OFFICIAL I70 BITCH THREAD....

[stfu&gbtw]

Once again I'll say it. The feds aren't going to loan us tens of billions to fund a road for tourists and front rangers to get to the mountains easier.

We need a population decrease. Any ideas on how to pull that off?

How much did you lose taking the Titanic over the iceberg?

[Danno]

Once again I'll say it. The feds aren't going to loan us tens of billions to fund a road for tourists and front rangers to get to the mountains easier.

We need a population decrease. Any ideas on how to pull that off?

True. But maybe they will to fund infrastructure improvement to a critical artery of interstate commerce.

It's all in the marketing.

[Rideski]

Well if they could send at least some of the interstate commerce through States with dry roads and without two 11,000 foot mountain passes it might help a little.

There were some interesting facts in the article, but how can you take the author seriously when he comments on the dudes fucking loafers instead of tires? Seriously an article that comprehensive and no mention of tires?

I was on the chairlift with a guy a few days ago that had rented a car. I asked him if tires were ever mentioned by the rental company, no.

[Danno]

In the grand scheme of 70, tires are not the problem. Doesn't have any effect on summer traffic which is worse than winter traffic, and only has a noticeable effect on bad winter weather traffic, which isn't so much a 70 problem as it is a skier problem.

Don't get me wrong, tires are a big deal. But tires have zero effect on our infrastructure problem.

[Rideski]

Do they do metering in Summer? Honestly I don't travel 70 a ton in summer, and certainly never peak times. Not too frequently peak in Winter either, usually can plan around it unless an awesome storm and can't stay up there.
Does 70 close due to wrecks for hours at a time in Summer?

[simple]

How much did you lose taking the Titanic over the iceberg?

Not even worth a response. You are comparing a major infrastructure improvement to an accident?

[Danno]

Do they do metering in Summer? Honestly I don't travel 70 a ton in summer, and certainly never peak times. Not too frequently peak in Winter either, usually can plan around it unless an awesome storm and can't stay up there.
Does 70 close due to wrecks for hours at a time in Summer?

No idea re metering, but summer volume is higher. As for wrecks, I'm sure that they are a lot less common. But I'm guessing the powers that be are going to view that as mostly a simple function of snow vs no snow, and not something that could be ameliorated by working to address tire issues. And regardless of whether they thought they could make an impact, the ultimate reality (and they know this) is that the root cause is too much volume.

[The SnowShow]

Do they do metering in Summer? Honestly I don't travel 70 a ton in summer, and certainly never peak times. Not too frequently peak in Winter either, usually can plan around it unless an awesome storm and can't stay up there.
Does 70 close due to wrecks for hours at a time in Summer?

I'm pretty sure they meter in the summer. Usually if we're up, we wait out traffic having dinner on Lake Dillon or in town.

[The SnowShow]

Once again I'll say it. The feds aren't going to loan us tens of billions to fund a road for tourists and front rangers to get to the mountains easier.

We need a population decrease. Any ideas on how to pull that off?

A couple of long, frigid winters?

[rmnpsplitter]

If you took $20 from every car that went through the tunnel you'd have roughly 250 million $ based on last years #s. you can build a lot of shit with 250 million $.

[stfu&gbtw]

Not even worth a response. You are comparing a major infrastructure improvement to an accident?

I'm comparing human intention vs nature. You can wish for a smaller population all you want, but there's no stuffing the genie back in the bottle. Everyone wants some magical economy in which they and their friends and family all have good jobs that pay well and offer good benefits, they have access to great recreation, education, peace, quiet, housing is nice and affordable, they're surrounded by people they like and agree with, and most of all, no one else is coming to compete with them for their spot.

The moral of the story is that Denver has two futures... One is economically prosperous, and the other is not. If you were financially situated in such a way that you could live comfortably in an economic wasteland, you'd be doing so already. Your Cartman-esqe pipe dream of letting in just enough people to enable your lifestyle doesn't exist.

Pro tip... Go short on order, long on entropy... Not the other way around.

[galibier_numero_un]

Difficult to talk about this meaningfully without pushing it over to the Polly Asshattery forum.

In the 1950's, under a Republican administration, we saw fit to build an interstate highway system. In the new millenium, the US takes a 3rd world approach to infrastructure (transportation, broadband, etc.), whether it be for new projects or for maintenance.

There's not much left to spend when 50% of your Federal tax dollars go toward funding half of global arms spending. Anyone remember the peace dividend? Compound this with Coloradans voting in TABOR, and the result is this thread. It's pretty shocking when a conservative state like Utah is ahead of us on this.

... Thom

[hatchgreenchile]

It's good that Colorado has taken care of more bleeding wounds first. T-Rex, US36 and Cosmix are done, Fastracks is progressing along, and I70 through Denver should kick off soon.

As bad as I70 can be, it's just not bad enough to be the top priority. We still can leave early, stay late, go to Eldo or RMNP, go different routes in the summer, get a hotel, etc. etc. The article puts the total 6 lane expansion cost with Floyd Hill stabilization and new tunnel tube at $4.5 billion. Compared to the $15 billion figures thrown around for a train, it's a deal. When combined with non stop bus service from numerous park & rides across the metro to the resorts in winter and to the towns in summer, it could be effective.

Crazy idea..Since CC County doesn't want to become a parking lot, I wonder if there's any viable route that could be designed outside the current alignment. Ex. Keep westbound lanes along the current route to the tunnel, send the eastbound lanes towards the south and 285. If bullshit, please disregard.

[smmokan]

It's good that Colorado has taken care of more bleeding wounds first. T-Rex, US36 and Cosmix are done, Fastracks is progressing along, and I70 through Denver should kick off soon.

The work on 36 was a patch job for what CDOT actually promised voters (and will never deliver on)... light rail to Boulder and Longmont.

[hatchgreenchile]

The work on 36 was a patch job for what CDOT actually promised voters (and will never deliver on)... light rail to Boulder and Longmont.

Yeah, 2042 for funding on that section, only put a single set of tracks to Westminster. I'm sure there are a myriad of reasons that their initial projections didn't work out, but it sounds like B&SF railroad really put the screws to them. At least the new 36 is pretty sweet.

[Danno]

The work on 36 was a patch job for what CDOT actually promised voters (and will never deliver on)... light rail to Boulder and Longmont.

To be accurate, they never promised light rail, they promised rail. The plan was always to use existing track, i.e. What I've sometimes seen referred to as heavy or commuter rail.

And that plan was flawed from the start. Did you ever look at the actual route of that track? See time estimates for a trip on a hypothetical commuter rail? The bus is faster. And will be for quite some time.

[smmokan]

For maybe a few years... based on the amount of development currently happening in Westminster, Broomfield, Erie and Superior.

[Danno]

Fair enough. But the design was still flawed, as are all of RTD's rail lines. Not a single one has even a third track, so there's no such thing as an express train. So even if the line was direct and didn't meander like the existing track, it would still take 45 minutes to do a trip that takes 25 right now on the express bus. That train would be mostly empty for years.

[simple]

Your Cartman-esqe pipe dream of letting in just enough people to enable your lifestyle doesn't exist

Letting in? I'm talking about population control like forced castration and limits on children. Not some BS "too many people here" complaining. The earth has too many people not just Colorado.

What I find funny is that you ran away from the overly crowded, traffic ensnared, hostile east coast. They never figured out how to get the infrastructure to work to support the people there. They just allowed for sprawl and the economics just worked out who has to sit in a car for hours. So you think with you enlightened brain that I70 is going to be a different story? You fall right back into that sad feeling that it is already too late. It can't be fixed. You claim it is because of a lack of trying but you should just admit that it was too small a cooridor to begin with. It's over man. Admit it and deal with it like the rest of the people here.

[joetron]

It's pretty shocking when a conservative state like Utah is ahead of us on this.

What Colorado needs is some good old-fashioned Mormon development graft to really get the wheels moving. Surely somebody in the statehouse knows someone down at the Ward house who has a cousin sitting on some land that would make a great transit oriented development, parking lot or ROW.

[fastfred]

Yeah, 2042 for funding on that section, only put a single set of tracks to Westminster. I'm sure there are a myriad of reasons that their initial projections didn't work out, but it sounds like B&SF railroad really put the screws to them. At least the new 36 is pretty sweet.

pretty much rtd lied about their light rail projects, the costs, and the actual design it was the biggest bunch of bullshit ever given to the citizens, so now your asking people to trust cdot with billions of dollars in more tax revenues, why should anyone trust them to actually do what they say they will do, cdot will hire lots of more managers and very few workers, the managers will justify their jobs, by making more rules and more paper work for them to push around instead of actually putting the money into paving projects and worker bees

rtd fucked up massively by trying out some new road crossing gate technology that was never proven, now rtd is wasting millions by posting guards and police 24 hrs a day at all street crossings, they have been building railroad crossing gates for how many years and rtd can't seem to get it right? Who is paying the bill for that screw up, they'll tell you someone else, but it's tax dollars

rtd knew from day one that a line would never be built to boulder, but they needed boulder county tax dollars to help subsidize the metro denver construction

I'll bet it still won't get built in 2042

[Danno]

^^^^

hard to disagree with any of that

[The SnowShow]

Low hanging fruit would help during busy periods:
-Actual enforcement of chain/traction laws so pileups don't happen as much.
-Big fines for those who disregard them.
-No semis Friday night, Sat AM, Sunday PM
-Fix the fucking potholes.

Not expensive compared to expansion or train, but these would help.

I don't even mind when I70 is rolling at like 30-40 mph the whole way from Floyd Hill to Georgetown HIll during busy periods. It's the dead stop crawls for an hour plus that kill ya.

[Name Redacted]

You guys ever get the feeling that this conversation is a little bit circular in nature?

[The SnowShow]

You guys ever get the feeling that this conversation is a little bit circular in nature?

It's on a monthly repeat.