Why I don't want a WRX anymore (or any fast, fun car)

**Jer** · 11-29-2007, 09:43 PM

Man, I can't believe they went and did that, I had that idea years ago and tried to get some patents on it but it was held up for some reason they never explained to me so I think they took my idea cut me out of my royalties.

But while I was working on it I noticed a few weak points in the system and I was worried about it then but now I can sell them like people used to sell the radar detectors and still make a lot of money. PM frorider for details. No paypals!

**Shen** · 11-29-2007, 09:51 PM

Tale of Outlaw Racing, with the US as a Course

**dirtybryan** · 11-29-2007, 09:54 PM

Not sure if the info below is in the Snopes article or not, but...

Well for starters, there are no easy pass check points on the Northway (I-87). Therefore they would have to have sensors that could read your ezpass when your rolling at 65mph or faster. Also it would never fly since it would seriously undercut all the money NY put into the ezpass system and all the hope they had that it would alleviate congestion.

**Dexter Rutecki** · 11-29-2007, 09:58 PM

I don't think having sensors for people going over 65 would be a problem, there are EZ pass tolls on 87 that you're allowed to go through at 50, I think.

**The AD** · 11-29-2007, 11:57 PM

Originally Posted by Benny Profane

Don't doubt it. I mean, this was probably a paranoid email thing I received, but, as I said, the technology is there.

Yeah, I certainly agree with that. They definitely (or definately if you prefer) could do it, they just haven't crossed that line yet.

**Benny Profane** · 11-30-2007, 12:35 AM

Well, I'm not the paranoid type, but, yeah, it's just a few asshole state senate amendments to bills away. Don't think the laws can't be changed, for crying out loud. Of course, in New York, it will be done to take care of the gadget people who will make zillions. But a lot of the local towns and counties upstate who make a LOT of money from tickets will have to get theirs, too.

Did any of you know that a lot of your newer cars have black boxes? Yup, get into an accident, there's data for the lawyers to mine. But, hey, I'm not paranoid, I say......

**dirtybryan** · 11-30-2007, 12:43 AM

Originally Posted by Dexter Rutecki

I don't think having sensors for people going over 65 would be a problem, there are EZ pass tolls on 87 that you're allowed to go through at 50, I think.

I haven't seen any ezpasses like that before. That said, there are no tolls on I-87, at least from Albany on North.

**Benny Profane** · 11-30-2007, 12:47 AM

No tolls, but plenty of bridges to attach the suckers to, and they'd be damn hard for the public to get to. Ever notice the cameras on a few of them?

**miniracer** · 11-30-2007, 10:19 PM

I always wondered why it was legal to make a car go faster than the speed limits. The car manufacturers should be held liable for cars that go faster than the speed limit.
It not my fault its the cars.

**glenn** · 11-30-2007, 11:38 PM

EZPass is a private organization. They handle the tolls for the government, but all the hardware and the DB's that link the RFID numbers to actual people are privately owned. In your EZPass contract there is information specifically about the systems are not and will not be used for speeding infractions.

It will take a court order for those records to be turned over. Thus it is not one legislative move away from happening.

**Benny Profane** · 12-01-2007, 12:15 AM

EZPass info has been used in all sorts of civil and criminal cases since the inception. I remember reading about a divorce case using the data just a few months after they installed it. To me, this is the only reason I pass by hundreds of people in line at the cash lanes sometime. A lot of people have a lot to hide.
But, really we are this (forefinger and thumb about an inch away from each other) far away from having every car in the tri state area implanted with some sort of tracking device, either in the plates or the stickers, or the car itself.

**JBrian** · 12-01-2007, 02:09 AM

Originally Posted by miniracer

I always wondered why it was legal to make a car go faster than the speed limits.

(Most) guys like cars, some of those guys make laws and the sports car demographic spends a lot of money on their toys - you work it out.

The car manufacturers should be held liable for cars that go faster than the speed limit.

Shut up and just stay in the right lane, especially on powder days, ok??

RFID tags are easily defeated by homemade EMP devices:
Here's one solution.

How much for the WRX??

**tex1230** · 12-01-2007, 07:02 AM

1) glad in live in connecticut

2) turning off my ezpass on longer trips

3) My address is for rent to all you new yourker who want an out of state registration without the chip. Price tbd.

**The Dad** · 12-01-2007, 08:22 AM

Originally Posted by Evil E

there has to be a jammer for that shit....
for EZ passholders ... you be screwed.

They actually ship with a jammer -- the bag the give you to put the thing in when you want to pay for a toll manually.

Originally Posted by Shaggy

I wonder where the "unreasonable search" line will be drawn on this kind of stuff.

I can't imagine how. You're not speeding in the confines of your home, but on a public thoroughfare. But it's early, and my imagination might be uncalibrated.

**Cono Este** · 12-01-2007, 09:18 AM

Awesome, now everyone can slow down to 20 under the limit to avg out their speed. NOt exactly a move towards efficiency.

But shit, at least no one will be tazered.

**BigDaddy** · 12-01-2007, 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by iceman

Drive fast as shit. Eat a nice leisurely lunch. Drive fast as shit again. Problem solved.

You mean, "Drive Italian". (Add a couple expresso stops in, too.)

**Roo** · 12-01-2007, 11:36 AM

We have a system over here that has a similar effect. It's called the SPECS camera system. Forward facing cameras mounted on gantries over the road use recognition software to log your number plate as you pass. A couple of miles up the road will be another SPECS camera that monitors your average speed. Then another. And another.

The upshot of this is that there is a soaring amount of unregistered cars on our roads so beating one problem (speeding) has just created a much bigger one.

**haydukelives** · 12-01-2007, 05:39 PM

but dont get stopped

**Shaggy** · 12-01-2007, 05:54 PM

Originally Posted by miniracer

I always wondered why it was legal to make a car go faster than the speed limits. The car manufacturers should be held liable for cars that go faster than the speed limit.
It not my fault its the cars.

Are you for real?

Originally Posted by alpinedad

I can't imagine how. You're not speeding in the confines of your home, but on a public thoroughfare. But it's early, and my imagination might be uncalibrated.

I was actually looking at it from the "searching" of a privately owned RFID chip contained in the VIN sticker, inside a privately owned vehicle.

**The Dad** · 12-01-2007, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by Shaggy

I was actually looking at it from the "searching" of a privately owned RFID chip contained in the VIN sticker, inside a privately owned vehicle.

Except that you're still in public, and your license agreement for the box probably permits it.

I don't think it's right, but I do think that you're unlikely to find a judge in this land who would prevent it.

**YoEddy** · 12-01-2007, 11:29 PM

I'm no lawyer, and I don't play one on TV, but it seems to me they'd have to issue a citation to your car since they can't be certain YOU were actually driving it ... unless of course they install cameras too. THEN you'd be fucked.

**MeatPuppet** · 12-01-2007, 11:35 PM

Originally Posted by alpinedad

Except that you're still in public, and your license agreement for the box probably permits it.

I don't think it's right, but I do think that you're unlikely to find a judge in this land who would prevent it.

I agree.

You are already operating in a heavily regulated environment to begin with, where anonymity is a non issue. Anytime the proper authority request identification, you are required by law to produce it. If you are unable, or unwilling to produce it, you can be denied the use of the roadways. RFID tags would just make it easier for the "proper" authorities to identify the owner of the vehicle. It doesn't fundamentally change the nature of what they are doing, just makes it easier for them.

**Sensisnow** · 12-01-2007, 11:36 PM

Originally Posted by Roo

We have a system over here that has a similar effect. It's called the SPECS camera system. Forward facing cameras mounted on gantries over the road use recognition software to log your number plate as you pass. A couple of miles up the road will be another SPECS camera that monitors your average speed. Then another. And another.

The upshot of this is that there is a soaring amount of unregistered cars on our roads so beating one problem (speeding) has just created a much bigger one.

Same thing would happen here in the states. Look at the radar/laser detector/defeater market we have now. If this monitoring were to go into effect nationwide, aluminum foil sales would skyrocket!

**truth** · 12-01-2007, 11:38 PM

Originally Posted by Odin

Don't listen to the AD... He is trying to blind you with THE TRUTH... when what we really want is.. .THE TRUTH

werd dawg

**glenn** · 12-02-2007, 03:29 AM

Originally Posted by alpinedad

I can't imagine how. You're not speeding in the confines of your home, but on a public thoroughfare. But it's early, and my imagination might be uncalibrated.

Well, your car cannot be searched without probable cause. As an extension, perhaps the information in your RFID tag could be viewed as private, and is attached to your car much like a roof carrier, which would require consent to search as well. You did not give consent for that information to be accessible to anyone except the EZPass toll collectors, as explained by the contract. You did not explicitly or implicitly consent to having the police access that information. Police need warrants to access files on your PC. I think even your laptop left in the park without a password is safe from Big Brother until you give consent, or a warrant is issued. There is no precedent yet, but I think the same would apply to the EZPass.

I think the assumption of privacy of these numbers is a big factor regarding whether the police can use them in prosecution. Considering the same RFID technology is used for credit cards and other payment methods, I would think the public has a considerable trust (whether or not it is justified) in the privacy of RFID numbers.

I'm not a lawyer though. I've only studied case law briefly as it applies to computers The only cases that ever really go to court are issues like this (prosecutions are rarely made regarding cyber-crime). All that to say, if laws are passed to enact such a program, it will be big news, and the first person to fight and tickets under this new method will likely set a precedent. The precedents set in such a trial will be far reaching as far as digital and personal privacy for ubiquitous computing.