Travel hacks and advice

[phatty]

Absolutely any other airline. Fuck United.

Seriously. I'm on 15yrs of avoiding them at all costs. I can't even remember what pissed me off so bad, but I'm not going to give them a try to figure it out again. I feel for those who live near United hubs but there's always other options.

[BFD]

I think I read it here. Just wanted to thank the person who mentioned the Airbus 2 4 2 seating.

[seano732]

Seriously. I'm on 15yrs of avoiding them at all costs. I can't even remember what pissed me off so bad, but I'm not going to give them a try to figure it out again. I feel for those who live near United hubs but there's always other options.

I remember. They cost us a day and a half of our Maui vacation and did fuck all to make it right. Fuck. United.

[The AD]

Perhaps this is the best place to mention the JAL incident in Tokyo a couple days ago. Pretty impressive that everyone got off that airplane alive. It also offends me that some people have called it a "miracle." It's no miracle, it's thousands upon thousands of people, both onboard and off, who have worked and are continuing to work to make flying as safe as possible.

I do wonder if the plane being filled with primarily Japanese passengers helped, though. If this happened in the U.S. there probably would have been more panic and more people trying to retrieve their carry-ons from the bins.

[riser4]

I remember. They cost us a day and a half of our Maui vacation and did fuck all to make it right. Fuck. United.

Did they also break your guitar?

[huckbucket]

I'm long term United (1K). Biggest thing for me is OTP and they are #2 domestically behind only Delta.

[t-the-east]

I just wasted all sorts of work time reading through this thread. Learned a few good tips, but man you guys really went off the rails for a while.
Biggest takeaways -
-Prana Zion pants ( although the Brion look more my style/not as techy, and the same fabric

-don’t shit your pants, especially if they are brand new

-don’t check a bag

-stick with one reward setup

So basically, I found a new pair of pants to try and wasted a solid hour of work time. Win. Thanks fellas

[singlesline]

Eh, I find the big 3 airlines are all basically the same. People have horror stories with all of them and their opinions are based on anecdotes/bad luck rather than broader data/experience. Plenty of happy frequent fliers on all of them.

That said, Delta seems to have clearly better first class food...but that doesn't matter much to me as I'm not usually buying first class tickets

What does matter is routing/hub locations, and for that United works best for me, Delta is OK, and American is awful...and given I've flown United enough for status, it is better to stick with them.

I just wasted all sorts of work time reading through this thread. Learned a few good tips, but man you guys really went off the rails for a while.
Biggest takeaways -
-Prana Zion pants ( although the Brion look more my style/not as techy, and the same fabric

If the Brion had an integrated belt, it would be the perfect travel pant IMHO. Slimmer fit, less intrusive seams, no cargo pocket. Unfortunately, I find that they stretch out fairly quick between washes and necessitate a belt. Also a zippered back pocket for your wallet would be nice (or at least a baffle-cover like the zion just to keep it from falling out)

Not that big of a deal to wear a belt, but part of the magic of the Zion is that it is light and just works on its own--integrated belt lets you keep it adjusted throughout your trip.

More and more Zion/Brion knockoffs out there. My current favorite are an Orvis pair that I got at Costco--they fit more like the brion but have a zippered back pocket and a small slim side cargo pocket. Unfortunately they switched to selling a different version that is the same material but has a dumb pocket layout.

[alpinevibes]

Seriously. I'm on 15yrs of avoiding them at all costs. I can't even remember what pissed me off so bad, but I'm not going to give them a try to figure it out again. I feel for those who live near United hubs but there's always other options.

We live next to a United-dominant airport and have a United dominant hub down the way and fly a fair bit, with 80-90% of our travel with them. To me: “it is what it is” and usually they’re pretty much fine. I’ve never had status and never once been upgraded beyond Economy Plus in my life, but they’re not that much worse than American or Delta. Sure, I’d prefer Alaska but that’s not really a possibility. I just try to avoid Newark and Houston if at all possible.

[jackattack]

Zion Stretch fit is meh, way too baggy in the leg.

Patagonia Transit Traveler are my favorite. You can dress them up or dress them down. They look good for a business conference, comfortable for walking long distances or lounging apres at Mtn Lodge.
https://www.patagonia.com/product/me...ns-pants-jeans

[Muffcabbage]

Absolutely any other airline. Fuck United.

I'm banned on United for skiplagging, ie, booking a ticket further than I was going and getting off on the layover plane switch.
Saved $1,000 on a $1,700 ticket and they got all pissy. NYT just did an article on skiplagging a few days ago.

Whether You Call It ‘Skiplagging’ or ‘Hidden-City Travel,’ It’s Contentious


Booking a flight with a layover in the city that’s the real destination for the traveler can net big bargains, but airlines prohibit the practice.


On the last day of June, American Airlines agents at Gainesville Regional Airport in Florida canceled a North Carolina teenager’s flight after realizing that he had used a booking tactic called “skiplagging” or “hidden-city travel,” forbidden by airlines but used by some travelers to net flight bargains.
The teen’s father, Hunter Parsons, said it was his 17-year-old’s first time flying unaccompanied and that both the timing and price of the booking made it appealing — for $150, his son was to fly from Gainesville to Charlotte, and not continue on the second flight to New York, a cost savings of roughly $300 if the family had simply purchased a direct flight to Charlotte. But Mr. Parsons’s son didn’t even make it past the check-in counter in Gainesville, where the airline agents questioned why the teen would fly to New York when his layover was in his hometown, Charlotte. He was forced to pay for a direct flight.
Skiplagging is buying a ticket for a connecting flight, with a layover in the city that’s the real destination for the traveler. Flyers disembark after the first leg and simply fail to board the second. Often the fare is cheaper than if they’d actually bought a direct flight to their desired destination. At least two websites now help unearth these deals for consumers.
Though it is not illegal, the practice is strictly prohibited by airlines in their contracts of carriage. And carriers have shown an erratic but heavy hand in administering punishment for those caught, eliminating a skiplagger’s frequent flier miles in one instance and suing a passenger in another. Mr. Parsons said that American barred his son from traveling with the carrier for three years.




Experts say that travelers have flown this way for decades and that detecting improper use of connections is tricky, making enforcement a challenge for airlines. Here’s what to know about this open secret of flying.

How does it work?

Airline ticket costs are determined by many factors, such as energy prices, passenger demand for certain routes and competition from other airlines. They aren’t merely a reflection of travel distance. For travelers, this means that it can occasionally be more affordable to book a flight with a layover along a more competitive route and get off there, rather than booking a nonstop flight to the desired location.

For instance, a traveler in Fort Lauderdale, Fla., wants to fly to San Francisco. A recent search turned up a flight from Fort Lauderdale to Portland, Ore., with a stop in San Francisco, for about $124. A nonstop flight from Fort Lauderdale to San Francisco would cost about $220.

Skiplagged and Kiwi facilitate searching for and booking these kinds of deals.

But it requires staying undetected. You can’t check a bag or link a frequent flier account to collect the mileage. And travelers who show patterns — flying the same routes repeatedly and missing the last leg of a flight — are more likely to be caught.

Why is it gaining in popularity?

Short answer: the cost of airfare, which has soared in recent years.

Mary Cropper, a travel specialist with Boston-based Audley Travel, called airfare pricing a “perfect storm.” Rising fares, in addition to fees for everything from beverages to printing boarding passes, have made skiplagging more enticing to passengers. While she doesn’t advise her clients to book this way, she said she understood the motivation.
“Why wouldn’t someone want to save 50 percent on an airline ticket, something that’s just so expensive these days?” Ms. Cropper asked.

Aktarer Zaman, Skiplagged’s founder and chief executive, emphasized that his website has “empowered people to make their own decisions” by digging up alternatives to current airline pricing practices, which he described as “price gouging."
Times travel reporters. When our writers review a destination, they do not accept free or discounted services or, in most cases, reveal that they work for The Times. We want their experience to be what you can expect.


What are the risks?

Upon purchasing a ticket, travelers agree to a contract of carriage with the airline, which is a set of rules passengers agree to comply with. These cover everything from how a carrier will handle oversold flights to requirements regarding passengers’ clothing and behavior. These terms and conditions also often explicitly forbid hidden-city ticketing and lay out a raft of consequences should travelers circumvent the rules.

United Airlines reserves the right to permanently ban travelers who don’t complete their trip. They also say they can revoke status and wipe out accrued mileage. Alaska Airlines mentions that it can take legal action against passengers who violate their policies.
American says in its fine print that it has the right to a number of actions, such as canceling any unused portion of the ticket, refusing to let the passenger fly and billing the customer for what the intended route would have cost.

Curtis Blessing, a spokesman for American, called this type of travel an “all-around bad o6utcome” that could cause issues with checked bags and also prevent other customers, who might have urgent travel needs, from booking seats.
Airlines have mostly taken aim at the online providers, in past years filing a handful of lawsuits against Skiplagged and Kiwi. Earlier this summer, American sued Kiwi in federal court in Texas, claiming that the “rogue online travel agent” had repeatedly engaged in “abusive ticketing practices,” including booking hidden city fares for its customers, according to court documents.
So far, litigation has been unsuccessful in blocking this travel hack. One lawsuit filed in 2014 by United against Skiplagged was dismissed, while in 2021, Southwest Airlines sued Skiplagged for using the carrier’s data. Skiplagged argued that they were not the ones actually distributing Southwest tickets; they showed flights but directed users to other websites for booking. Both parties later agreed to drop the lawsuit, Mr. Zaman said.
In 2018, Lufthansa sued a passenger who had booked a round-trip flight from Oslo to Seattle but then stayed in Frankfurt, the flight’s layover city. The airline later dropped the lawsuit.
However, there are plentiful anecdotes online of passengers who say they’ve been threatened with lifetime bans and with the loss of all their frequent flier mileage.

Is it an ethical way to travel? How much of an issue is it for airlines anyway?

“The question is whether you think it has any impact on the provider and whether you care,” said Robert Mann, an aviation analyst and a former American executive. Airlines say that exploitation of hidden-city fares results in empty seats that could have been booked by others.
In its lawsuit against Kiwi, American also said that passenger no-shows can delay flights by triggering searches for the traveler and any luggage involved, and waste fuel that is calculated by passenger count.

Others say that these fares are a loophole of an airline’s own making, and a reflection of their pricing priorities. By law, airlines can set whatever prices and routes they want.

“It can be argued charging much higher prices for shorter distances is unfair and especially penalizes frequent fliers to hub cities,” where high demand generally means costlier airfare, said Paul Hudson, the founder of a passengers rights advocacy group called Flyers Rights.
What can you do if you’re penalized for skiplagging?

Very little. Bart Banino, an attorney at Condon & Forsyth, a firm specializing in aviation law, emphasized that passengers are obligated to adhere to the airline’s terms and conditions — that contract of carriage — whether that means traveling on the route they’ve purchased, or paying a fare difference when they’re caught breaking the rules.

[Not DJSapp]

Perhaps this is the best place to mention the JAL incident in Tokyo a couple days ago. Pretty impressive that everyone got off that airplane alive. It also offends me that some people have called it a "miracle." It's no miracle, it's thousands upon thousands of people, both onboard and off, who have worked and are continuing to work to make flying as safe as possible.

I do wonder if the plane being filled with primarily Japanese passengers helped, though. If this happened in the U.S. there probably would have been more panic and more people trying to retrieve their carry-ons from the bins.

Helped? Most likely, but it probably wasn't that big of a difference. If anything, fewer injuries from going down the slide. When Mrs. DJSapp was evac'd off a jetblue flight in 2010 very few people were going for their carryons and they were all concentrating on GTFO, even though it was just a tire fire on the main gear. And the flight crew was very direct and pushy about getting everyone out ASAP. Quite a few injuries from the slide though from rubber rash and turned ankles, which can be avoided with better diet and following instructions.

Given the fireball on landing JAL went through, I'd imagine nobody would be thinking about luggage and everyone would want out of that aluminum oven. If anything, the Japanese mindset cut down on pushing, shoving and trampling.

[The AD]

Given the fireball on landing JAL went through, I'd imagine nobody would be thinking about luggage and everyone would want out of that aluminum oven. If anything, the Japanese mindset cut down on pushing, shoving and trampling.

Composite oven, but I agree with everything else. I was just impressed most people didn't seem to panic.

[nickwm21]

Eh, I find the big 3 airlines are all basically the same.

Ehhhhh…. The thing is not who provides the nicer product; it’s when shit hits the fan / fights cancelled / luggage lost… who picks up the phone and fixes the issue. Delta will do what they reasonably can. United won’t give a fuck unless you’re top tier global. American - who knows…


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[phatty]

Ehhhhh…. The thing is not who provides the nicer product; it’s when shit hits the fan / fights cancelled / luggage lost… who picks up the phone and fixes the issue. Delta will do what they reasonably can. United won’t give a fuck unless you’re top tier global. American - who knows…


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

Bingo. Delta and Alaska have been there to back things up for me when things have gone wrong.

[Meadow Skipper]

Bingo. Delta and Alaska have been there to back things up for me when things have gone wrong.

This, ime.

[zion zig zag]

Perhaps this is the best place to mention the JAL incident in Tokyo a couple days ago. Pretty impressive that everyone got off that airplane alive. It also offends me that some people have called it a "miracle." It's no miracle, it's thousands upon thousands of people, both onboard and off, who have worked and are continuing to work to make flying as safe as possible.

I do wonder if the plane being filled with primarily Japanese passengers helped, though. If this happened in the U.S. there probably would have been more panic and more people trying to retrieve their carry-ons from the bins.

Think about this type of incident next time you are seated next to a 400 pounder who can’t put down the arm rest and takes 10 minutes to wriggle up out of their seat. And they’re in the aisle seat.

[Foggy_Goggles]

Bro, your going up and over and you know it. Hell, that probably my move if I gotta piss.

[summit]

Well Southwest is now gonna give the 500 pounder their own row for free. Good for everyone except that your ticket price will go up and you might get bumped if there aren't enough seats.

On the other hand, the 500 pounder might plug the hole if there is another Alaska / 73 plug door blowout like just happened over Portland.

[bennymac]

Are exit row seats now going to be cheaper than regular seats?

[summit]

Maybe... it wasn't an exit row originally. It became one.

[Not DJSapp]

Captain is going to have an easier time convincing everyone to sit down and keep the seat belt on these days. "Hey folks, just got a call from maintenance. Apparently the ground team didn't get to our door inspection yet like we thought. Just stay seated and buckled and you'll be fine. Keep those personal electronics stowed too. We got about 4 hours left on this flight so just sit tight and we'll be there in no time."

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

[The AD]

On the positive side it did provide a heck of a view.

[The AD]

It looks like I might, in a sense, be hoisted by my own petard next week flying back from San Diego. Wife and I are booked on a flight that is scheduled to be on a MAX 9, so I'd say the odds are very good that that flight will be canceled. This morning I was thinking about preemptively changing the flight to another one that is using a different aircraft, but they charge the difference in fare and that's $180 per person. I know you can also change flights the day of for a small fee (Alaska says $25-$50), but I'm worried that's going to be very difficult since everyone's going to know that flight is canceled. Any other recourse other than letting Alaska rebook us, and if so what's the best way to handle that? Get on the horn as soon as they send announce the flight is canceled? Use the website? What's best?

edit: I just checked Alaska's site and it looks like any change fees are being waived, but it mut be on a flight that is currently canceled, and they've only canceled flights through the 18th as of now. So I think I'll need to hang tight until flights on the 21st are canceled and then try to change as quickly as the announcement is made.
https://www.alaskaair.com/content/ad...isories#system

[wendigo]

don't use the website, don't talk to the baggage checkers, do either talk to ak air customer service at the airport, or best call them.
given the # of cancelled flights (took us a couple extra days to get home recently) just call ak air - they have waived rebook fees during this time of chaos.