New Season, New Tires, New Thread

[jackstraw]

Yeah, right on Toast. Thanks for that summary.

I rode a few new (to me) trails in the White mtns this past weekend. None of which are heavily traveled. One trail in particular was super steep with rollable drops, tight corners, just enough leaves, and roots. Oh, and it was wet. I wanted to kiss my DHF and my bike. Fkna technology! It was so much fun being gripped the whole way down. I don't want the season to end.

[One (+) Sentence]

I wanted to kiss my DHF and my bike. Fkna technology!.

It’s certainly hard to go wrong with a DHF, but to be fair, that design is at least 15 years old. True, if it ain’t broke don’t fix it, but I’ve been really pleasantly surprised with some re-designed German tires this summer.

Both Schwalbe and Continental have gone back to the drawing board and really addressed previous durability issues. Knobs don’t instantly tear off Schwalbes anymore. Magic Mary up front and the new Hans Dampf on the rear is really really good. Continental seems to have fixed their casing issues and the new tires hold tubeless better than anything I’ve seen before - like maybe lose 1 psi a week. Der Baron Projeckt up front and the re-designed Trail King in the back.

I actually prefer both of these combos to the DHF/DHR2 set ups I had been running for years. And this is coming from a guy who for a long time thought spending money on any tires that didn’t say Maxxis on them was a complete waste money.

[jm2e]

Every time I think about trying out Schwalbe again I realize three things.
1. I don’t understand their compound and layup options. And I don’t have the patience to figure it out.
2. They’re more expensive than Maxxis tires.


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[adrenalated]

^^What's #3??

[jamal]

Schwalbe has twe lines you should be concerned about: performance and evo. This year's performance line has better rubber and is officially tubeless ready. The evos are higher thread count and lighter and have nicer, and multiple, rubber compounds. I don't know all the versions but in the xc tires I look at the snakeskin is the more durable version like maxxis exo.

I tried some performance line racing ralphs this year and they have been reasonably grippy, roll ok, durable for my uses, and had an msrp of $62. Setup and sealed easily, made it through most of the year, and I only had one puncture, which actually sealed. Looks like 1600 miles on them since april. The rear is completely toast and I should have replaced it a month ago. Front still has some life left.

Downside of them is that they are kind of heavy, and even came out a good 30-40g more than listed. And on my older, narrow wheels, measure 2.1. Probably would be closer to the listed 2.25 on a 23-25mm internal width rim. I also felt like they were a little draggy the first couple times out but I had been riding on the road a lot up to then. Can't complain about the race results this year so they weren't slowing me down that much, but I'll probably go with the nicer evo versions for racing next year.

Current plan is put a performance nobby nic up front, move front tire to rear, run that for the rest of the season and into the spring, then put on fancy light tires for race season.

[Jonny Snow]

Good info, thanks a lot. I am thinking about this for my Chromag 29er hardtail. I currently have a Slaughter in back, which I like but is due for replacement. Given that I have a Range 29 for heavy-duty usage, I am okay running something faster on the hardtail over the winter.

Around here, we mostly ride mineral dirt with high sand content that doesn't clog tires when wet, so the tighter knob spacing does alright. In the summer, it's deep moon dust, loose and sketchy. But in the winter, it's tacky, velcro-like hero dirt, and I am thinking a rounder tire profile does better given that such a hard edge is not required for bite. I may give the Ardent Race a go.

I run a 2.35" Ikon on my hardtail, works good. The only problem is finding an equally large casing for the front - really need a 2.4 Ardent, Minion 2.5WT/2.4WT or equivalent.

The Aggressor is also always an excellent choice.

[One (+) Sentence]

Every time I think about trying out Schwalbe again I realize three things.
1. I don’t understand their compound and layup options. And I don’t have the patience to figure it out.



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The compound nomenclature on the new high end tires is something like: Speed, Soft, and Ultra Soft

Not too hard to figure out. I can’t speak to their older tires.

I understand why Maxxis is so popular, and rightfully so. But, to some extent I think they are resting on their laurels. They dominate OEM spec and aftermarket sales. Been seeing lots and lots of warped casings and tires blowing off rims (especially DD tires) but maybe that’s to be expected with so many of them out in the wild. They make good on their warranty, but it generally takes 2-3 months.

[bagtagley]

I'm fine with tire companies resting on solid tread designs. It's not rocket science, and there's not going to be some big breakthrough in tread design that changes the industry. Same with compounds. It's this same circular BS where the same stuff is re-released with different names. What I'd like to see is work on flat prevention, particularly pinch flats. I'd pay a premium for an existing tread and compound that doesn't pinch flat.

[Jonny Snow]

Have any of you guys actually looked at MAXXIS's full current PDF catalog? It's massive. They make more tires than anyone that I'm aware of. That's not including tires made in the last 10 years that are discontinued but still available in the market.

[Dantheman]

I'm fine with tire companies resting on solid tread designs. It's not rocket science, and there's not going to be some big breakthrough in tread design that changes the industry. Same with compounds. It's this same circular BS where the same stuff is re-released with different names. What I'd like to see is work on flat prevention, particularly pinch flats. I'd pay a premium for an existing tread and compound that doesn't pinch flat.

Agreed. I think it was Spats who posted something years ago about the MTB tire design process mostly consisting of sifting through bins of random Lego pieces while on mushrooms. Things are a bit better now but it still rings true.

[One (+) Sentence]

I'm fine with tire companies resting on solid tread designs. It's not rocket science.

Just imagine if ski designers felt that same way in 1994.

[rideit]

^^What's #3??

Profit!!!

[Danno]

^^What's #3??

that he's bad at math?

[jm2e]

^^What's #3??

#3. I’m Easily Distracted


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[mmmm...pow!]

I'm fine with tire companies resting on solid tread designs. It's not rocket science, and there's not going to be some big breakthrough in tread design that changes the industry. Same with compounds. It's this same circular BS where the same stuff is re-released with different names. What I'd like to see is work on flat prevention, particularly pinch flats. I'd pay a premium for an existing tread and compound that doesn't pinch flat.

Pinch flats? Is it 1999? Ditch the tubes, problem solved. I've never understood people that complain about flats. In close to 20 years riding tubeless, I might have flatted 5 times where the tire couldn't get resealed on the spot, a few complete tears and maybe once or twice the rim got dented. And it's been a long while since the last one, bit I'm thinking most or all of those were on regular tires that weren't supposed to be used tubeless. I weigh 210, ride a mid travel bike with lower end wheels about as hard as it can be ridden on rocky trails several days a week, and ride my tires until there is no tread left. No inserts, no downhill tires, but maybe a bit more Stan's than recommended which never gets replenished once the tire is mounted. Makes me think some people are doing something(s) wrong.
Sure, improvements are always welcome, but when you actually think about the demands placed on a relatively thin piece of rubber, having a sharp rock rip a hole every 3-4 years seems rather reasonable to me.

[grinch]

Jinx!! Vibes bro

[mmmm...pow!]

haha, yeah, already thought about that. It's been a few years since I had to use a tube or do the walk of shame, so could be due. I did actually pop the seal on my tire a few weeks ago, but that was user error and I managed to re-inflate it. Hopefully that still counts for me and I'm good for the next few years.

[toast2266]

Pinch flats with tubeless setups are a thing. I've pinched like 3 tubeless tires this summer.

[Dee Hubbs]

mmm...bop you must run your tires at a high pressure. What PSI are you running?
At 210lbs on a 6"and 6" bike with a 27.5 x2.4 tubeless tires, I'm running 22 psi in the front and 24 psi in the rear. I would love to get a little lower but that gets into frequent pinch flat territory. I get 2 pinches a summer at the pressure. I'm wiling to get hose pinches for the performance I get from that psi. If I want no flats and bouncy, traction less tire I'd run 30psi.

[gravitylover]

I ride 27.5x2.8 @ 18rr/16ft and 3.0 @ 17rr/15ft and haven't pinched even once. I did get a rock through the casing once at high speed though.

[skaredshtles]

My god... you guys must be smooth as butter or ride on smooth/rounded rocks. I've pinch flatted tubeless more times than I care to recall.

That being said, it's still less than when I was running tubes.

With a standard Maxxis EXO casing tire out back I run 29-30psi and *expect*, on certain trails, multiple rim strikes and just simply hope to not pinch-flat.

With Michelin's Advanced Reinforced casing out back I'll drop the rear to 26-28psi, but will still get occasional rim strikes and have pinch flatted that casing once when I was a bit lax on making sure the psi was appropriately set.

~185 all geared up, so I'm not a clydesdale.

[Danno]

Go on a diet, fatty.

[skaredshtles]

Go on a diet, fatty.

Woody: What are you up to, Mr. Peterson?
Norm: My ideal weight if I was 7'9"

[grinch]

^^im with you on that. 1100g tires at 28rear and 24front with hack Norris in the back and I have no problems on my trail bike and a few rim strikes on my end/fr bike when shuttling at 165-175lbs. EXO/grid weight tires no chance. I’d prefer dh casing tires for the shuttles but I also pedal that bike. Generally a smooth non bike breaker but our trails can be quite raw steep and rocky
Took my trail bike (125r/150f scout) on the dh trails yesterday. Tires were fine at my settled upon psi and construction but bottomed out my suspension front and rear more than I have all year
The Michelin’s have protected my rims a bit better than the same weight onza citius fr/end and minion dd dhf

[adrenalated]

I'm 155lbs geared up and have pinch flatted many times tubeless. Fuck, I just had to replace a brand new Exo casing 2.4 rear tire because I had 3 plugs in it in the first 50 miles, and a brand new 2.5 exo casing front at the same time. 20psi front 28psi rear, checked religiously every ride.

Granted, I ride fairly rocky trails and have very little talent...

Now running doubledown in the rear and cushcore on both ends to compensate for said lack of talent.