MAKE TAHOE DEEP AGAIN ~ 2016/17 OFISHUL SNOW/FOOD/WHINE & STOKE THREAD

[The Dad]

My wife really wants to do a ski lease at Squaw next season (infrastructure/restaurants/yoga studios/99% of all our friends are on N. Lake) of and the one thing I'm worried about is the drive. I'm stressed thinking about it now. Of course, first world problems...but still. Looking for walking distance to the lifts next winter (avoiding car at all costs) if anyone has any beta or knows anyone.

Check out shuttle route options too, including Chariot. Bear in mind that the Squaw/Alpine Shuttle stops at the parking lot at the base of Alpine Meadows Road, right next to a bunch of condos that may be more reasonably priced than other options at the base of either mountain.

(I'm pretty sure Skier666 is in the parent crowd), not so great when you're wrangling small children AND ski gear at the same time.

Which means whatever you do, you really want a gear locker at the base.

Happy to talk about our experiences with the kids teams at Alpine, which may or may not be terribly similar to Squaw's.

[FormerKnuckleDragger]

Check out shuttle route options too, including Chariot. Bear in mind that the Squaw/Alpine Shuttle stops at the parking lot at the base of Alpine Meadows Road, right next to a bunch of condos that may be more reasonably priced than other options at the base of either mountain.


Which means whatever you do, you really want a gear locker at the base.

Happy to talk about our experiences with the kids teams at Alpine, which may or may not be terribly similar to Squaw's.

We heard great things about the Alpine kids program, particularly for the really young ones. We're happy with the Shooting Stars program at Squaw though - they had both kids doing snowplow turns by the end of the first day, and now our kids want to take us down the mountain run (they turned 4 in December). If we didn't have a family cabin in the valley, I would have pushed for Alpine or Sugar Bowl though.

[TurxSki]

...Bear in mind that the Squaw/Alpine Shuttle stops at the parking lot at the base of Alpine Meadows Road, right next to a bunch of condos...

Is that new?
I thought the AM/SV shuttle only picked up/dropped off at the base area stop?
(Have only ridden it once this season though).
The "tart" does stop at River Ranch.

[Ottime]

I went to Squaw last spring with my then 4 yr old. Mountain Run was burned out near the bottom and he did not want to down hike. He will be stoked if it is still open when we get three this spring.

I mentioned Squaw to him this morning and he is stoked to get back up there. The upper mountain Siberia to Granite was just his speed. A few steep runs connected by several moderate runs.

He also found the tram and funitel amazing.

[StormDay]

My wife really wants to do a ski lease at Squaw next season (infrastructure/restaurants/yoga studios/99% of all our friends are on N. Lake) of and the one thing I'm worried about is the drive. I'm stressed thinking about it now. Of course, first world problems...but still. Looking for walking distance to the lifts next winter (avoiding car at all costs) if anyone has any beta or knows anyone.

Don't limit yourself to walking distance. Once you're in the valley, it's not a bad drive traffic-wise to the parking lots, particularly if you have to go early enough to drop kids off for ski team. If you absolutely must be walking distance, I'd suggest trying to rent a condo in the village proper, or a place west of the post office. Any further out and you're walking on Squaw Valley Road, which isn't something I've seen people do.

Also the drive from the Tahoe City side is not bad if you are going for early for team (particularly Alpine). We are at lake level in Sunnyside. 15 minutes to the Alpine parking lot with no traffic. We leave early enough to make sure there is no traffic.

Ditto on The Dad's locker comment: It makes things with ski team so much easier (extra gloves, clothes and etc...). Based on other parents' comments about moving from Alpine to Squaw, the locker rooms at Alpine seem more relaxed. Squaw locker rooms are bigger and bit more uptight on the rules.

We have had at least one kid on an Alpine team for the last 9 years. It is a smaller program which will allow you to have more input on getting your kid moved between teams. Plus, you will quickly get to know everyone involved. We have been very happy. That said, if your kids get serious about racing or big mtn. You will probably want to more them to the Squaw teams for coaching and skiing with higher ability teammates. Next year is probably our switch year for the racer in the family.

[FormerKnuckleDragger]

Also the drive from the Tahoe City side is not bad if you are going for early for team (particularly Alpine). We are at lake level in Sunnyside. 15 minutes to the Alpine parking lot with no traffic. We leave early enough to make sure there is no traffic.

Ditto on The Dad's locker comment: It makes things with ski team so much easier (extra gloves, clothes and etc...). Based on other parents' comments about moving from Alpine to Squaw, the locker rooms at Alpine seem more relaxed. Squaw locker rooms are bigger and bit more uptight on the rules.

We have had at least one kid on an Alpine team for the last 9 years. It is a smaller program which will allow you to have more input on getting your kid moved between teams. Plus, you will quickly get to know everyone involved. We have been very happy. That said, if your kids get serious about racing or big mtn. You will probably want to more them to the Squaw teams for coaching and skiing with higher ability teammates. Next year is probably our switch year for the racer in the family.

A locker is great (and yes, the Squaw members locker room attendants can be strict if you look like you don't belong), but it takes some planning (or lots of extra gear) if you ski at more than one mountain. We bought a parking pass for the parking structure next to the locker room for a couple hundred less than what a locker costs to rent. Works pretty well, plus we don't worry about the lots getting full.

[skier666]

Thanks for all the tips/experiences guys...

Just looking to change it up...we do have a family home in South Lake but all but one of the families that ski on a regular basis are up in North Lake and its nice to get the kids to ski together etc. The main culprit is our 3rd kid that is almost 10 months old. Day trips obviously aren't viable with him in tow so the main reason for Squaw is to have terrain dad loves to ski, infrastructure that is stroller friendly so the parent not skiing can meet up for lunch or at the Chamois at the end of the day....without having to get into the car. Yes, I know this is exactly why Squaw wants more development to cater this scenario but I digress. It that fine line of keeping everyone in the family stoked...from Dad to Mom, ha. Don't get me wrong, if I was a single parent with my two older kids, I'd probably just do a ski lease at Kirkwood or Sugar Bowl and go strictly for the skiing. We get enough of the hustle and bustle of SF each morning by the time we drop off our two oldest kids at two separate schools each morning. Honestly, Kirkwood is tough with young kids...especially on storm days. There's almost nowhere to go with room to roam. There's basically just Monte Wolfes, the Wall Bar and Snowshoe Thompson's and on a weather day, even if mid-week there is nowhere to sit. Red Cliffs is just too far away from everything.

My kids aren't really interested in a strict racing program but we are looking in putting them into the general/freeride program of the Ski Team. Noted on the lockers and parking pass.

I'm actually headed up tonight with my 5 year old daughter. Skiing Squaw tomorrow solo (putting my daughter in a lesson) and planning on skiing Silvy and KT most of the day (depending on softening). Skiing Saturday morning with my daughter and then headed back to SF for Sunday Little League for the 8 year old. Shoot me a PM if anyone wants to take turns or meet for a beer at the Chamois at the end of the day.

Kirkwood side note - I did talk to Coop the other day and apparently uphill hiking at Kirkwood after they close is now 100% fair game. He said you just need to call ahead to see if any heavy equipment is being used and to stay out of those areas.

[hercule33]

Some base improvements would not be horrible. It would take a lot to make the place crowded, including building and filling more beds and/or multi level parking garage. There is just not enough space to park all the cars wanting to come in on busy days. Keeping it different is key, IMO. They could actual sell that if they were smart enough. But they have tried to homogenize into Vailnilla. That is what killed the Inn and Bubs.

To make it work as part of the Vail family, they need to put some money into infrastructure. Otherwise the Epic crowd won't come. It is fine that the road closes, but they need to be prepared to take car of their lodging customers that are in the valley. They ran out of food during one of the last few storm cycles. I've worked in food service most of my life, and spent several years in the education sector. We kept 21 days in inventory, meaning we would be able to create some sort of meal for our students for 21 days in the case of an emergency or natural disaster. This does not require a lot of space, as most food is kept in dry storage. How a resort can't make it through five days is beyond me. BTW, this is not a new problem, it existed pre Vail.

A few upgrades to lifts and services would mitigate the boom/bust to KW. Packed on a advertised powder day, half as many the next, empty the next. I skied between Xmas and New Years and never waited in line. That is absurd. It was blue bird, mid 20s, loose tracked and packed powder, filled in - basically Epic* conditions , and Vail could not attract customers. BTW, that KW Only Pass, w/o black outs is pretty awesome if you like to ski that time of year.

I don't think Vail cares too much about the ski experience at Kirkwood or investing in infrastructure. From a financial point of view they have bigger fish to fry like integrating Whistler/Blackcomb and coming up with their world pass.

The biggest advantage I see for Vail owning Kirkwood is the extra season pass sales it generates. Let's face it, Vail makes most of it's money off people in the Bay Area, not ski bums. If you are a traditional "Vail" skier you will be happy with Northstar and Heavenly, however, if you like more challenging terrain you won't. That's where Kirkwood comes in. I think Vail is hoping that the addition of Kirkwood will increase the sale of their full Epic Passes because in addition to Kirkwood advanced Bay Area skiers would get Whistler plus a whole bunch of European resorts.

As for the infrastructure improvements to Kirkwood, while needed, I don't think they make financial sense for Vail. Let's be honest, Kirkwood hasn't seen an infrastructure upgrade in over a decade. They could use new lifts, snow cats, paved parking lots, better food/lodging options etc. These aren't cheap things and the ROI on these investments doesn't make a lot of financial sense now for Vail. If Vail wants to increase traffic to Kirkwood, better marketing would be the cheapest way. It's kind of sad.

[FormerKnuckleDragger]

Honestly, Kirkwood is tough with young kids...especially on storm days. There's almost nowhere to go with room to roam. There's basically just Monte Wolfes, the Wall Bar and Snowshoe Thompson's and on a weather day, even if mid-week there is nowhere to sit. Red Cliffs is just too far away from everything.

I spent many a half-day in the comfy chairs next to Wildflour when my kiddos were the same age as your little guy. Lots of parents in the same situation down there.

[NakedShorts]

Red Cliffs is just too far away from everything....

.

Incorrect, 2 minutes to a lift... & Plenty of room to roam upstairs... It is kid central and a great day of lounging and snow play. We take turns and meet new families with kids. My little man has a LOVE for Kirkwood and he is not even 2. We get everything into the lodge in 1 trip from the car, we can use the loading zone if needed.

I live in South Lake and love the "Experience of The Ski Day" that the drive allows. Even with our slow chairs I feel like I get much more "Skiing" than a trip to Heavenly. Wait in lines all day or Behind your Wheel with your own tunes.

No Friends on Powder Days (& No Kids) - Get a sitter, leave them in town, and have a fun day skiing.

You know this as well as anybody Kirkwood, Sugar Bowl, Homewood, and Rose are the only Mountains with Soul (edit: Donner & Sierra too) . Alpine once had it and KSL sucked it dry. I do not like SV (aside from a couple zones that place is Over Rated)... Almost got arrested on a x-mas stay once for trying to hawk my families tickets - we did not want to ski a windy & bulletproof Red Dog lift and had 2 of 3 day tix.

Don't even get me started with all you Flatlanders that travel the 80 and MUST pass SEMI's with NO REGARD for others. F$CK THAT !

Ski Sugar Bowl if you must leave the Wood...

Although (unconfirmed) a little bird told me that AM/SV is being sold to Mammoth...

[mcski]

I'm chuckling at you telling 666 about Kirkwood.

[NakedShorts]

He really does know better. Just reminding him before he ends up kicking himself in the ballz. At least we will see some new features hit on his vidz. Besides it would only be for 1 year

[TahoeJ]

I'm chuckling at you telling 666 about Kirkwood.

Heh, my reaction too. Maybe they can give him a tour of the mountain? I completely get the wife and three kids factor and friends always around there... uh, cause that's me too.

Also, Squaw is not overrated. There are days there with that terrain that are pretty damn amazing. I'm going to miss those days.

A little annoyed by no more exchange between Squawlpine, Sugar Bowl and Sierra. Oh well. Just pulled the trigger on the mountain collective for the first time so now I have to squeeze in a Utah trip next year with 2 days at Alta, Snowbird and Snowbasin. And then a few days at Squawlpine after Sugar Bowl closes. Oh and Mammoth of course.

[NakedShorts]

Also, Squaw is not overrated...

And you bought the pass (not me). I have always wanted to ski Silverado on a powder day...same as most of you with Squaw passes this year.

[Ghetto.Creek]

Heh, my reaction too. Maybe they can give him a tour of the mountain? I completely get the wife and three kids factor and friends always around there... uh, cause that's me too.

Also, Squaw is not overrated. There are days there with that terrain that are pretty damn amazing. I'm going to miss those days.

A little annoyed by no more exchange between Squawlpine, Sugar Bowl and Sierra. Oh well. Just pulled the trigger on the mountain collective for the first time so now I have to squeeze in a Utah trip next year with 2 days at Alta, Snowbird and Snowbasin. And then a few days at Squawlpine after Sugar Bowl closes. Oh and Mammoth of course.

I mean while you're in Utah you might as well trek up, ski Sun Valley, Jackson, and Pebble Creek. I think I am getting the mountain collective next year as well.

Bonus 3rd day to the place of your choice and unlimited 50% offs. Gonna be a good year of travel.

[lepistoir]

Just a friendly reminder to
STAY IN THE BREEZEWAY!

[Gaperious Basterd]

Mashed potatoes last week at Tahoe.

[old goat]

Drove Old 40 today--since yesterday a couple of very big wet snow slides off the west ridge of Donner Peak and one down the Poop Chute--all top to bottom. They all looked big enough to bury someone.

[bodywhomper]

666 is becoming a free agent?!

Do what Metzler does. He seems to be mixing it up at various ski hills with and w/o the family pretty well.

I agree about kirkwood and kids. I can't believe they still have that "tent" at timber creek. How long has it been there? Over 11 years. It was supposed to be temporary.

I think granlebaken is the answer.

[Paul Blart]

Drove Old 40 today--since yesterday a couple of very big wet snow slides off the west ridge of Donner Peak and one down the Poop Chute--all top to bottom. They all looked big enough to bury someone.

Lots of cornice falls the past few days. I was out in that Donner Peak area this morning and anything south/east facing had just turned to slop. Definitely hoping for these temps to stay down with this next storm cycle

[TahoeJ]

^^ It's gonna be blower.

Ok, well, powder.

Ok, well, heavy Tahoe powder.

Ok, well, Sierra cement.

Fuck, it's going to rain.

Pretty sure I nailed it there somewhere...

[TurxSki]

...He also found the tram and funitel amazing.

Did you know, that downstairs in the Tram Building you can see a bunch of the bull wheels, and cables and whatnot all spinning around and doing their thing?
Steampunk? Hah!

[Gaperious Basterd]

And that box elevator thing in the tram building is straight gangsta. Feels like the elevator astronauts ride to reach the shuttle cockpit before a launch.

I bet when that was built it was all the hot fuss.

[skier666]

I've got 35 years under my belt at Kirkwood...so yeah, no need to explain Red Cliffs. Yeah, its the place where I used to ski Whiskey so I could ski down to the sundeck and meet my dad for lunch. Oh boy, they even had sick arcade games against the Eastern wall of the lodge. I guess my point is that from Red Cliffs to Chair 6 is quite a trek and my wife doesn't want to just hang in an old lodge. Now if that place was a bit more updated with decent food, then we are getting somewhere. On a side note, my daughter says she hates eating lunch there during Mini-Jets because they have to walk back to Chair 11...haha.

Of course, I'll still venture back to KW here and there...ARE YOU KIDDING??? Its my favorite place to ski...period.

Bottom line, I'm just talking a season or so...until my youngest can actually stand up in a pair of ski boots. Telluride is a great example of we as a family can feel right at home. No driving, extreme hiking terrain to long beginner runs and an actual town that has tons of stuff going on. Yes, its expensive.

[Paul Blart]

Had a few hours to kill before work this morning and spent some time poking around Trestle