To Vaccinate or Not---The Rat Flu Odyssey Continues

[Skidog]

His point is you're either vaccinated or you're not, so how can it make it worse? I know your point was that the mandate might further entrench those who have yet to get vaccinated, but his point is the mandate can only cause people who are currently unvaccinated to get vaccinated. So it might not work as well as one would hope, but it can only cause additional people to get vaxxed.

so wait.....what if 1 or 2% quit the healthcare industry (only using the Federal obligated hospitals) of the 17million? Sounds like huge numbers of people leaving a pretty important industry. Thats what I meant by worse.

Obviously we don't know, and the media does tend to blow things up a bit but the covid implications, beyond the vaccine alone, will stretch out a long time.

[Adolf Allerbush]

dont follow what you mean? The Biden mandate isnt in place until sometime in October. something like 17 million health care workers for facilities that receive Federal/Medicaid $..

Did you have some thought that all health care workers were vaccinated? Plenty of stories around last few weeks about nurses quitting, maternity wards shutting down due to staff issues. In fact I posted that exact story a few pages back...

https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden...760946a6fb89be

You said:

I mentioned it a few pages back. There are still plenty of health care workers in the "no vax" camp. The mandates only seem to be making that situation worse.

I didn't disagree with that, but your claim that the mandates are making it worse means that somehow the % of vaccinated healthcare workers is on the decline. The mandate cannot make it "worse" unless there is a way to unvacinnate the vaccinated HC workers. It could mean that people dig in their heals, quit their jobs, and make a career change based on whatever is motivating them to keep from getting vaccinated.

ETA: I see you responded while I was responding. Ok, do we want unvaccinated HC workers in the first place? Yes, it will make it worse from a staffing perspective, but that must be a very small portion of the HC workforce that would rather leave their profession than get a vaccine.

[Skidog]

You said:



I didn't disagree with that, but your claim that the mandates are making it worse means that somehow the % of vaccinated healthcare workers is on the decline. The mandate cannot make it "worse" unless there is a way to unvacinnate the vaccinated HC workers. It could mean that people dig in their heals, quit their jobs, and make a career change based on whatever is motivating them to keep from getting vaccinated.

ETA: I see you responded while I was responding. Ok, do we want unvaccinated HC workers in the first place? Yes, it will make it worse from a staffing perspective, but that must be a very small portion of the HC workforce that would rather leave their profession than get a vaccine.

I dont know the answer...thanks for the edit...I just see people with credentials and apparent smarts, deciding against for a variety of reasons. I wish they would all get vaxxed, but 2% of 17 million? Thats a HUGE #, and it could be higher/lower, but man..The hit on many industries could be huge.

off topic of health care, but the NY restaurant mandates are already showing their ugly heads with active "boycotts" of some high end restaurants. An industry thats been crushed by this pandemic now has to be "vaccine police".

Like i said, the long range issues covid will bring, will be felt for years to come.

[Adolf Allerbush]

I dont know the answer...thanks for the edit...I just see people with credentials and apparent smarts, deciding against for a variety of reasons. I wish they would all get vaxxed, but 2% of 17 million? Thats a HUGE #, and it could be higher/lower, but man..The hit on many industries could be huge.

off topic of health care, but the NY restaurant mandates are already showing their ugly heads with active "boycotts" of some high end restaurants. An industry thats been crushed by this pandemic now has to be "vaccine police".

Like i said, the long range issues covid will bring, will be felt for years to come.

I would strongly question the "smarts" these people have, or at least their critical reasoning skills, with regards to getting the jab. Yeah, I don't really want an unvaccinated HC worker caring for my immune compromised relative who could die if this person in their personal life contracts COVID whereas they wouldn't have otherwise.

[ill-advised strategy]

Honestly, if somebody has a allied medical education and can’t figure this vaccine situation out, I think it might be better in the long run if they step out of the field. It’s a short term problem but, just…these are people who shouldn’t have been passed in the first place

[ill-advised strategy]

Honestly, if somebody has a allied medical education and can’t figure this vaccine situation out, I think it might be better in the long run if they step out of the field. It’s a short term problem but, just…these are people who shouldn’t have been passed in the first place

[Adolf Allerbush]

I dont know the answer...thanks for the edit...I just see people with credentials and apparent smarts, deciding against for a variety of reasons. I wish they would all get vaxxed, but 2% of 17 million? Thats a HUGE #, and it could be higher/lower, but man..The hit on many industries could be huge.

off topic of health care, but the NY restaurant mandates are already showing their ugly heads with active "boycotts" of some high end restaurants. An industry thats been crushed by this pandemic now has to be "vaccine police".

Like i said, the long range issues covid will bring, will be felt for years to come.

I would strongly question the "smarts" these people have, or at least their critical reasoning skills, with regards to getting the jab. Yeah, I don't really want an unvaccinated HC worker caring for my immune compromised relative who could die if this person in their personal life contracts COVID whereas they wouldn't have otherwise.

[Skidog]

I would strongly question the "smarts" these people have, or at least their critical reasoning skills, with regards to getting the jab. Yeah, I don't really want an unvaccinated HC worker caring for my immune compromised relative who could die if this person in their personal life contracts COVID whereas they wouldn't have otherwise.

you realize they have been doing it for a long time right? They arent all vaxxed.

Some of the "smarts" im speaking of are people like MD's and Nurses...Do I agree? Not really, but it doesnt change the fact that many still may refuse to get vaxed in the health care industry. Last thing we need there is any more stress.

[MontuckyFried]

So with 2 Phizers in me, should I go 2+1 Moderna, or 3 Phizers ?

[CarlMega]

Last thing we need there is any more needless death and illness .

FIFY

[Skidog]

FIFY

That goes without saying I thought....

Its a real problem that will need to be addressed soon. Time will tell how bad...but a if a large group of healthcare professionals quit, I assume there will be even more additional deaths.

[LongShortLong]

A vocal contingent has spent a lot of time arguing even if we reach a 100% vaccination it won't make any difference. Marin county California is approaching 100% vaccination of eligible residents and they have some of lowest case/death rates in the country.

90.7% of residents 12 and older were fully vaccinated. A whopping 97.3% of Marin’s eligible population has received at least one vaccine dose. It's paying off with a clear correlation between high vaccination rates and low case rates. Daily cases are around 10 per 100,000 residents, among the lowest in the nation and less than half the average in California. Since just after the beginning of September deaths per 100k are at zero.

https://www.sfchronicle.com/health/a...f-16474541.php

I would guess Marin County has passed herd immunity levels. If you get your R below 1, local cases will die out. However, travel and commutes keep bringing in new cases. If your R is close to 1, say 0.9 or 0.95, those introduced cases propagate for a long time before dying out. Meanwhile, travel and commute keep bringing more cases. My feeling is many highly vaxxed areas are already suffering this phenomenon (bay area, NYC, King County, etc).

Taking Iceland as an example, their cases were falling this summer. They opened travel and shitloads of (diseased) Americans came. Cases spiked. School started in America halting most of the travel. Since travel dropped, Iceland cases are falling dramatically.

Marin County's cases would go to zero if they shut the borders. Alternately, once those living in Marin County's commute and travel networks get their shit together, cases will also fall to zero.

[riser4]

Honestly, if somebody has a allied medical education and can’t figure this vaccine situation out, I think it might be better in the long run if they step out of the field. It’s a short term problem but, just…these are people who shouldn’t have been passed in the first place

Honestly, if somebody has a allied medical education and can’t figure this vaccine situation out, I think it might be better in the long run if they step out of the field. It’s a short term problem but, just…these are people who shouldn’t have been passed in the first place

When it's worth saying twice.

[Skidog]

When it's worth saying twice.

Dude you can say it as many times as you wish, it doesnt make it stop or go away. Hopefully it doesnt happen at all, but im skeptical.

[jono]

Jesus H, want to see crazy antivax posts? Search Instagram for #donotcomply Tens of thousands of moronic antivax bullshit posts.

Time to repurpose that hashtag for more appropriate themes like nudism, street racing and illegal drugs. Maybe a camp fire.

[jono]

Dude you can say it as many times as you wish, it doesnt make it stop or go away. Hopefully it doesnt happen at all, but im skeptical.

Don't underestimate the number of cranks with credentials who have already quit or have been delivering substandard care. Anti-social tendencies have to be more than a few percent of any population. This could be like cops: drum out the anti-vaxers and ditch a lot of bad ones without even trying.

[riser4]

Low hanging fruit.

[ex-powderbroker]

I asked for a mushroom id on a local fb group and a beautiful redhead came to my rescue to confirm what i thought. I look at her page and she is so over the top with vaccine disinfo though. Multiverse, do you have any charts that correlate ridiculous hotness with vaccine skepticism? I think there has to be a correlation here.

[SumJongGuy]

Flu Vax check!

[mcski]

you realize they have been doing it for a long time right? They arent all vaxxed.

Some of the "smarts" im speaking of are people like MD's and Nurses...Do I agree? Not really, but it doesnt change the fact that many still may refuse to get vaxed in the health care industry. Last thing we need there is any more stress.

The last thing we need is dipshits in the medical field. Might be a theoretical short term pain, but I don’t want these fucking morons anywhere near a hospital floor for any reason whatsoever ever. Fuck em, they don’t belong there.

[seano732]

Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

[The AD]

Flu Vax check!

Just got mine an hour ago.

Plan to get the Shingrix shots later this year. If my cell reception doesn't improve drastically I'm not even sure what else I can do.

[bennymac]

Let’s be clear a lot of the health care workers are quitting not because of vaccine mandates but because the hospitals are overwhelmed with unvaccinated people.

These people are likely vaccinated but just fed up being forced to do overtime in shitty understaffed situations all to deal with idiots who are denying covid even exists or that the vaccine could have helped them in any way. Quitting *because* they are pro vax and they realize it’s not worth the stress and danger to be looking after swarms of people who just couldn’t bother to get it.

[Skidog]

The last thing we need is dipshits in the medical field. Might be a theoretical short term pain, but I don’t want these fucking morons anywhere near a hospital floor for any reason whatsoever ever. Fuck em, they don’t belong there.

They are there, and they are still there. How do you know?

I've asked before and it went unanswered. Say you need emergency care, like a real emergency, head to hospital and nurse is non vax? She/he is the only one that can help. No other choices. You dying on that mountain? My guess is big fat no.

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using TGR Forums mobile app

[Skidog]

Let’s be clear a lot of the health care workers are quitting not because of vaccine mandates but because the hospitals are overwhelmed with unvaccinated people.

These people are likely vaccinated but just fed up being forced to do overtime in shitty understaffed situations all to deal with idiots who are denying covid even exists or that the vaccine could have helped them in any way. Quitting *because* they are pro vax and they realize it’s not worth the stress and danger to be looking after swarms of people who just couldn’t bother to get it.

Some of them sure are. Some not. No question. I never would deny the overworked and underappreciated departures.



Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using TGR Forums mobile app