticity ‘total’

it is measured at the highest retention value setting to maximize the range for return to center

shift was communicated as 47mm in the toe, just shy of the sth2 16s 52mm, mostly related to the din range

big wing levers generally mean big toe elasticity. hence horizontal spring design’s challenges in this department

Correct. To close the loop on this the elasticity in this graphic below was measuring return to centre one way

[auvgeek]

I went with the SkiTrab TR1 for my travel ski and am excited to give them a go this season. They were under $430 shipped from Italy.

Dang, that's a steal! I have been very curious about the TR1 but the price has kept me away (although I've been busy and haven't looked super hard).

[kid-kapow]

elasticity is measured in a single direction. it doesn’t get added together to produce an elasticity ‘total’

it is measured at the highest retention value setting to maximize the range for return to center

shift was communicated as 47mm in the toe, just shy of the sth2 16s 52mm, mostly related to the din range

big wing levers generally mean big toe elasticity. hence horizontal spring design’s challenges in this department

ah - thanks for the clarification

[~mikey b]

https://youtu.be/Cl2376n_dM4?si=BNusbBCqvMEYCt5g

[NBABUCKS1]

just started this review video on the hy free from cripple creek. Hard to tell if it's a puff piece because they get early access and want to stay in good standing w/ atk (and also sell their products). Mostly positive, mention the bench test twice, wish they'd show it!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl2376n_dM4

[LeeLau]

just started this review video on the hy free from cripple creek. Hard to tell if it's a puff piece because they get early access and want to stay in good standing w/ atk (and also sell their products). Mostly positive, mention the bench test twice, wish they'd show it!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl2376n_dM4

Ugh. It's a puff piece. "Only binding with this much retention". "Only toe piece with this much clamping force". Lou would have been more careful

https://wildsnow.com/18803/comparo-t...er-g3-dynafit/ - here's the piece about toe clamping force fwiw

Marker, Atomic/Salomon pintech, G3 and AtK are all up there. Imo that's a good safety feature for uphill as most people can tour uphill without locking out toes

[kolkritan]

Correct. To close the loop on this the elasticity in this graphic below was measuring return to centre one way

Just out of curiosity, what was it that was measured back in 2019?

Toe lateral elasticity (only measured for “toe release bindings”
– Alpine sample binding (Salomon): ~20 mm
– Atomic-Salomon Shift: ~22 mm (I could go a few millimeters more but 22 is where consistent return to center occurred.)

https://wildsnow.com/20514/tech-bind...ticity-travel/

[LeeLau]

Just out of curiosity, what was it that was measured back in 2019?



https://wildsnow.com/20514/tech-bind...ticity-travel/

It was return to centre on a machine. I can't even remember the name of the machine but it was in a shop in Whistler.

Edit. Ah interesting. There's a big variation in Shift toe elasticity for Lou's test

[~mikey b]

I was never a Lou fanboi but his stuff always seemed legit if not super dorky - I could never keep up with some of it because I was just beatering around on tele gear for 25 years


this doesn’t feel like just a puff piece to me

[shirk]

I’m as big of a ATK fanboy as anybody, but I can’t see how this is better than the shift. Way less elasticity at the toe, less at the heel. Sure it’s lighter but it’s still not 2000m day after day light.

The tecton has a vital flaw in it’s release IMO so I don’t care about it.

What's the vital flaw in release on the Tecton?

[westoxified]

Edit. Ah interesting. There's a big variation in Shift toe elasticity for Lou's test

Does Lou even know how to turn dins beyond 8?

[Benneke10]

I would worry a lot about the Hy mangling the plastic on boots, you can see in the hype video from ATK that the Scarpa boot they're using is all scratched up. At a certain point it probably has an effect on performance.

[Westcoaster]

I would worry a lot about the Hy mangling the plastic on boots, you can see in the hype video from ATK that the Scarpa boot they're using is all scratched up. At a certain point it probably has an effect on performance.

same thought. lots of sharp al edges.

[kolkritan]

It was return to centre on a machine. I can't even remember the name of the machine but it was in a shop in Whistler.

Edit. Ah interesting. There's a big variation in Shift toe elasticity for Lou's test

But isn't the elasticity of a binding measured as the return to center distance?

What makes me confused is that, if I understand everything correctly, it has been stated that elasticity is measured per "single side", so that the 52 mm of the STH2 or the 47 mm of the shift is an apples-to-apples number with the 18 mm of the HY. But in the two tests referenced above, one by you (?) and one by wildsnow the results seem to both be very consistent with the thought above that the HY with a stated 18 mm "single side" elasticity would correspond to 36 mm when comparing the numbers given for the alpine bindings, since the only other binding (that I know of) that explicitly states "single side" elasticity is the Tecton at 13 mm: https://fritschi.swiss/en/bindings/tecton.php .

Now, the table you supplied lists Tecton at 26 mm (=2 x 13mm), and the Wildsnow tests show that the return to center (=elasticity?) of Tecton is 17 mm (~13 mm, or at least a little closer to 13 mm than 26 mm) and for the Shift 22 mm (~47 mm / 2). All this I think very much contradicts that the "single side" toe elasticity is an apples-to-apples comparison with the no-explicitly-stated single side toe elasticity of the alpine bindings. It also seems weird that ATK and Fritschi would feel the need to explicitly state that it's toe elasticity "per side" if that was already the standard for measuring.