Electric Bike Thread

[GiBo]

Ya, my bad. I have seen the conflict first hand with my own two eyes, but I shouldn't have been so ignorant. Who knew that on every single existing trail in Europe where for some unspecified "number of years" they have all been open to mtb mopeds, there has been absolutely zero conflict.

[joetron]

The only emtb riders i know or have seen are ex pro dhers, bike patrol at the resort, your favorite freeriders turned trailbuilders, and one buddy that rides on the reg with those freerider/builders. They all use them a lot. Some split even between eeb and dh, and one eeb, dh,xc, trials moto pretty even. Theyre fun and have their place and ive heard of no conflicts on the trails. Its still limited exposure though. In my experience ive never even come close to a collision with another trail user

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Dude, you gotta grasp that you and your locale are by far the exception and not the rule...and I still feel like there might be some exaggeration here.

What era pro DH? If they raced on 90s/early 2000 40-50lb bikes and didn’t jump on the enduro bandwagon, then I’m sure they like to ride forest roads up and single track down on heavy bikes.

Bike patrol: doing a job

Trail builders: Doing a job

No conflicts...remind us where you live again?

I’ll quit banging this drum, but you gotta acknowledge where you live is very different than where the meat of the bike market dollars are and how this impacts hard fought trail advocacy efforts


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[grinch]

Dude, you gotta grasp that you and your locale are by far the exception and not the rule...and I still feel like there might be some exaggeration here.

What era pro DH? If they raced on 90s/early 2000 40-50lb bikes and didn’t jump on the enduro bandwagon, then I’m sure they like to ride forest roads up and single track down on heavy bikes.

Bike patrol: doing a job

Trail builders: Doing a job

No conflicts...remind us where you live again?

I’ll quit banging this drum, but you gotta acknowledge where you live is very different than where the meat of the bike market dollars are and how this impacts hard fought trail advocacy efforts


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Ya its not very congested here but i think its fairly busy in squamish. Vernon and the loops less busy but more busy than revy. I guess we all need to put a location disclaimer now? Im just using my experience as a reference point. Its still in its infancy. Things will get ironed out. They have to. Theyre not going anywhere. Class 1 is harmless. I still pass people going the opposite direction. That experience is relevant to the hyperbole in here.
All the ex pros are still on the latest/greatest dh and enduro bikes and still crush. My non pro bud was sending 100ft gaps 2 years ago on his v10. Yes 100ft, daily. I cant say where but vids of the location are out there and that crew all use eebs quite regularly, and their dh bikes. Theyre all still very capable. Nuts some might say
Edit: i should add, i dont know the bike trollers but talking with a couple they were having to shuttle with the truck to sweep, or pedal the reg bike, until they got the eebs back. They were more than just happy to be riding them. It beats shuttling in the truck. The trail up is fun also and despite being young and fit they were grinning ear to ear

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[grinch]

Ya, my bad. I have seen the conflict first hand with my own two eyes, but I shouldn't have been so ignorant. Who knew that on every single existing trail in Europe where for some unspecified "number of years" they have all been open to mtb mopeds, there has been absolutely zero conflict.

"E bikes are not "bikes". They need to come up with a new name. It's a motorized vehicle just like a moped, motorized scooter or a dirtbike. How is this even debatable? "

I mean where does one start with stuff as dumb as this? Maybe youd care to reread or someone could explain it to you real slow? For the same reason i cant handle talking to kids or drunks i cant help you



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[GiBo]

"E bikes are not "bikes". They need to come up with a new name. It's a motorized vehicle just like a moped, motorized scooter or a dirtbike. How is this even debatable? "

I mean where does one start with stuff as dumb as this? Maybe youd care to reread or someone could explain it to you real slow? For the same reason i cant handle talking to kids or drunks i cant help you



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Eat a dick.

[grinch]

You mad bro? Out teh way!! Eeb coming through!! Fkn pleeb!!

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[mcski]

I mean where does one start with stuff as dumb as this? Maybe youd care to reread or someone could explain it to you real slow? For the same reason i cant handle talking to kids or drunks i cant help you

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Maybe you’d care to explain how the “e” is not a motor. Down here we have lots of trails for non motorized use only. Those two do not seem to compute for you. Until one or the other is reclassified, it’s a problem. Guess which one is likely to lose

[grinch]

It has been reclassified here and i thought it was in the states. Class1 is classified like any other bike. Non motorized because of the max speed and it has to be pedalled to move along with the power cap. The tourque and needed mobility for bike trails will necessitate the weight staying low. That will mean that the battery wont get too big, so that means the power assist has to stay at a moderate level or the battery chrge wont last. Lighter battery tech is atleast 10 years off. We'll only have minor advancements in the near future and thatll be mostly durability/service of the motor, wiring, battery. Enough time for things to settle out.
In the states i think all the classes are legal. I cant really have an infirmed comment on that. Im not sure how many of the class 2/3 bikes you'll see and their power and mobility is so varied. Maybe they have a place but for any trails ive been on im not looking to gain weight or lose mobility. As it stands here, ive passed many people on the trail, opposite dirextion or from behind while climbing and its just been the normal friendly passing without anyone being shocked by speed or whatever. The tourque is pretty good, although that will creep up a tad, and battery life is good and the max speed is good. There will be some fast flatter climb/down 2 way trails where it might not be adviseable(even class1) but for the most part the trail refulates the speed quite nicely. Most hammerheads should have enough experience to know what speed is safe on 2 way trails(blind corners etc) but therell always be entitled idiots. I keep that in mind whether im going up or down on whatever bike. Im training to avoid injury, like most

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[kidwoo]

Counterpoint: I've seen Pierron riding an ebike. He was wearing jeans, no helmet and he was riding the wrong way on an XC trail.

But a little while later, I saw him riding a "regular" bike, in proper biking attire (including a helmet), on a proper downhill trail. Incidentally, he was in the process of winning a world cup race.

that's what these things do to you man......gotta watch out for it

[kidwoo]

Ya its not very congested here but i think its fairly busy in squamish. Vernon and the loops less busy but more busy than revy. I guess we all need to put a location disclaimer now? Im just using my experience as a reference point. Its still in its infancy. Things will get ironed out. They have to. Theyre not going anywhere. Class 1 is harmless. I still pass people going the opposite direction. That experience is relevant to the hyperbole in here.
All the ex pros are still on the latest/greatest dh and enduro bikes and still crush. My non pro bud was sending 100ft gaps 2 years ago on his v10. Yes 100ft, daily. I cant say where but vids of the location are out there and that crew all use eebs quite regularly, and their dh bikes. Theyre all still very capable. Nuts some might say
Edit: i should add, i dont know the bike trollers but talking with a couple they were having to shuttle with the truck to sweep, or pedal the reg bike, until they got the eebs back. They were more than just happy to be riding them. It beats shuttling in the truck. The trail up is fun also and despite being young and fit they were grinning ear to ear

I'll try to sum up the point that lots of folks keep bringing up: The usa is full of entitled douchebags who are worried about what everyone else is doing all the time. An ebike is (and I'm quoting) "the bike industry's way of gutting the wilderness act" People really do believe that crap here. And they have money, which means they get laws. Canada just isn't (nearly as much) full of holier than thou twats like the usa is. Nor do you have the massive massive swaths of land where all bikes are prohibited like we do, which spreads use out. So regardless of how crowded squampton has gotten, it's just different, culturally, legally, and philosophically than where the people giving you a hard time live....which is universally in freedom land.

[livefreerdie]

I don't want to go too far down the rabbit hole because for me it comes down to having a motor or not and how that affects my access. But for the sake of clarity. In the USA, 750 watts:
Class 1. Pedal assist up to 20mph
Class 2. Throttle up to 20mph
Class 3. Pedal assist up to 28mph.
No requirements for how to measure, label or enforce at the moment.

for reference:
TdF racer. 450 watts
European e-bike. 250 watts
Canadian e-bike. 500 watts

[grinch]

I'll try to sum up the point that lots of folks keep bringing up: The usa is full of entitled douchebags who are worried about what everyone else is doing all the time. An ebike is (and I'm literally quoting) "the bike industry's way of gutting the wilderness act" People really do believe that crap here. And they have money, which means they get laws. Canada just isn't (nearly as much) full of holier than thou twats like the usa is. So regardless of how crowded squampton has gotten, it's just different, culturally, legally, and philosophically than where the people giving you a hard time live....which is universally in freedom land.

Ya i know its a little diffrrent. We have those people/i know , shocker. I just think common sense will prevail at some point. With the idiots, when laws are enacted eventually that you cant take a monstrosity throttle assist super power bike on the trails and the first idiot that smokes someone gets sued out the wazoo. The tone will be set. I think thats how it works there? Apologize for my ignorance but enforcement works here for the most part and im not including litigation, just signage and a finger wagging

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[grinch]

I don't want to go too far down the rabbit hole because for me it comes down to having a motor or not and how that affects my access. But for the sake of clarity. In the USA, 750 watts:
Class 1. Pedal assist up to 20mph
Class 2. Throttle up to 20mph
Class 3. Pedal assist up to 28mph.
No requirements for how to measure, label or enforce at the moment.

for reference:
TdF racer. 450 watts
European e-bike. 250 watts
Canadian e-bike. 500 watts

Thats good to have in here. With class 3 dont they have huge tourque that is useable with the big batteries? Maybe class 2 as well? Throttle is the give away, that and getting smoked by someone travelling at a ridiculous speed
Maybe the US wattage needs to come down, maybe ours too? As it stands 500w seems safe most everywhere

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[kidwoo]

Ya i know its a little diffrrent. We have those people/i know , shocker. I just think common sense will prevail at some point. With the idiots, when laws are enacted eventually that you cant take a monstrosity throttle assist super power bike on the trails and the first idiot that smokes someone gets sued out the wazoo. The tone will be set. I think thats how it works there? Apologize for my ignorance but enforcement works here for the most part and im not including litigation, just signage and a finger wagging

It's not even about actual events here. There's an entire industry that exists as non-profits that make their living scaring people on 'what if' supposition. It's not about reality, it's about the potential for a slippery slope. Someone hates the idea of a motorized bike so they send out misleading emails about some species that's not threatened and how it must be protected from logging, even if no one's even talking about logging an area. That really happens. Look up 'greater sage grouse' protection. That's not an endangered or threatened species here, you can even get permits to hunt them. But because a bunch of people want side by sides and motorcycles out of the desert, there's a huge campaign about how we need more wilderness in utah and nevada to protect this (not threatened) species. There goes the bike access right along with those designations, funded by people who live in manhattan and san francisco who have never even laid eyes on these areas.

So yes, we very much have problems here that canada doesn't. No one really cares about your bike with a motor, only what it means for access down here because it's a real concern. Not because of you, not because of your new found love in life, but because we're surrounded by assholes with lots of money and management sway. The existence of ebikes is used frequently now to just ban all bikes in an area because 'well, you can't tell the difference now, and we certainly can't have motors in this preserve/park/conservation area etc!' That struggle is real. Go ride. Be happy. But recognize that in this case, us murkins know what we're talking about.

[grinch]

Maybe the numbers will help, maybe not. It was only the amount of mtb users that clawed back what is there now.
Not my deal, and ill be farked if i have to put a geographical disclaimer but make no mistake, ill be prattling on and on especially after a rip on my everywhere fun machine. Is this a land access eeb thread? Maybe yall needz a land access eebers suck thread. I wont go there so yall can get ur hate on. Or maybe this is the trail access eebers get farked thread? I dont fkn know. Wheres wooley? Wooley to the courtesy phone? Can a fuck with gibo some moar? We coo?

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[kidwoo]

Maybe the numbers will help, maybe not. It was only the amount of mtb users that clawed back what is there now.

For sure. But speaking in a freedomland context that's finally happened here, but it took a loooong time.

I don't think anyone's genuinely mad at you or anything, I'm certainly not. Just frustrated that you don't understand what we deal with down here. All anyone's asking is that you understand the position a lot of people in the states have almost been forced into. And that making proclamations based on the canadian crown land perspective just doesn't hold water here. It's a different world when it comes to where the public can ride bicycles in the woods.

Like I said, not even I agree entirely with that position, I'd much rather team up with people are just pro-access and get groups like the wilderness society so marginalized they become irrelevant. But that's a big ask. And we have our own holier than thou douchebag mountainbikers who need to feel they're better than someone else too.

Can a fuck with gibo some moar? We coo?

Oh 100%!

[grinch]

Im just posting bikes unless im responding to someones slight. I dont mind responding in their tone to anyone. Ask a civil question get a civil answer, hence our convo. Moped or get a motoX and im a fuck wit ya. If i cant comment on their anti stoke, they cant commdnt on my stoke, deal? Im sure thatll solve erry thing/coombiyamofo

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[kidwoo]

I'm probably gettin one of these soon.




Suck it

[grinch]

Mcski just started hammering his pen with a rolling pin. He'll be here soon all triggered now. Im a be here pointing ^^^


Wait, now im triggered , is that a reverse mullet? Nonono
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[mcski]

Wtf , Am i living in your head?

I’ve got no beef (at least not yet w ebikes. My point has always been that profile wise they are nearly indistinguishable from peddle Power and unless something gets sorted out w all our non motorized trails, any future enforcement is bound to be bad for anything with wheels. The rangers aren’t gonna be bothered sorting out wattage or throttle differences. It’s a motor any way you sort it, so the eventually the trail designations will need to be addressed here

[kidwoo]

Wtf , Am i living in your head?

I’ve got no beef (at least not yet w ebikes. My point has always been that profile wise they are nearly indistinguishable from peddle Power and unless something gets sorted out w all our non motorized trails, any future enforcement is bound to be bad for anything with wheels. The rangers aren’t gonna be bothered sorting out wattage or throttle differences. It’s a motor any way you sort it, so the eventually the trail designations will need to be addressed here

Yeah like I posted earlier. They tried to in the Tahoe National Forest. Then the wilderness society and bunch of horseback harumphers sued them.

Like I said grinch: we can't have nice things here. Enjoy your lack freedom. At least until we invade you at some point for your oil or something.

[gravitylover]

I would love to advocate for e-mtb use on trails but I can't even get into parks department meetings to do so. I've been blocked from 3 counties around because "all you ever do is talk about how great they are and we need another opinion..." and the big meeting at the state level last week was invitation only and there wasn't a single e-bike advocate in the room for pretty much the same reason the counties gave me. I'm going to keep hammering away at it but you can only get told to get lost so many times before you say fuck them and just go ride wherever and whenever you want. When the powers that be won't allow you to play the game the legal and right way you have no choice but to ignore them and hope you don't get shot in the back when you ignore the ranger telling you to stop and ride away.

[sb]

Do Not Comply oar DNC it.

Reminds me of the 2A and the retarded rules that have been forced on us by anti freedom shitknuckles.

They ignore major problems and go after law abiding citizenry and pretend they are do something.

[jm2e]

It’s like masturbating. Once you feels the love, you’re gonna keep going back for more. Once you find out your mom and the church think it’s bad you stop talking about it, but you sure as hell don’t stop doing it. Some towns even call it sodomy and make it illegal, but you know better.
Once in a while a friend boasts that he’s never done it. You say “You’re such a good person with a strong character” and quietly walk away thinking they’re either pathetic or full of shit.


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[grinch]

Mines very spurty. I hammer on it and it just goes. All over!!

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