Real Estate Crash thread

[Benny Profane]

Nope, just posting the news. Think of it, though, 30 grand for a Boca one bedroom. oy gevalt. And there wasn't a bunch of speculators tripping over each other to do it.

[powder11]

suck on it Benny!

http://www.boston.com/business/artic...k_to_bargains/

[grrrr]

News headline yesterday called prices here still overvalued by 26%. think i'll wait for those killer auctions.

Just out of curiosity I did some real estate searching in Detroit. $1,200 will buy you a nice 2 bedroom fixer.

[powder11]

Just out of curiosity I did some real estate searching in Detroit. $1,200 will buy you a nice 2 bedroom fixer.

You will pay more for the D9 that eventually has to knock it down.

[khakis]

That's pretty funny...I bought my bicycle at a Wayne Wheat auction

I wouldn't take that 30k condo at face value, though that area is one of the hardest hit in the country. Could have 200k in assessments, back taxes, and liens against it.

[skier666]

^^^^^^

Exactly....

[Benny Profane]

I wouldn't take that 30k condo at face value, though that area is one of the hardest hit in the country. Could have 200k in assessments, back taxes, and liens against it.

Are you sure? This is the first I've heard of this. Isn't all that wiped out by the foreclosure action?

Oh, and a big red line gets crossed through the Ft. Myers area. trash.

[LeeLau]

Foreclosures don't wipe out liabilities in any jurisdiction in North America. Person on title is liable for back-taxes, demo fees, cleanups etc

[Benny Profane]

So how would one know at an auction if these liabilities existed without a title search and such?

[khakis]

One wouldn't. That's why auction transactions are a gamble and executed in cash.

[LeeLau]

yup and that's why the ebay $ 1 bids for crap properties are such a mugs game.

[Benny Profane]

Well, fine, but a lot of these auctions allow a little time (maybe a month) to inspect the property and such. Is one able to to a title search and investigate other obligations during this period? I mean, I'm sure that there are sleazy people in the biz, but the reputable auction houses have to be on the up and up, right? There's a lot of word of mouth and return biz, I'm sure. They'll have a lot of auctions for the next five years, at least.

[mcsquared]

The auction houses work for the banks. Actually usually it is an auction run by the county. Anyways, bank usually* does a bid of $1 more than they are owed. And if you bid one dollar more you can have the house, cash, no inspection and no guarantees about liens, etc. If nobody bis more than the bank than the bank takes title and then tries to sell it through an agency. If you buy a foreclosure through an agent, ideally most of the title issues get cleaned up when you close. But future HOA assessments etc are still out there. And when there isn't a functioning HOA who knows what could happen later.


*lately I have seen banks bidding much less than they are owed.

[LeeLau]

All things are local but there's no one central clearinghouse for all the possible liens that can attach to property outside of title. Eg. enviromental, unpaid trades, unpaid rural taxes (usually you can check munis for taxes), various attachments from various city or county. Basically, it's not that easy to check that stuff and no guarantees are offered for those types of searches.

[mock vomit]

Me thinks there is confusification between a "sheriff's sale" auction, and a lender/investor's resale auction here... in the later I'm pretty sure you usually get good/insurable title to property, like here; http://williamsauction.com

Of course real estate laws/customs/title methods vary by state, so YMMV.

[LeeLau]

Fine article - Why Housing isn't coming back. Or you better like that bag you're holding

[grrrr]

That is what the realtors around here were touting. House prices were holding, but the length of time on the market was getting longer and longer. That has now translated into falling prices. A 1 bedroom condo in glacier was listed at 179k 2 years ago, then 189k a year ago, now listed at 114k. Long market times = denial about falling prices.

Now reduced to $98,000.

[comish]

Me thinks there is confusification between a "sheriff's sale" auction, and a lender/investor's resale auction here... in the later I'm pretty sure you usually get good/insurable title to property, like here; http://williamsauction.com

Of course real estate laws/customs/title methods vary by state, so YMMV.

What he said. There are auctions by the trustee that in LA County are held on the steps of the courthouse and are the step where the Bank typically ends up with the property. As another poster mentioned above, previously the banks would offer what was owed on the loan. Now, housing prices have fallen so far and banks don't want to own property, they are listing new, lower prices right before the auction. My understanding is that at the trustee auction, you get what you get, and therefore all title searches, property condition searches, etc. need to be done prior to handing over the cashiers checks that are required payment for the property.

There are auction houses that are auctioning properties, but this is typically happening once the homes have already been foreclosed on and sold at the above trustee sale and therefore you are buying from the bank. In these I believe, although I don't really know for sure, that most title issues have been worked out.

Some markets are close to hitting bottom, some are a long way from it. It all depends on the local submarket, when they started declining, demand, and the ultimate factor is the jobs situation.

[LeeLau]

guys - not all auction sales by auction houses offer clear title. Many are "as is, where is". Again, it all depends.

[mock vomit]

guys - not all auction sales by auction houses offer clear title. Many are "as is, where is". Again, it all depends.

This well may be, but also; not all aution sales by auction houses offer possibly clouded titles either.

[John Smoke]

Today I took pics of soon to be foreclosed/foreclosed homes for a company and filled out the best I could some info. In hindsight most were occupied and most likely are spy pics for the bank. Its a realtors job but went on vacation. Pretty good money for being a depression here.


My estimates.
The house 10 feet from me is in the first phase. I'd reckon it'll be 45 k or less, for the next owner. Commercial double lot, worthless but livable home.

The one up the street I'd say 65k or less, kinda nice place for a person like me, a dump to you .

And a bunch of other nicer stuff and some backwoods shit that would make most feel for their safety. Esp when shit is everywhere , people are around , I roll up , start taking pictures and the mortgage hasnt been paid for 6 months. I was wasnt at that one for long.

Everything but culture, economy, mountaineering, extreem skiing and rock climbing.

[Benny Profane]

WSJ

APRIL 24, 2009, 10:19 A.M. ET
In Real Estate, A New Class of Haves and Have Nots
As bargain sales of distressed homes soar, financially healthy sellers may need to slash prices to compete.
By BRETT ARENDS

Is real estate cheap yet - or is it still expensive?

Maybe it's both.

The latest data from the National Association of Realtors, which rattled nerves on Wall Street this week, showed national home sales are still weak. But they also showed how home sellers nationwide have split into two camps.

Call them "the haves" and the "don't haves." As in: Those who have to sell, and those who don't have to.

The haves are the distressed sales. These include those in foreclosure, and those in pre-foreclosure "short sales." Such sales are now booming - at bargain prices.

On the other hand, those who don't have to sell are often hanging on to 2006 prices. And they are hanging on to their homes.

Prices aren't dropping. And homes aren't selling.

This could be ominous. It suggests - though it does not prove - that another shoe could be about to drop in real estate, as those who don't have to sell realize they need to compete more aggressively with those who do.

The latest housing numbers tell a story.

According to the Realtors, there were 360,000 second-hand (aka "existing") home sales last month. As the headlines noted, that was down about from a year ago, when sales were 375,000.

But remarkably, distressed sales - foreclosures plus short sales -- now account for more than half of all turnover nationwide.The figure was 53% in March.

"This is the first month that has gone over 50%," says Realtors association spokesman Walter Molony. "It was stable for five months at about 45%."

That means March saw about 190,000 forced sales. No wonder prices are in free fall.

A year ago, says Mr. Molony, distressed sales made up just 18% of the 375,000 transactions. That's about 68,000 sales.

In other words, the number of distressed sales has nearly tripled in a year.

That's the good news. That's a market clearing, at last. Distressed sales are taking place at prices at least 20% below the rest, the association says.

On the other hand, look at those who aren't in foreclosure or a short sale. They're selling their homes while still solvent. This used to be called the normal housing market.

Prices haven't come down much. In some premium neighborhoods they have may even be rising.

But the volume of those "normal" sales is down sharply. They make up just 47% of 360,000 second-hand home sales. That's 169,000 transactions.

How little is that?

Even a year ago, when the housing market was already in the tank, these non-distressed sales accounted for 82% of 375,000 second-hand home sales nationwide. Or 308,000 transactions.

It's like the old joke about the man with the million dollar dog ("Well, I haven't sold him yet!").

When a real estate market collapses, volumes die first. Prices fall later. So news that volumes are drying up for non-distressed sales has to be an ominous sign.

Those who live in premium neighborhoods often fancy that they are immune from the slump. "Oh, good quality will hold up," they say. It's true good quality may hold up for awhile. But that doesn't mean anyone's immune.

And over long terms, different real estate markets have to maintain some reasonably persistent connections. Otherwise many people would move to the cheaper neighborhoods.

The trade now -- in theory, at least -- may be to sell the place in an upscale neighborhood like Pacific Heights in San Francisco, if you can, and buy a foreclosure deal out in the 'burbs.

[bean]

It's probably going to be ugly for a long time in housing, as people who don't have to sell eventually have enough and decide it's time to move, realize they won't be getting out from underwater, and mail in the keys. L-shaped recovery, so on and so forth.

[Sea 2 Ski]

Well, my neighbor just put up their 2 BR 2 1/2 Bath 1500 Sq. Ft. Condo for $430K and it is priced to sell in a month. I'll check back in a month.

[Sea 2 Ski]

Well, my neighbor just put up their 2 BR 2 1/2 Bath 1500 Sq. Ft. Condo for $430K and it is priced to sell in a month. I'll check back in a month. Two others have sold over $400K.