Moment Skis Discussion

[lemonhead]

I'm looking for the collective's take on quiver/binding choice for the soon to be mine 194 Ghost Trains. I'm stoked about the ski and It will be my big day ski in Utah. Currently, the quiver is a 190 Deathwish with Shifts. I love the shift and have no issues with them. I did a major quiver reduction and use this ski and the DD and as a 1 lap dawn patrol ski, as well as lift-assisted touring option. I love touring with a regular core and for this use case, I haven't found the setup to be too heavy. Question is putting shifts on the ghost train a waste? Will it be too heavy? Also, would swapping the shifts to the GT and putting alpine bindings on the DW be a really bad idea having such a non-versatile and heavy touring ski?

[PeachesNCream]

I'm looking for the collective's take on quiver/binding choice for the soon to be mine 194 Ghost Trains. I'm stoked about the ski and It will be my big day ski in Utah. Currently, the quiver is a 190 Deathwish with Shifts. I love the shift and have no issues with them. I did a major quiver reduction and use this ski and the DD and as a 1 lap dawn patrol ski, as well as lift-assisted touring option. I love touring with a regular core and for this use case, I haven't found the setup to be too heavy. Question is putting shifts on the ghost train a waste? Will it be too heavy? Also, would swapping the shifts to the GT and putting alpine bindings on the DW be a really bad idea having such a non-versatile and heavy touring ski?

Whatever you do, keep the shifts on the DW. The DW can handle most conditions, arguably all conditions which in my opinion is what you want in a touring ski. If you're okay with the cost of shifts, I'd put them on the GTs as well even if it is a little heavy of a touring setup. If you're worried about the weight, you could put tectons on there as well. All depends on how much you see yourself touring. I was actually debating the same thing but Praxis version (MVP and Protest). Ended up going with alpine binders on the Protests because 1. cheaper and 2. touring is 95% up and 5% down, and MVPs are still fun in pow

[lemonhead]

Thanks @brundo, I think the versatility of the DW warrants shifts. I feel like with that setup there isn't any condition or location where they would suck. Now I have to decide how often I would rather tour on a GT vs a DW. I know this is a first-world quiver problem and TGR seems like the perfect vehicle for this.

[IanCH]

I think if youve got two skis at least one should have a 400g class freeride pin binding.

[PeachesNCream]

Thanks @brundo, I think the versatility of the DW warrants shifts. I feel like with that setup there isn't any condition or location where they would suck. Now I have to decide how often I would rather tour on a GT vs a DW. I know this is a first-world quiver problem and TGR seems like the perfect vehicle for this.

Haha first world problems indeed. When you're touring, how often do you feel you want a bigger ski? For me it's never. If it's a 12"+ day, I'm going to the resort. Only time I could see wanting touring binders on big skis for me would be side country a couple days after a storm

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[toast2266]

I'm looking for the collective's take on quiver/binding choice for the soon to be mine 194 Ghost Trains. I'm stoked about the ski and It will be my big day ski in Utah. Currently, the quiver is a 190 Deathwish with Shifts. I love the shift and have no issues with them. I did a major quiver reduction and use this ski and the DD and as a 1 lap dawn patrol ski, as well as lift-assisted touring option. I love touring with a regular core and for this use case, I haven't found the setup to be too heavy. Question is putting shifts on the ghost train a waste? Will it be too heavy? Also, would swapping the shifts to the GT and putting alpine bindings on the DW be a really bad idea having such a non-versatile and heavy touring ski?

Mount pivot 18's on them. If, in the future, you want the setup to be walkable, you can castify (cast-rate?) them. In the meantime, there's no sacrifice for what the skis are actually made for.

[lemonhead]

I think you guys are right and the cast option is nice, I just wish the actual had product in stock. I know they are a small shop and I get it. I think it's alpine clamps.

[Tailwind]

I'm a fan of putting Shifts on Powder skis... I don't use them every week but it's a nice sidecountry / weird touring day option and they ski fine on powder days. I have Line Pescados with Shifts and its one of my favorite setups because they get used on powder days (at some resorts) and touring on the best days.

The Ghost train is interesting... It's such a big ski that I wouldn't see touring on it a lot, but keep in mind it could be fun in some conditions.

I think you guys are right and the cast option is nice, I just wish the actual had product in stock. I know they are a small shop and I get it. I think it's alpine clamps.

[bigdude2468]

My wife had her first day on her new 152 Bella's yesterday, more than she could have expected. She has Sierra's in a 162 for her everyday groomer ski. She was skiing the Zephyr 146 / 101 kids powder as her pow, soft snow ski which was fine. She is 4'10" 94 lbs but as her skills improve she was starting to over power the Zephyr. Full rocker and not a lot of effective edge length in anything other than pow they were getting squirrely. So enter the Bella in a 152 / 106 underfoot., WOW! Yesterday on pretty much hard groomers the mustache rocker just railed. Can't say they are better than the Sierra's on groomers but for her the Bella's are going to be better on in between days. The Sierra's are a bit long for her in bumps, trees etc, Bella's are not.

[ElementofSurprise]

Question for the Moment team while we're on the topic of Women's skis:

Are the Women's version of a ski (e.g. Hot Mess vs PBJ) different at all in design/construction or is it simply smaller lengths and different topsheets?

[AZskibum]

Question for you guys. Going to salt lake for the first time to burn my Ikon days on the 6th through 15th. Doesn't look like much snow, but i'm sure it's still going to be amazing. Bringing two skis out of Wildcat 116, K108, K96. What would you take? I've never been to the bird, Alta, solitude, DV, or Brighton before!

Also, if anyone wants to get in some weekday laps, or that saturday/sunday, let me know. Coming in from AZ.

[bigdude2468]

Question for you guys. Going to salt lake for the first time to burn my Ikon days on the 6th through 15th. Doesn't look like much snow, but i'm sure it's still going to be amazing. Bringing two skis out of Wildcat 116, K108, K96. What would you take? I've never been to the bird, Alta, solitude, DV, or Brighton before!

Also, if anyone wants to get in some weekday laps, or that saturday/sunday, let me know. Coming in from AZ.

The resident Wasatch snow expert had this to say today:

Next real chance for snow will be late Sunday or Monday of next week (March 8/9). Models not really in too much agreement other than to suggest we will have a chance for some kind of action. ECMWF ensemble means really do pick up there tempo thereafter though. We could see a series of systems after these dates. Something to watch...

If this is correct the 10th / 11th ...are trending the right way. Long way away but at least he not talking about a stubborn ridge building.

[mtskibum16]

Question for you guys. Going to salt lake for the first time to burn my Ikon days on the 6th through 15th. Doesn't look like much snow, but i'm sure it's still going to be amazing. Bringing two skis out of Wildcat 116, K108, K96. What would you take? I've never been to the bird, Alta, solitude, DV, or Brighton before!

Also, if anyone wants to get in some weekday laps, or that saturday/sunday, let me know. Coming in from AZ.

The Wildcat and K96 would probably make the most sense. Though I tend to prefer 108 as a daily, so I'd probably do that and the Wildcat. The K108 is probably a sweet one ski travel ski though.

[Luke Campbell]

Figured I’d put this here as well.

https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...57#post5908957

[slowroastin]

Are the WC108’s softer than pbj’s?


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[mr_pretzel]

Not really. Both are stiff skis

[SupreChicken]

Is the current deathwish softer or stiffer than the Wc 108?

[waxloaf]

Slightly softer, I believe


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[slowroastin]

Any info on next years lineup or top-sheet graphics?


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[skier666]

Tease: I’ve seen most of them and the new Wildcat & Deathwish are bad ass imho

[MegaStoke]

Any info on next years lineup or top-sheet graphics?

Yes, they’re sick.

[SupreChicken]

I have mounted a 2017 bibby with shifts as my dgaf about conditions/travel ski. Had a great time riding variable snow, groomers and park today. Need to get them into some pow, but...I don’t think that ski has an equal for versatility. A billy goat in variable snow, it is not, but it’s a damn good ski

[HAB]

I have mounted a 2017 bibby with shifts as my dgaf about conditions/travel ski. Had a great time riding variable snow, groomers and park today. Need to get them into some pow, but...I don’t think that ski has an equal for versatility. A billy goat in variable snow, it is not, but it’s a damn good ski

I need to convert mine over to Cast for that same role. Already have P18s on 'em so it's an easy jump. 100% with you on the versatility being incredibly good. Super super stoked on those.


Not to threadjack, but did you ever figure out that touring DD slot? I got back on my Ravens yesterday and man, those things are perfect for me in that role.

[lucknau]

TLDR: 193cm Chipotle Banana (190.5cm straight pull, 2300g/ski, 139-122-134 [mm] sidecut, 35.5m radius, full rocker) is a big fat badass all mountain ripper, and it’s also a powder ski.

So… for posterity, I should say that I did take the Chipotle Bananas out early in the season during the first day of a big windstorm. I made one run on the wind packed snow, and was almost taken down several times, repeatedly hooking edges underfoot. I didn’t know if there was too much tail, edges too sharp, or if the near white out was just fucking with my depth perception. I was pretty sure it was user error, but I got the distinct feeling that I was gonna get shook real good, so I swapped them out for the 191 goats, which handled that punchy snow with ease. Night and day difference in behavior, reaffirming again the power of the billy goat. I gave the Chipotle Bananas a bit of a detune: gummy tip to tail and a little more aggressive beyond the contact surfaces. Basic detune. Nothing too crazy.

After several missed opportunities, I was finally able to commit to taking them for a ride again. The day at Mt Hood Meadows began with 4 inches of cold, dry, fresh powder on top of the 8 inches of mildly tracked out snow from the last part of the day before. The sun was out, the wind was calm, and the entire resort was open. The day started out at 18 degrees Farenheit, and ended in the mid 30s. Snow conditions throughout the day ranged the gambit.

Low angle trees on four inches of cold fresh snow
Planes easily in powder, as it should. Just smooth and natural. Reverse camber makes them really pivoty and the surface area lets you bounce easily from turn to turn.

Steep trees on cold fresh snow ranging to around two feet deep
The turn radius is big. Steep tight trees are totally doable and very fun, however fast you want to ski them, but don’t expect to set a turn shape and let them complete the curve for you unless you’re hauling balls.

Connector runs: groomers
Fatskis that can lay a fucking trench. Holy shit. Even on late day, packed down, grooved up cascade cement, they are super stable.

The 2020 coastal alpine
This was the smorgasbord. Variable to the extreme. Started out on a twenty foot swath of shaved ice along the ridge line. To be honest, a couple of close calls this year on my comically detuned daily drivers have left me in a mild state of trauma where ice is concerned, and I’ve never eeked so timidly onto an icepack traverse. The CB 191s have a 35.5m turn radius, a lot of effective edge, and they are quite stiff. After a few icy traverses my paranoia was quelled.

Once the shade crust was behind me, the big, wide open A-Zone bowl was next. Snow was windblown breakable crust, which was what nearly took me out several times on day one. After a couple of shortish test turns I felt confident enough to open it up, and didn’t have any of the catchy underfoot feeling that I’d had originally, and they mobbed with authority through the broken up chunks from previous descents. The next open face presented even thicker, punchier snow with an additional thin suncrust on it, and still the ski maintained. Some relatively technical stuff, but the ski is substantial in the way it needs to be to maintain the trust and the joy.

More steep and low angle trees
So awesome in the fresh snow. Floaty, easy to turn, and hold an edge well on exposed crusty sections.

Higher up onto the alpine
My son and I decided to destroy our legs by hiking the 1000 foot vertical above the Cascade lift, so that we could ski even punchier, but less tracked out snow surrounded by a sea of glistening ice blossoms and sneaker boilerplate. So much fucking fun. I mean really. I’m flying down at speed, gouging new wiggle shapes into punchy crust and busting over old tracks, smiling the whole time.

Ungodly heavy afternoon chop
End of bluebird day, really warm, like you-can-see-the-water-in-the-snowpack warm, and we’re cutting through the spoils at this point. It’s like Morse code, finding the remaining poofy spots amid big roly chunks of chunder. Resort skiing here is inevitably crud busting and crud busting is fun with the right tool, and this is the right tool.

Comparing the 193cm Chipotle Banana to the 191cm Lithic Arlo 120 (Heavy core) and the 191cm RES Billy Goat
They all have distinct shapes, and each ski a bit differently. The Lithic and the ON3P are damper, but not by too much. The CB is less work by the end of the day than the BG, maybe a little more work than the Arlo, but again, not by much. I had to spend a little time figuring out how to ski the CB, but it turned out to be an easy learning curve. There’s more tail in the CB than the other two, and it’s not pin-like. In the CB, the absence of that blissful sloppiness granted by the pin tail is offset by the reverse camber almost, but not quite to the same extent.

So, it may be a self fulfilling prophecy, but they’re really what I hoped they’d be, which is a big stiff reverse camber ski that can take me all over the mountain in all conditions. I love the Moment build for this shape, too. Such a big ski, it weighs in at 2300g, making it very substantial yet totally manageable. I could happily pair a 190 Deathwish and the 193 Chipotle Banana as an all season quiver, probably swapping based on mood more often than conditions.

[TahoeJ]

Are the WC108’s softer than pbj’s?

Yes. Not by a lot, but enough that I can tell the difference for sure. Both are very stiff underfoot but I'd say the WC 108's flex is a bit more progressive as you get out towards the tips / tails.