California is Burning (Again)

[Meadow Skipper]

A little off-topic, but hey. Wildfire fighters news from France.
https://www.rt.com/news/470986-paris...t-water-canon/

thousands of firefighters...are marching through Paris to demand better resources in order to tackle the increasing number of forest fires each year.

I’m in Paris at the moment and really wondered what all the ruckus was about. It’s something you don’t see in the US.

[LightRanger]

people in Colfax accidentally backfeeding into the grid from some sort of power generator (probably a real generator without a transfer switch, which is illegal but not uncommon), which can be very dangerous.

Wasn't me or a family member, I swear!

A little off-topic, but hey. Wildfire fighters news from France.
https://www.rt.com/news/470986-paris...t-water-canon/



I’m in Paris at the moment and really wondered what all the ruckus was about. It’s something you don’t see in the US.

The French are really good at getting people into the streets to steer policy. Much better than we are.

[Meadow Skipper]

The French are really good at getting people into the streets to steer policy. Much better than we are.

Not to get all polyass but that’s something we could learn from them.

[DJSapp]

Cougar, would you like me to take a photo of the ATS gear on my neighbor's house? It's right over my fence next to my BBQ.

Rush has made a career out of being a sensationalist, he can't be bothered by facts. Or the California building code.

People bootlegging generator connections and backfeeding the grid is a far greater danger. And it's not that hard to do either.

Sent from my Pixel XL using TGR Forums mobile app

[neufox47]

HA !

apparently with the blackouts because the power companies do not want to start more fires; anyone with a solar panel that has not engineered it to their house is without power as the solar panels do not actually power your house, they send energy from the panels to the electrical grid which is of course down; so they're in the dark with everyone else except those knuckle dragging fools that set themselves up with a natural gas tank.

just beautiful.

HA!
You are a fucking moron. The solar panels can power your house when the electric is out if you have a battery setup to do so. If you don’t have a battery, the power fluctuates and you’d be either under powering or overpowering the system most of the time causing all sorts of chaos. As I’ve said many times, it should hurt to be as dumb as you. #Dunningskouger

[DJSapp]

Hey, SkiCougar. Maybe you can forward this to Rush. It's PG&E's solar interconnection handbook that describes EXACTLY what is needed to protect the grid from home solar backfeeding. Found on the google with minimal effort.

https://www.pge.com/includes/docs/pd...n-handbook.pdf

3.8 System Fault Detection and Protection
The customer’s equipment must be able to independently detect phase and ground faults on the
PG&E system, as specified by Electric Rule 21 (i.e., For Machine-based generation without
Inverter-based interfaces, “sequential fault detection,” where the equipment is unable to detect the
fault until after the PG&E system has been isolated, is unacceptable). All required fault-detection
relays must coordinate with PG&E’s devices, as necessary

[splat]

Can't these idiots backfeeding their generation power simply throw the main electrical switches at the box/meter to prevent the backfeeding?

Skougar showing off his diploma from Rush Limbaugh University again?

[bodywhomper]

Can't these idiots backfeeding their generation power simply throw the main electrical switches at the box/meter to prevent the backfeeding?

Yes, they sure could.

[DJSapp]

Can't these idiots backfeeding their generation power simply throw the main electrical switches at the box/meter to prevent the backfeeding?

Yes. That said, cheap generators generate dirty power so I wouldn't recommend running anything more complex than a fridge off of this without a power conditioner.

[frorider]

Can't these idiots backfeeding their generation power simply throw the main electrical switches at the box/meter to prevent the backfeeding?

Skougar showing off his diploma from Rush Limbaugh University again?

Skougin’ it!!

He’s the lovable Golden Retriever of polyass.

[bodywhomper]

Yes. That said, cheap generators generate dirty power so I wouldn't recommend running anything more complex than a fridge off of this without a power conditioner.

based on FB scrolling and seeing the gennie's being sold locally and through HF, many people may be having future problems from running their electronics on "dirty" power from cheaper generators. i wonder if some of the "smart" fridges will have problems from not getting generator power through inverters. a reprieve is that people may be wiring transfer switches, which could allow an electrician or knowledgeable friend, to educate them about inverters.

There's going to be a lot of work available in generator fuel system cleaning/replacement at the next PISSPISS from generators running ethanol-ed fuel and the owners not going through the storage procedures.

[splat]

My RV has 4K Onan that I recently ran to my grow room via extension cords on a direct hookup separate from the panel while the utility had the power off. I drove by a utility guy and asked how long it would be since I had to run my lights off my genny and the dude is like, "So you're backfeeding our grid?" and I'm like "No, dude, I'm not one of those fucking idiots."
But Cali? Oh, fuck yeah, they'd kill linemen right and left if those power guys weren't expecting complete idiocy.
As an owner of an RV that is used once a year for burning man, putting Stabil in the gas for both the engine and the Onan, and running that treated gas all the way through the systems, it makes one helluva difference.

Bodywhomper - you talking about the Predator generators?

[SumJongGuy]

When our power is out, two to three times a year for a day or three, I run fridges, USB chargers, modem and router from a $400 generator with no issues.. Computers are relatively safe on the other side of the brick, or I would hope. Haven't tried running a TV or satellite box though I had considered it should we get bored with the radio after the internet goes down. I'd also take a shot at running a window A/C unit to cool one room if it's hot as hell when it happens.

I actually have a halfway decent power conditioner in line with my guitar amps and PA. No harm in dropping that at the end of the extension cord coming from the generator,, good advice!

[LightRanger]

There's going to be a lot of work available in generator fuel system cleaning/replacement at the next PISSPISS from generators running ethanol-ed fuel and the owners not going through the storage procedures.

Hell, I just said to spouse the other day that I wish I were an electrician, because there's going to be a LOT of work in the next couple of years for people wiring in transfer switches and whatnot.

[hercule33]

The power grid in the US was never the gold standard especially when compared to Europe. Europeans never had to deal with rolling blackouts or parts of the grid being shutdown because of fire danger. I am fine with not having the most reliable power in the world but now I wish that there was some Quality of Service agreement between customers and utilities. That would give utilities more incentive to do maintenance/upgrades and give customers a more consistent expectation of what kind outages they can expect. None of this everyone buys generators or solar panels at the same time because suddenly they can’t rely on PGE.

[Timberridge]

The power grid in the US was never the gold standard especially when compared to Europe.

They also got the opportunity to rebuild it completely in the 1950's. Most of the lower voltage is buried now.

[hercule33]

They also got the opportunity to rebuild it completely in the 1950's. Most of the lower voltage is buried now.

They did get a chance to rebuild but they could have cheaped out and not buried the lower voltage. PGE could also have factored climate change and higher fire risk into their risk mitigation plans. I have seen no evidence that they did that. Could of, would of, should of...

[bodywhomper]

Bodywhomper - you talking about the Predator generators?

yep.

regarding accidentally backfeeding into the grid: i really hope the linemen and tree crews include a method of confirming that there's no backfeeding before doing any servicing/repairs before re-powering lines/circuits.

[bodywhomper]

Next round of NorCal outage incoming. Looks like pge is predicting an outage for all of Nevada county west of donner pass and big chunks of el dorado and placer counties.

[LightRanger]

Parents new setup is going to miss this one and Sunday's (assuming it happens). But looks like the standby generator with dedicated 500 gal propane tank, auto-transfer switch, ranch panel, 8kw solar, etc. is going in next week

Not sure when they're putting in the fire suppression system and water tank.

[gnarbro365]

Fire in Sonoma County. "Not much hope of stopping the fire per the IC"... Sustained 30mph+ winds gusting over 50 with RH values in the teens.

Add to that the possibility of planned power outages already in affect in those areas downwind could make alerting folks of evactuations difficult.

Could be a long week for California. Forecast for the weekend looks nasty.

[LightRanger]

Luckily the Kincaid Fire, so far, burned mostly forest and then hit giant firebreaks with grapevines in them. Last I saw a couple hours ago was only two structures lost (at 10,000acs burned in like 12 hours from start). Amazingly lucky, it seems.

Sunday wind forecast is really scary.

Yo, BW, I heard in this shutoff they left the power on in town? GV/NC stay on? My folks went out at about 2pm yesterday, but dad said power was still on in the Colfax town limits.

[bodywhomper]

Luckily the Kincaid Fire, so far, burned mostly forest and then hit giant firebreaks with grapevines in them. Last I saw a couple hours ago was only two structures lost (at 10,000acs burned in like 12 hours from start). Amazingly lucky, it seems.

Sunday wind forecast is really scary.

Yo, BW, I heard in this shutoff they left the power on in town? GV/NC stay on? My folks went out at about 2pm yesterday, but dad said power was still on in the Colfax town limits.

In gv/nc, power was quickly restored in some areas of grass valley: a small portion of downtown area, Higgins shopping area, a part of brunswick commercial area, and the zone near the hospital. I heard that PGE has installed generators to run some of those zones. Pretty interesting, some areas are in full swing, while across the street, and at the lighted intersections, no power.

[bodywhomper]

Yubanet is very doom and gloom about the next event, especially in recent updates on the radio, as in the biggest wind event in a long time. But I’m not seeing it in the weather service forecast discussion. Where are they getting their information?

ETA: recent NWS forecast describes forecasted hazard more clearly.

[bodywhomper]

The Kincaid fire near geyersville is being reported in media as started by a transmission line, which was not de-energized. the distribution lines in the area were de-energized at that time.