"All weather" tires in place of winter tires

[SchralphMacchio]

You might get more responses in the truck tire thread on K03 feedback. I just put some AT4Ws on my RV trailer but obviously won’t have any real feedback on snow handling as that’s a totally different application.
Also one to consider is the Nokian Outpost nAT.

[MyNameIsAugustWest]

Discount tire pushed the crossclimate pretty hard when I was shopping this spring . I passed as I’m still running two sets of dedicated summer/winter.
But I’ve seen a lot around here (CO Rockies) on a wide variety of vehicles and they sure look interesting option for those wanting all season with good winter capability or those that see a lot of dry road in winter - appear to be aggressive tread rather than lots of siping .

Will be interested in your feedback on them after getting some summer miles in

Maybe a little loud but they ride nice. Most of the roads I drive on suck so I can’t comment on their performance level but they don’t tramline and are comfortable.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[The SnowShow]

I’ve read the opposite about the AT4s…heavier and worse in snow, but hopefully that’s wrong.

[ASmileyFace]

I’ve read the opposite about the AT4s…heavier and worse in snow, but hopefully that’s wrong.

That's what I read as well. Not ideal for my use case at all. I'll crosspost to the truck thread about this too.

[Shredhead]

Discount tire pushed the crossclimate pretty hard when I was shopping this spring . I passed as I’m still running two sets of dedicated summer/winter.
But I’ve seen a lot around here (CO Rockies) on a wide variety of vehicles and they sure look interesting option for those wanting all season with good winter capability or those that see a lot of dry road in winter - appear to be aggressive tread rather than lots of siping .

Will be interested in your feedback on them after getting some summer miles in

I've been running Michelin Defender MS year round, in RFV,on my GC. They performed well for three winters, but lost a little this last season. They're good in the summer.
My wife's Audi has studded Hakkas, which are bulletproof, but loud as shit. So we take my car, most of the time.

[ASmileyFace]

Guess I’ll be looking for a new AT tire now. The KO3 has gone the opposite direction, softer more flexible compound, more sipes, better water evacuation, etc. should be a better winter tire now.

https://youtu.be/UQlcwKUwrg8?feature=shared

Finally got around to watching this video... it is an excellent review. Seems like the KO3 fits the bill perfectly for me. I had KO2s before and they were great, so any improvements to winter/wet conditions are a plus on a tire I already like. They are silly expensive though...

[SchralphMacchio]

Did you check with Costco if they have the tire available? They run BFG discounts a few times a year and during that time they usually have the best pricing. Also fill with nitro only.
The downside is that warranty claims with AWD suck because they can’t shave tires to match diameter. If you are running a part time 4WD vehicle then that’s less of a big deal, Costco can get you a replacement tire mounted without issue. Appointments can sometimes be a hassle in markets that don’t have multiple Costcos though.

[Kenny Satch]

To give an update. I keep my grabber apt on all winter and had no issue on slippeey roads driving back and forth to Montreal.

Breaking on ice is as good as cheaper dedcaded snow tires. About 20-25 more distance than my blizzaks but all I did was adjust my driving so I had total confidence.

Highly recommend.

[Buzzworthy]

Finally got around to watching this video... it is an excellent review. Seems like the KO3 fits the bill perfectly for me. I had KO2s before and they were great, so any improvements to winter/wet conditions are a plus on a tire I already like. They are silly expensive though...

I’ve run AT3’s on my Tundra year round for the past three years. I love them. That said I’m probably going KO3s next time. Due to price, availability and the new ones not sounding great in snow.

[stuckathuntermtn]

So, what am I putting on my 2017 Outback, should I just get the Falkens like everyone else? My Impreza, which was squished by a tree right after I paid it off, did really well on the Snowbowl road with some nice and sipey all seasons, but I'm open to other options. The tires on this thing don't look like they'll be great in the snow. 225/65/17. There's also the Michelin pointy bois, and the not so pointy Bridgestones and an all season with the same tread that lasts a little longer. Need a good, stiff sidewall with that mich rubber. I'm not sure I actually do enough off road and dirt driving to necessitate the Falkens, but if they are quiet and do well on wet and dry pavement (and in the snow of course) then I might be open to them. If only for the bro factor. Also open to Hankook pointy bois, or even just their all seasons.
I have Costco, Walmart, and a bunch of other options near me.
General Altimax all seasons are what I had on my last car in 205/50/17. Was about the knobbiest thing I could get in that size. They are still made, if slightly different, but it's a known factor and they aren't at the high end of the price range.
AT style would be nice in the snow, but I mostly drive on pavement. Do they mess with mileage?
Obviously, I'm posting here because I'm not interested in swapping wheels and tires for the winter.
Ps: there's also some interesting, if spendy stuff from Yokohama.

[Toadman]

So, what am I putting on my 2017 Outback, should I just get the Falkens like everyone else? My Impreza, which was squished by a tree right after I paid it off, did really well on the Snowbowl road with some nice and sipey all seasons, but I'm open to other options. The tires on this thing don't look like they'll be great in the snow. 225/65/17. There's also the Michelin pointy bois, and the not so pointy Bridgestones and an all season with the same tread that lasts a little longer. Need a good, stiff sidewall with that mich rubber. I'm not sure I actually do enough off road and dirt driving to necessitate the Falkens, but if they are quiet and do well on wet and dry pavement (and in the snow of course) then I might be open to them. If only for the bro factor. Also open to Hankook pointy bois, or even just their all seasons.
I have Costco, Walmart, and a bunch of other options near me.
General Altimax all seasons are what I had on my last car in 205/50/17. Was about the knobbiest thing I could get in that size. They are still made, if slightly different, but it's a known factor and they aren't at the high end of the price range.
AT style would be nice in the snow, but I mostly drive on pavement. Do they mess with mileage?
Obviously, I'm posting here because I'm not interested in swapping wheels and tires for the winter.
Ps: there's also some interesting, if spendy stuff from Yokohama.

You could go with the updated version of the General Altimax. New and improved All Weather compound! -https://generaltire.com/tires/passenger/altimaxtm365-aw
For a little more dough and better winter handling the Vredestein Quatrac Pro + - https://www.vredestein.com/car-suv-t...TRAC-PRO+.all/
Toyo Celsius II and the Falken Aklimate are also budget friendly options relative to the Michelin/Bridgestone/Goodyear offerings in the all weather category.

[stuckathuntermtn]

The Generals do look intriguing.

[stuckathuntermtn]

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Yokohama-...D&athbdg=L1300
Damn. I wonder if they'll be on sale come winter time

[bennettc14]

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Yokohama-...D&athbdg=L1300
Damn. I wonder if they'll be on sale come winter time

Have these on my Atlas, really good road manners. Seem fine enough in wet weather.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[MMMSKI]

No.

[skuff]

My wife and son have the crossclimate tires on their cars year round here in the upper midwest. They're happy with the summer and winter performance, and don't want a snow tire swap every year. Both have awd cars

Because I'm road tripping every winter, I'm swapping summer (crossclimate) and winter (x-ice snow) tires on an awd car. In my humble opinion, the dedicated winter tire is a huDge improvement over the all season in winter driving conditions

[californiagrown]

here in the upper midwest.

the dedicated winter tire is a huDge improvement over the all season in winter driving conditions

In places where you will be driving in winter conditions >20% of the time during winter (like the upper midwest), it makes total sense to go with a winter tire. But for many of us (Seattle, PDX, Denver, Bay Area/Sac) we are only driving in winter conditions a few times per year at home, and only for the last 20% of the drive to go skiing. Heck, my home mountain averages over 500" per year at the top, but im usually driving wet roads until about 10mins before the parking lot... and for those conditions a "winter focused" Allweather tire keeps tread wear down, keeps MPG up, handles wet and ponded pavement well, and is the better option.

When i am driving my kid to daycare in the morning, absently answering "why" questions while thinking about work and what errands i need to run after work i am honestly not locked in on driving, and if that commute was on slick roads every day i would want tires that were locked in and predictable (winter tires). But if i am only driving on slick roads the last few miles before the ski hill, or 3 days a year at home i can easily manage with a less predictable tire because i will be mentally locked in as a driver.


I have a 4th gen 4runner with Falken AT3Ws that i LOVE, but they are on their last legs and could easily be swapped out before this coming winter (but ill probably see how they do in the first snow first). They hit the perfect sweet spot of winter performance, MPG, road noise, and wear durability. I have no idea what im gonna get next- I want to find another set of AT3Ws, but if those arent available i guess im looking at KO2s or something similar. Not looking forward to having to make that choice and pay through the nose.

[AK47bp]

https://www.michelinman.com/auto/tir...ender-ltx-m-s2

I live where you live and ski where you ski. Been using these for 9 years on my 4Runner. Tread lasts forever, great in rain and most snow conditions.




Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[Duffman]

Thread bump as I had to deal with the reality of my kids and their gear getting bigger and traded my beloved A4 in for a Lezbaru Outback XT. In the Audi I've always used 2 sets of wheels with Performance Winter tires , both for the better winter compound and to get a smaller wheel with a beefier sidewall than the stock 40 series low profile tires on the lowered sport suspension.

I went performance winter (Vred Wintrac Pro, Michelin Pilot Alpin) vs full snow like X-Ice because while we drove through some heinous conditions stormchasing up to VT, our daily driving is in Philly with very little snow, and even going up to the mountains most of the driving is hundreds of miles on dry or wet highway before the last 1/3rd or so. I'm not averse to changing wheels and tires seasonally as that's what I've done before, but with the significantly lower performance needs of the Outback vs the Audi and already having 60 series sidewalls stock, does this use case argue for an All Weather tire instead like the Cross Climate 2 or similar? I've seen reviews comparing the Cross Climate 2 to an X Ice 2 ,but have never seen a comparison to a performance winter like a Pilot Alpin 5 . How much snow performance is lost here?

As far as summer , the stock outback Toyo tires suck ass anyway, so I don't see giving up too much as opposed to the Conti DWS 06+ on the Audi (couldn't do full summers as way too much erratic shoulder season here where it can be 80 in November or 20 in April). But I have heard the wet braking on the Cross Climates is meh at best.

Only other concern with the CC2 is that having the "winter" tire on all year would lead to way more wear so they would be less effective in the winter.

TLR... Continue to run 2 sets of tires and wheels w Performance Winters w a new Outback Turbo or go CC2?

[ASmileyFace]

I think if you have a use case that dictates having two wheel sets (which is sounds like you do) and you are used to the performance of a true winter tire... why would you compromise both directions and run a year round AT tire?

[Duffman]

I think if you have a use case that dictates having two wheel sets (which is sounds like you do) and you are used to the performance of a true winter tire... why would you compromise both directions and run a year round AT tire?

True, although with the new car would need to buy new wheels , but I guess the main question is with modern all weather tires like the CrossClimate2 , would I really be giving up much of anything over a "performance winter" tire like the Pilot Alpin 5 or Vredstein Wintrac ? Since a full studless winter tire like an X Ice just doesn't work with my usage

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Jonathan S.]

True, although with the new car would need to buy new wheels , but I guess the main question is with modern all weather tires like the CrossClimate2 , would I really be giving up much of anything over a "performance winter" tire like the Pilot Alpin 5 or Vredstein Wintrac ? Since a full studless winter tire like an X Ice just doesn't work with my usage

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

I went from Vredestein Wintrac Pro on a prior vehicle to CC2 (year-round) on two current vehicles (all of them AWD of course).
I sure haven't noticed any drop-off in winter performance.
Major caveat though that I'm talking about packed snow, not deep unplowed snow.

[summit]

OK tire nerds... Nokian Hakka 10 SUV, 12mm tread depth, for 1/2 ton truck with stock 32.1" tires

265/70R17 115T SL 40.8# 31.6"dia $1005/4
275/65R18 116T SL 41.9# 32.1"dia $1233/4
275/60R20 115T SL 44.1# 33.0"dia $1570/4
275/55R20 117T XL 43.0# 31.9"dia $1315/4

I haven't bought wheels yet... any reason not to go cheaper/skinnier?

[BCMtnHound]

Skinnier for snow and slush, wider for ice and hardpack (studded?) is how I look at it. The .5” difference in height is negligible for normal driving. Three different rim sizes though (my 1/2ton winters are on 17 steels, summers/all season on 18” stock Al alloys). I don’t get the low profile sidewall desire for a 4x4 truck, especially with the price premium.

[J. Barron DeJong]

Skinnier for snow and slush, wider for ice and hardpack (studded?) is how I look at it. The .5” difference in height is negligible for normal driving. Three different rim sizes though (my 1/2ton winters are on 17 steels, summers/all season on 18” stock Al alloys). I don’t get the low profile sidewall desire for a 4x4 truck, especially with the price premium.

Width doesn’t make much difference on packed snow or ice.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wf_mIlU82Ac

I go skinny on mine for the deep snow/ slush. Also go smallest rim to get more sidewall for pothole protection and some cost savings (usually).

Edit: You should get the 235/80R17 studded Hakka LT3‘s. Cut right through that deep snow and slush. 31.8” diameter.