Bitcoin....who's gotten into it?

[MultiVerse]

After the FTX fraud he was here whinging nonstop about the need for regulation to protect crypto investors. People should stop taking anything he says seriously. Online at least, he's more like a politician selling something than a real person. He'll say anything, play any victim game, depending on what's happening at the moment.

[Foggy_Goggles]

With only one exception I can think of (AverGreen? the Dude who was trying to attack the livelyhood of ON3p), I don't attack members. I just freeform blabber in response to posts.

We are all hypocrites to a certain extent, myself included. And no, I don't take it seriously. Crypto is a fair sized part of our culture these days and I don't understand it. So I try and figure out other people perspectives. Other than the marking money part, I'm still on Team Don't Get It.

[Bunion 2020]

I hope that Shera/Byates and even Stalefish make money and prosper.

Crypto is not something I understand either and so I am leery. And when Professor Hill starts up with his spiel about Trouble in River City all it does is increase my distrust.

[MultiVerse]

Crypto aspires to be the digital payment & finance protocol layer of the web. That's the technological aspect. Bitcoin is also a global asset that trades almost entirely on sentiment. So there's a technology component and a social engineering sentiment component.

Crypto social engineering narratives for the left are about checking your financial privilege by tearing down Wall Street and exploitive wealthy plutocrats. It's about class power, not the tech. Crypto social engineering narratives for the right are about anti-establishment distrust of state power. The idea is to replace elected government with a crypto network state.

The important thing is not to fall prey to these narratives. Crypto is none of the things online social engineers make it out to be. Crypto doesn't solve any social problems. Crypto will not liberate the masses. Digital tokens are crypto assets for which speculators have made and lost vast fortunes. A person can get rich or completely wrecked by the volatility. That's pretty much all anyone needs to understand to play the game. It's a lot like playing a lottery.

[stalefish3169]

Terrible reasoning. Gaming is tightly regulated; you can't just buy lottery chances from anyone. Illicit gambling like that is called running 'numbers'. Amongst the reasons gambling is controlled is to be sure the odds are legit & not fixed and it's not just a scheme for laundering money. So on that front, it's basically the same mindset on dodgy coins and other hacky cryptoschemes - zero transparency to their legitimacy or intent.

Further, the argument and example that BTC allows you to make purchases you couldn't in USD is absurd; you're literally saying you want to use it to buy illegal crypto and it's advantage is you can conceal your illegal purchases. Do you hear yourself?

No, my logic is sound. You don't understand the issue. I'm saying that the government is blocking me from spending money that I've earned and pay taxes from what I want to spend it on under the ruse of "the government knows what's best for me."

Why is there such thing as an "illegal crypto" anyway? The courts have already decided that code is free speech and protected by the First Amendment. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2015/0...ed-code-speech. Gary G is a power hungry prick and thinks 1930s laws to regulate orange groves are some how applicable to digital assets?

[Foggy_Goggles]

What specific assets that you can't buy would you buy?

What financial speculation regulation is good?

What advice do you have for someone who's crypto assets disappeared from their digital wallet who feels substantially less free right now than a month ago?

Its not a binary. I generally agree with you on the system being rigged to benefit a minority than already have the financial power. I also respect people right to gamble away everything they have. But I also like to generally have a bit of legal protection against fraud. Which comes full circle to the hypocrisy. If trad fi is benefitting the few, its fairly easy for me though (just one example) mutual funds to get on that train.

[stalefish3169]

What specific assets that you can't buy would you buy?

What financial speculation regulation is good?

What advice do you have for someone who's crypto assets disappeared from their digital wallet who feels substantially less free right now than a month ago?

Its not a binary. I generally agree with you on the system being rigged to benefit a minority than already have the financial power. I also respect people right to gamble away everything they have. But I also like to generally have a bit of legal protection against fraud. Which comes full circle to the hypocrisy. If trad fi is benefitting the few, its fairly easy for me though (just one example) mutual funds to get on that train.

In 2021 I got lucky with a crypto game token that I earned by playing. If I could've traded it on Binance when it got listed, I would've profited $200,000. By the time it got listed on an exchange I could trade it on, I made 30 grand.

In terms of financial speculation regulation, the SEC is a joke. But I generally think that people should be able to spend their own money how they please. Lots of the "investor protection" is about protecting the status quo. Look at what happened with Robinhood, GME, Citadel etc. Retail got completely fucked there for the benefit of Ken Griffin. Look at Vanguard blocking their clients from buying BTC ETFs while allowing them to buy the Inverse Cramer ETF. We need new laws specific to digital assets, not 100 year old security laws designed for orange groves.

For wallet losses, I'd say that people should enter crypto carefully, study security best practices, and only invest what they are willing to lose completely. FOMO buyers get rekt. Buying BTC as an ETF might be a good idea for people worried about losing all their money due to self-custody and hacking issues.

[MultiVerse]

lol, Vanguard, a private company should be forced to sell crypto; the government should regulate crypto; and retail got rekt with gamestop because of an unproven conspiracy, not because most bought at the top (forget simple math!).

Back to realty, separate regulations for crypto is a bad idea because 1) fraud is already illegal and 2) there's little evidence crypto threatens the banking system. So protecting crypto investors via specific additional regulations may well endanger the system by encouraging outsized investment in the area due to implicit government guarantees. New additional regulation will likely cause more and bigger problems than it solves.

[bennymac]

I'd say that people should enter crypto carefully, study security best practices, and only invest what they are willing to lose completely. FOMO buyers get rekt. Buying BTC as an ETF might be a good idea for people worried about losing all their money due to self-custody and hacking issues.

And this is how BTC will save the poor people of Central America and Africa?

[JimmyCarter]

In 2021 I got lucky with a crypto game token that I earned by playing. If I could've traded it on Binance when it got listed, I would've profited $200,000. By the time it got listed on an exchange I could trade it on, I made 30 grand.

In terms of financial speculation regulation, the SEC is a joke. But I generally think that people should be able to spend their own money how they please. Lots of the "investor protection" is about protecting the status quo. Look at what happened with Robinhood, GME, Citadel etc. Retail got completely fucked there for the benefit of Ken Griffin. Look at Vanguard blocking their clients from buying BTC ETFs while allowing them to buy the Inverse Cramer ETF. We need new laws specific to digital assets, not 100 year old security laws designed for orange groves.

For wallet losses, I'd say that people should enter crypto carefully, study security best practices, and only invest what they are willing to lose completely. FOMO buyers get rekt. Buying BTC as an ETF might be a good idea for people worried about losing all their money due to self-custody and hacking issues.

You wouldn’t have made that much because the pricing reflected a smaller market and much tighter liquidity. Market prices aren’t the price of every share, they’re the price of the last share traded. That’s why when traders suddenly dumped a giant bucket of GME shares back into the market the price dropped rapidly (which triggered even more selling, etc, because those prices weren’t based on fundamentals but hype). While robinhood was selling order flow to citadel, most of their issue was insufficient systems for the level of workload demanded. Just like coinbase whenever the price really starts running.

And Inverse Cramer ETFs are based on highly liquid shares with sizable trading float. There would not be an issue with liquidity for the ETF, or anything that could jeopardize its ability to meet its stated goals. That’s why the SEC doesn’t GAF.

[Foggy_Goggles]

I listed to that Erik Voorhees speach https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erik_Voorhees

It helped me go from "I have no idea what you are talking about" to "We will have to agree to disagree". What I got out of it was permissionless = I don't want to pay taxes nor have my financial transactions tracked. I'm guessing this is freedom?

So its basically the digital equivalent of suitcases of cash without the need for muscle to guard it? I'd think that would go against wealth equality as don't we want the people with a pile to pay more taxes?

I'm sure you'll mark me as a normie in khakis and a X5, but I'm not. I think the federal government has been inept and self serving just about my entire lifetime. But the more I learn about cryto, the more it seems my hunches are correct.

BTC looks to be like investing in the hype on the concept.

Stablecoins denominated in fiat look like the decentralized money not to be connected to any government.

As currency, it seems like are big problems with custody (its clumsy and subject to fraud with little legal protection) and medium of exchange (the economy is denominated in $s and cryto needs to be exchage and is clumsy with fees).

So despite our challenges, citizens of the US do get benefits, admittedly some more than others. So if you want to quit paying taxes, you should probably quit public schools, driving on public roads, national parks....its a long fucking list.

Come with your Rage Against the Machine, but own it. Or just be OK with Despite All Your Rage You are Still Just a Rat in Cage. Its already to try and change the system while accruing the benefits of the system. Or move to Panama.

[Foggy_Goggles]

I no nothing about Cryto Exchanges nor the laws or investigation on Binance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binance

Are you saying is it just a flex by the Fed?

Another question. Do cryto transaction kick out 1099s? When and when not? Can you realistically just use a VPN and basically offshore your wallet?

[byates1]

If it pulls back to 40 buy, this may happen summer ish.

Benny sorry I missed the 70k call end of ski season.

[stalefish3169]

lol, Vanguard, a private company should be forced to sell crypto; the government should regulate crypto; and retail got rekt with gamestop because of an unproven conspiracy, not because most bought at the top (forget simple math!).

Back to realty, separate regulations for crypto is a bad idea because 1) fraud is already illegal and 2) there's little evidence crypto threatens the banking system. So protecting crypto investors via specific additional regulations may well endanger the system by encouraging outsized investment in the area due to implicit government guarantees. New additional regulation will likely cause more and bigger problems than it solves.

I am not saying Vanguard should be forced to sell an ETF. What I am saying is that their logic is stupid good ol' boy thinking and that selling the inverse cramer ETF means they don't actually give a fuck about protecting their customers. They care about protecting the status quo that benefits them. It's the same reason most of the anti-crypto people in here are anti. It's the same reason horse and buggy drivers didn't like automobiles. People in power generally don't give it up easily.

Back to reality. Despite some posters' most fervent wishes, crypto is not going away. The SEC is behaving like a school yard bully, not a legit institution. https://cryptosheadlines.com/sec-com...ea-for-crypto/

[J. Barron DeJong]

I am not saying Vanguard should be forced to sell an ETF. What I am saying is that their logic is stupid good ol' boy thinking and that selling the inverse cramer ETF means they don't actually give a fuck about protecting their customers. They care about protecting the status quo that benefits them. It's the same reason most of the anti-crypto people in here are anti. It's the same reason horse and buggy drivers didn't like automobiles. People in power generally don't give it up easily.

Back to reality. Despite some posters' most fervent wishes, crypto is not going away. The SEC is behaving like a school yard bully, not a legit institution. https://cryptosheadlines.com/sec-com...ea-for-crypto/

Do you have the actual SEC dialog, or just the crypto-bro satirical future hypothetical?

[MultiVerse]

Regardless of SEC minutia, the overriding regulatory framework for crypto must be cryptocurrency market participants should bear the consequences of inadvisable investments in volatile markets. If the fundamental argument for crypto is decentralization then centralized oversight should play as limited role as possible.

[stalefish3169]

And this is how BTC will save the poor people of Central America and Africa?

Foggy asked some legit questions in a respectable way and I answered genuinely in a response tailored for a USA based audience.

Maybe you'd get more respect if you weren't such a troll all the time. I shared some stories of my Venezuelan (yes, I know that Venezuela is part of South, not Central America before you hit me with one of your "gotchas" you love to fellate yourself over) friend a few weeks ago and how crypto changed his life for the better. I have another Nigerian friend who I've never met, but has a similar story. So check your financial privilege smugness and keep telling yourself you're not a hypocrite, while you accuse us of being so. Enjoy the profit from crypto that you may or may not own! We don't actually know because you're so slippery and get off on playing both sides.

[bennymac]

I don’t just accuse you guys of being hypocrites - I’ve proved it. And let me be very clear - I’m not here for nor do I care about the respect of the crypto cult members who will spout anything but revert back to profit above everything when their bullshit gets exposed. Or switch to talking about hate-fucking other mags wives. I guess that can be excused/ignored if it comes from a fellow maxi.

And byates - your 70k call was hedged by your other posts saying it might not. You’ll always be right if you predict all possible options! Great job! [emoji122]

#winnerswin

[stalefish3169]

Do you have the actual SEC dialog, or just the crypto-bro satirical future hypothetical?

Dude, there are many instances of crypto companies trying to comply and the SEC refusing to tell them how.

BTW, have you issued an apology to the thread for being massively wrong about BTC yet? Did I miss it somewhere?

[Foggy_Goggles]

Ya'll make me think I need a master class in Psychology!

The challenge to the Libertarian mindset is you have to value others' liberty the same as your own. Or you own the construct of state, authority, economic and political systems. And when they seem like they are not working, you work to correct it.

You can just take the whole monopoly board and throw it across the room because you don't like the rules of the game and simultaneously trying to rewrite the rules.

I'm not even asking that you justify crypto. That's your choice. I got all kinds of greasy mostly harmless hustles. I eat organic food yet burn a gallon of 2stoke oil a week. Being a human is a messy game.

But this is TGR, you can't double down on bullshit and then go cry in the sand box. It doesn't have a history of working out well. Can a guy that loves snowmobiles get on the Crypo Crowd for needlessly burning dinosaurs? Not really, but when it smells like bullshit, I'm gonna let you know.

[Foggy_Goggles]

and peoples lives being changes by buy in low and selling high doesn't validate jack shit.

Real Estate
Cocaine
f(x)
Guns
Stocks
Bonds

I know people #LamoboRich from all of the above. The most lucrative plays frequently combine more than one.

[byates1]

Wait we can't hate fuck each other's wives? WTF is this place coming to?

[J. Barron DeJong]

Dude, there are many instances of crypto companies trying to comply and the SEC refusing to tell them how.

BTW, have you issued an apology to the thread for being massively wrong about BTC yet? Did I miss it somewhere?

Wrong about what, asshole?

[stalefish3169]

Wrong about what, asshole?

Blue Benny! Please do something! Jong called me a name!

[bennymac]

Blue Benny! Please do something! Jong called me a name!

Maybe tell him you hate women and you’ll hate fuck his wife? As long as you love BTC that kinda talk is excusable with the crypto crowd here.

#respect