DPS Phantom Glide

[jackattack]

I spend maybe $15/year on wax, about 500g of Toko universal covers the quiver.
Apply wax at the end of the season for storage, scrape in the fall, and re-apply when things start to feel sticky.
2.5kg, incl shipping, for the price of one shot of PHANTOM.
And I get to hang around the garage fondling skis, listening to tunes and drinking beer.

I'm also skeptical of the watershed effects of hydrocarbon wax. I used to know some people at the SLC Water Quality office. I don't remember them ever mentioning that ski wax was a contributer to watershed pollution. They were much more concerned with solid waste, soot and fuel from transit/automobile traffic in the canyon. I suspect the environmental angle is pure marketing.

[jackattack]

If you follow the links, there is a bunch of information coming out.

This graph represents the difference between conventional waxing and phantom.

Attachment 214976

Exactly what information can you distill from that graph? Is the time scale in minutes/hours/days/years/runs/seasons? Where are the adjustments for frequency of base grinds? It's just an illustration to support their copy.

DPS is nothing if not consistent in their color palette.

[Lindahl]

Looks like the colder the snow, the worse it performs in comparison to wax. I like how their cold snow graph compares it to universal wax? What about those sub-zero days when the last thing you want on your bases is a universal wax.

Requires a periodic base grind? and slower than wax? No thanks.

[grskier]

Really, as someone who used to wax his skis ad nauseum, then just stops, this is a great product. If you are someone that waxes all the time, and enjoys your time in the garage/wax room, well....

That said, I used to wax all the time because after 3-5 runs, I felt the difference and knew I wasn't really skiing on wax after a few runs.... Now I have kids and don't have the same bench space.

So, it's a pretty broad niche IMHO.. but if it's not your cup o' tea....

[grskier]

Looks like the colder the snow, the worse it performs in comparison to wax. I like how their cold snow graph compares it to universal wax? What about those sub-zero days when the last thing you want on your bases is a universal wax.

Requires a periodic base grind? and slower than wax? No thanks.

How often are you waxing? Seriously interested.

[grskier]

I got an email back re: the base grind question already and Phantom should last beyond a base grind.

[BrandonH]

I wonder if this is like the ceramic coating that the vehicle detail industry has been using?

You apply this coating instead of a carnauba wax and it lasts for many years....maybe 5-10 depending on sun, etc.

[PNWbrit]

How come DPS the company that pretty much invented the $1000 boutique ski business needs to raise only $35K of kickstarter money for this industry changing product?

Stinks.

[Norseman]

I got an email back re: the base grind question already and Phantom should last beyond a base grind.

Yes, they claim that it hardens the whole thickness of the base material... or at least to a depth that would tolerate a few grinds.

It's not a surface finish, but an alteration to the base.

If the base gets hairy and slow with time, I suppose you could still wax over it with some regularity to avoid the base grind... but then what's the point? Longer intervals between wax jobs, maybe? Would the wax bond as well as to an untreated base?

[Mofro261]

Looks like the colder the snow, the worse it performs in comparison to wax. I like how their cold snow graph compares it to universal wax? What about those sub-zero days when the last thing you want on your bases is a universal wax.

Requires a periodic base grind? and slower than wax? No thanks.

The way I read it was that the treatment penetrated the base such that an occasional base grind to either re-flatten the ski, remove abrasion ie base hairs, or a grind after base repairs would not require an additional treatment. Doubt there are that many out there that re-grind skis for spring anymore, but that'd also be a possibility. If you don't base grind skis ever, then waxing is probably less important in terms of getting good glide.

[geo039]

How come DPS the company that pretty much invented the $1000 boutique ski business needs to raise only $35K of kickstarter money for this industry changing product?

Stinks.

Word!

[I've seen black diamonds!]

How come DPS the company that pretty much invented the $1000 boutique ski business needs to raise only $35K of kickstarter money for this industry changing product?

Stinks.

That's my question.

[skiitsbetter]

If the charts are true, why aren't the nordic guys who are most picky about waxing using this stuff in warm temps if it performs better than normal wax?

Do skins stick to it? HF and LF wax don't.

[doebedoe]

If the charts are true, why aren't the nordic guys who are most picky about waxing using this stuff in warm temps if it performs better than normal wax?

Do skins stick to it? HF and LF wax don't.

Because it's easier to make a chart with theoretical performance, than it is to make a chart with real world environmental data.

[nest]

How come DPS the company that pretty much invented the $1000 boutique ski business needs to raise only $35K of kickstarter money for this industry changing product?

Stinks.

Typical DPS skier- highest ratio of money spent to actual skill of anyone on the mountain

[adrenalated]

How come DPS the company that pretty much invented the $1000 boutique ski business needs to raise only $35K of kickstarter money for this industry changing product?

Stinks.

I'll bet a normal product release wouldn't have brought in nearly $40k in a matter of hours.

[PNWbrit]

I'll bet a normal product release wouldn't have brought in nearly $40k in a matter of hours.

It's just skeezy for a company that sells as many $1k+ skis as they do.

[Mailman]

How come DPS the company that pretty much invented the $1000 boutique ski business needs to raise only $35K of kickstarter money for this industry changing product?

Stinks.

Why would you risk your own money to fund an initial production run when you can risk someone else's instead?

Do skins stick to it? HF and LF wax don't.

I listened to the Blister podcast. I'm skeptical about it generally as a replacement for wax, but they did highlight fewer issues with skins as a selling point. They said it sticks to the surface of the ski, and you don't have to worry wax globbing up your skin glue.

[PNWbrit]

Why would you risk your own money to fund an initial production run that you when you can risk someone else's instead?

Or because the product sucks?

you don't have to worry wax globbing up your skin glue.

Does anybody currently worry about this?

Unless they're doing it wrong.

Edit to add... what kind of impenetrable packaging does this stuff come in ?

[Stikki]

So is this basically deep penetrating Zardox Not Wax?

[Tele 'til You're Smelly]

Looks like the colder the snow, the worse it performs in comparison to wax. I like how their cold snow graph compares it to universal wax? What about those sub-zero days when the last thing you want on your bases is a universal wax.
.

Yes that's my question too- needs to be compared to cold wax for cold snow and warm wax for warm snow.

[shirk]

How come DPS the company that pretty much invented the $1000 boutique ski business needs to raise only $35K of kickstarter money for this industry changing product?

Stinks.

Marketing YO.

[#######]

Where's the MSDS? oh wait, that would expose the collusion between Zardoz, 3M, Dupont and Rustoleum.

[grskier]

Yes, they claim that it hardens the whole thickness of the base material... or at least to a depth that would tolerate a few grinds.

It's not a surface finish, but an alteration to the base.

If the base gets hairy and slow with time, I suppose you could still wax over it with some regularity to avoid the base grind... but then what's the point? Longer intervals between wax jobs, maybe? Would the wax bond as well as to an untreated base?

That's sorta when the grind would be SOP

[The Dad]

How come DPS the company that pretty much invented the $1000 boutique ski business needs to raise only $35K of kickstarter money for this industry changing product?

Since they're supposed to ship a month from today, I doubt that they "need" to raise anything for it. It's good promotion.

Although if they'd failed to make that target (they already have), it would be great way for them to find out that the market isn't there.

Typical DPS skier- highest ratio of money spent to actual skill of anyone on the mountain

Ummm... there's a lot of competition there.


The Volkl V-Werks series should be in the mix too.