Who rows? (Concept2)

[mobygrape]

hit 1:50/500m on some 500m repeats. Really fast for me. Then my back told me to slow it down.
Really need to start doing a bit more core work.
still, took more than 1:00 off my 5k time. I think the woman rowing next to me thought I was going to pass out. Almost did after I got off of the machine.

[iceman]

So I'm getting deeper into it. I feel good. Going faster all the time. What's up, rowers?

[Mazderati]

Ice, what kind of splits are you rowing? I'm going 2:00 minutes for a 2:00 split and then 2:00 minutes for a 1:50 split for a warm up two days per week. Walking on an incline two (sometimes three) other days.

[iceman]

Not really sure about the splits exactly, I pick a distance and go for that.

[mobygrape]

got out on the water a few times last week, felt great! Pissing down rain here, will probably hit the erg in an hour. A couple of 5ks or something at a more moderate pace.

[Cono Este]

That machine kicks ass. I've been using mine at the gym, doing 2000 only after my general 30 min biking, trying to get back into it slowly. Today I tried to bust 8 minutes on a 2k, failed and nearly killed myself. I dont know how guys are doing 6:30's, and then doing 10k's at ridiculous times. Technique is huge, probably worth some proper instruction. Im definitely putting one in my house soon. Probably best piece of equipment you can buy for less than 1k.

I also think its a great exercise if you lift alot too. Scapular support etc..prevents injuries.

[lionelhutz]

I dont know how guys are doing 6:30's, and then doing 10k's at ridiculous times.

Painfully training. A Lot. Like any sport, technique, practice and a fair amount of suffering.

Injured meniscus prevented me from rowing/erging this summer. A real bummer. Shell sat dry since July. BOOOO.

[mud]

New goal, trying to stay above 45 rows per minute over 2K.
Changing the resistance down to 2 or 3 really helped technique, I was doing it all wrong before with it pegged at 10.

[iceman]

Why do you want to row so fast? It's all about how fast the boat (erg) is going, not how many strokes per minute you're doing. Speed of the boat (erg) is a direct reflection of how much work you're doing.

I just passed 350,000 meters on the thing...I'm a long way from home!

[PearlJam09]

In the last 2 weeks, I've done a 30 minute time trial: 7700+ meters, and 2x2K (7:08, 7:15). Loving being back on the erg. Hopefully getting that 2K time back under 7 minutes soon.

[The Suit]

New goal, trying to stay above 45 rows per minute over 2K.
Changing the resistance down to 2 or 3 really helped technique, I was doing it all wrong before with it pegged at 10.

If you are rowing 45 strokes/minute on a Concept II, your technique is almost certainly a disaster.

In my racing career, the only time we hit 45 spm was for maybe 10-20 half strokes coming off the stake boat at the start of the race.

[mud]

If you are rowing 45 strokes/minute on a Concept II, your technique is almost certainly a disaster.

In my racing career, the only time we hit 45 spm was for maybe 10-20 half strokes coming off the stake boat at the start of the race.

Probably is a disaster, I'm only using it to get my heart rate between 170 & 150, not make varsity crew.
I can average 2K at 3 resistance in between 7 and 8 minutes and not feel too worked, I figured if I bumped up my average 30 spm to 40 or better it was improvement.
What are some good baselines to aim for?
Total jong here.

[BurnHard]

^^ Yup.

When I rowed varsity we'd have days on the Ergs when we'd be told to stay at 18-20 for practice. We'd have to force ourselves to slow down the recovery to a crawl. In a race, we'd spike to maybe 45 sqm for the initial quarter & half strokes off the start, and settle into anywhere from 28-32 for the 2K. We never had the Erg resistance any higher than 3, ever.

Wow, I miss varsity rowing.

[warthog]

Probably is a disaster, I'm only using it to get my heart rate between 170 & 150, not make varsity crew.
I can average 2K at 3 resistance in between 7 and 8 minutes and not feel too worked, I figured if I bumped up my average 30 spm to 40 or better it was improvement.
What are some good baselines to aim for?
Total jong here.

22 - 25 spm is what I aim for.
Try to burst off with your legs harder than you are.
At 45+ spm, you are basically just going as fast as you can with no real resistance.
Let the wheel(water) slow down a little, bury your ass closer to your feet, and really burst out of the gate, then pull with your back, then arms last. Repeat at 22-25 BPM. Now, the only way to improve your speeds is to improve your burst and strength. You'll feel it.

If that doesn't get your heart rate over 150, you need to get better technique, and apply to Ivy League schools ASAP.

[PNWbrit]

What are some good baselines to aim for?

Slow down, make more power, do some research/get some training on proper form.

[mud]

I'll switch over to wattage and report back.
Someone had a laptop hook up one day checking stats but I didn't bother to check what program the Concept GSA was running.

[iceman]

Mud, here's the rankings calculator: http://log.concept2.com/rankings.asp

Plug in your age/distance (or time)/weight class (165 is the heavyweight/lightweight divide) and see where you fit in and where the best people finish. Use the high/low to narrow in on a specific age if you want. I have no idea about you, but for example I just plugged in a 30-year-old lightweight and the fastest time for 2000 meters in 2012 was 6:24.

Here's the pace calculator: http://www.concept2.com/indoor-rower...ace-calculator use it to figure out how fast you have to maintain in order to finish in a certain time or to find the pace you rowed if you rowed a certain amount if time (like 30 or 60 minutes for example).

the concept2 forum is very boring but a good place to find tips and get answers to specific questions: http://www.c2forum.com

edit: clarimification

[mud]

^^ damn that place has it all, thanks!

[Oarhead]

I had not seen that Dynamic model at all. Pretty interesting looking. Anybody try it out? How does it compare to being on the water?

[hafilax]

I posted it in the crossfit thread but anyway...

Rowed a 9:14 2500m a few weeks ago in a WOD. Damn near killed me. Took me a half hour to get normal enough to drive home. I was happy to beat a lot of bigger guys given that I'm 5'8" 160#. We have a former high level rower giving tips which was great.

Fast hands, then hips, then knees... drive!

She also has us set the foot straps low so that your knees don't limit the catch.

[The Suit]

Probably is a disaster, I'm only using it to get my heart rate between 170 & 150, not make varsity crew.

The concern is that you are much more likely to hurt yourself trying to row at an elevated pace. Your heart rate will elevate plenty rowing at 20-25 spm once you learn good technique, so focus on technique first.

In some ways dialing down the resistance on the erg is similar to the feeling you on the water as your boat gets faster. Each stroke is quicker and more explosive, but you are still putting out as much power.

[BurnHard]

Fast hands, then hips, then knees... drive!

EH?
Pretty much the opposite - tight core & hips for strong initial push via the knees/quads keeping arms fully extended, then strong lower back and upper back/lat pull, then very last pull hands fast into belly/plexus region. Then, slow hands back out to fully extended, and slowly climb the rails back up until knees fully bent.

[sf]

New goal, trying to stay above 45 rows per minute over 2K.
Changing the resistance down to 2 or 3 really helped technique, I was doing it all wrong before with it pegged at 10.

[hafilax]

EH?
Pretty much the opposite - tight core & hips for strong initial push via the knees/quads keeping arms fully extended, then strong lower back and upper back/lat pull, then very last pull hands fast into belly/plexus region. Then, slow hands back out to fully extended, and slowly climb the rails back up until knees fully bent.

I was describing the recovery at the end of the pull. That's what she was coaching us on. Bar hits the chest then release the hands, bend the hips, once the hands are past the knees bend them, reach far. This was for keeping a stroke rate pushing 30 s/m.

[Wes Mantooth]

I was describing the recovery at the end of the pull. That's what she was coaching us on. Bar hits the chest then release the hands, bend the hips, once the hands are past the knees bend them, reach far. This was for keeping a stroke rate pushing 30 s/m.

Handle shouldn't hit the chest, it's a waste of 2" or so of connection. The ideal stroke on an erg or in a boat starts at the catch with the heels coming down using only the quads, then as soon as the heels are down you engage the hamstrings to keep your body angle (think box squat) then a deliberate and dynamic snapping open of the hips (think dead lift) and then drawing the hands in as a way to keep connection and keep pressure on the face of the blade. As soon as weight comes off the foot boards, the stroke is done, and the hands come out at the same speed as they came in, you establish body angle by rolling your hips back and pointing your tail bone towards the bow of the boat, and then your knees come up to the catch again. At the catch the blade(s) should be in the water while you're still rolling forward and there should never be a pause at the front end. Also any extra body angle between body over and the catch will cause your blade to sky before entry and it's a waste. You don't want to ever thing about reaching, more rotating the shoulders and compressing the hips.

As far as erging, our challenge for the fall was to log 500,000 meters of extra aerobic work between September and mid-November. It was tough to do combined with 3-4 hours of practice a day but a good feeling to be done