Antiwork

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Originally Posted by Mustonen

I understand the school of thought in re: not matching offers, but that only works if they actually keep pay scales current and fair and competitive. If you’re at a fair rate and can reasonably be replaced for that rate, and you’re shopping and getting offers and really want to go do that, then go.

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+1. Conversely, I always made it my policy that if I had to go looking for another offer there was no point giving the old employer a chance to match it. I told potential and current employers that up front and I gave plenty of chances to negotiate before I went looking, so if I found something better they lost the silent auction. Sorry, not sorry. Should have put your best offer on the table sooner. I never wanted to work in a place that made me look for a new job every time I deserved a raise.

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Originally Posted by AK47bp

Someone get this kid a cookie.

He earned it.


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Goddammit. Everyone is getting a cookie 'cept for me. :mad:

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Originally Posted by skaredshtles

Million dollar home in San Jose:

Attachment 424725

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Looks like Fred's friend shoulda gone to college. Sad.

Pretty good thread overall - I'll vaguely say it made me take some shit more seriously at work and implement changes within the last 2 days thanks to some of your guys thoughts.

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Originally Posted by Boosh

I work as a construction PM for a large firm, and related to a lot of what was said earlier in this thread. in terms of the quote above here, I had a competing offer for another company, brought it back to my Exec. and negotiated more at my current spot. They gave me about 50% of what I was slated to make by jumping ship, but I didn't really want to jump ship to begin with, just felt like I was underpaid so was somewhat happy with the small bump and keeping up with the status quo.

A few months go by and my Ops manager sets up a meeting with me, I go into her office and she starts reaming me for "running my mouth" about them negotiating with me, falsely accused me of telling others to go get competing offers to try and better their own salary, etc.... she proceeds to say that "it's not our policy to match salary, you're lucky we did it with you, I've had to let a bunch of good people walk bc we don't normally do this, idk what it is about your generation feeling entitled to more money,".. meanwhile they're freaking out bc tons of people are actually leaving and she can't staff our projects properly, so I say to her:

A. it shouldn't come as a shock to you that people talk about this stuff nowadays - but for the record I was not encouraging others to get competing offers; if anything I'm a positive example for you bc I took less money to stay here with this firm;

B. if you're telling me it's not your policy to match salaries, but in the same sentence tell me you're worried about people leaving, maybe you ought to re-think YOUR policy; the market is red hot with companies looking for talent, it's no secret that people can make $40k more by going to the guy down the street

I agree with the perspective of feeling like we're stuck in an overall failing system, and that the gaps in pay between the top tier staff and the bottom tier make it even worse. sure us millennials may feel entitled to a little more, but we work out of the most profitable office in our company and we don't get shit as a thank you, they pay us as little as possible while expecting 50-60 hours of work per week in roles that sometimes suck... I was in our business development dept. for a few years, I know how much we make in profit every year, and it makes me sick that our employees get the shaft over and over again

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C should have been: How dare you call me entitled when you are saying you are entitled to pay me and others less than your competition for the same work.

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Originally Posted by skaredshtles

Goddammit. Everyone is getting a cookie 'cept for me. :mad:

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You can have mine. I just want my overtime pay.

People always say to me, "must be great being your own boss and having your own company."

Depending on how bitter I am that day, I usually have many come backs associated with how shitty it really is. A note to anyone who thinks that having your own business is fun and easy, go fuck your selves, it is truly a stupid idea. Sure the financial benefits can be rewarding but outside of the stress, managing failures, employees with their personal issues you need to stroke, and trying to explain the current massive escalation in costs to a potential customer it's all laughable bullshit.

Inflation is absolutely out of control. Employees finally having the upper hand and demanding excellent wages, is great, but at the same time, the rapid rise in wages is mind blowing. There was no gradual uptick for the service industry and the trades. It was an over night demand this past winter. I have had many employees walk because so and so is offering them considerably more. What they fail to realize is that they are now a 1099 employee, responsible for their own insurance costs, as well as their tax payments. So many people fall into that trap thinking bigger numbers are better but fail to realize the costs of doing business by being an independent contractor. I have had many employees bail only to come back a few weeks later over the past twenty years.

And this being TGR and all....... we are upwardly mobile intelligent go getters. Many of (us) fail to realize how shitty most peoples lives are in this country. I will say that most if not all of these people bring this on themselves by poor life choices. You can all argue that point with me for what it's worth. But in my dealings with people, it is unfortunately true in my book. I just received paper work this week for an ex employee who disappeared on me last December, after I had a few talks about his drug/alcohol use, his poor performance and attitude at work. The courts have a tracked him down to me finally and they want me to start garnishing his wages for child support. Meanwhile he is currently collecting unemployment from the state and my UE account. Which I fought endlessly, even though I was told by my money guy to just walk away and leave it be. This is the country we live in, people will milk it for everything and anything they can. I'm left having to fill out paper work to submit to the court/state to let them know that he is no longer on my payroll. Like I have time for this crap.

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Originally Posted by stealurface831

You can have mine. I just want my overtime pay.

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Goddam greedy Gen-Z'ers. :mad:

:fmicon:

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Originally Posted by jono

+1. Conversely, I always made it my policy that if I had to go looking for another offer there was no point giving the old employer a chance to match it. I told potential and current employers that up front and I gave plenty of chances to negotiate before I went looking, so if I found something better they lost the silent auction. Sorry, not sorry. Should have put your best offer on the table sooner. I never wanted to work in a place that made me look for a new job every time I deserved a raise.

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Same here. I always viewed it like dating. If I was with a girl and decided to look around, I cut ties. Hard to tell a girlfriend that you boned another chick and she was better at it so you better try harder. She might try harder for a little bit but you're going to end up back where you were. What kind of girl are you dating with such little self respect that she would stay with you after that? Or she's going to tell you to f off which she probably should.

Most employers have no self respect and are shitty sluts. They should be treated as such.

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Originally Posted by fastfred

People always say to me, "must be great being your own boss and having your own company."

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Remember - "people" are really dumb.

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Inflation is absolutely out of control. Employees finally having the upper hand and demanding excellent wages, is great, but at the same time, the rapid rise in wages is mind blowing. There was no gradual uptick for the service industry and the trades. It was an over night demand this past winter.

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These categories of workers have a LOT of years of wage stagnation to make up for...

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

Same here. I always viewed it like dating. If I was with a girl and decided to look around, I cut ties. Hard to tell a girlfriend that you boned another chick and she was better at it so you better try harder. She might try harder for a little bit but you're going to end up back where you were. What kind of girl are you dating with such little self respect that she would stay with you after that? Or she's going to tell you to f off which she probably should.

Most employers have no self respect and are shitty sluts. They should be treated as such.

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Generally agreed.

I’ll dip my toe in from time to time in a mostly unserious way to see what bites and how big it is. If it’s interesting I’ll report back to those who make decisions re: my salary and idly relate what I’ve found. “So and so asked me to interview and is paying $X, can you believe it? Say, when were we going to set up a meeting to talk about my compensation package…?” It’s all about continuously applying that pressure….

To your example, if I go out with my girl and I’ve let myself get all slovenly and pudgy and she’s getting looks from dudes I worry I can’t compete with, I’m going to step up my game and make sure I’m delivering on all the intangibles, including fringe benefits, a clean and friendly place to work, one on one attention, and a healthy retirement package.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

Hard to tell a girlfriend that you boned another chick and she was better at it so you better try harder. She might try harder for a little bit but you're going to end up back where you were.

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There's a better chance she'll key your car and light your guitar on fire.

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Originally Posted by Mustonen

To your example, if I go out with my girl and I’ve let myself get all soft and pudgy and she’s getting looks from dudes I worry I can’t compete with, I’m going to step up my game and make sure I’m delivering on all the intangibles, including fringe benefits, a clean and friendly place to work, one on one attention, and a healthy retirement package.

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But due to my entitlement, that would never happen.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

But due to my entitlement, that would never happen.

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That’s how you end up suddenly understaffed and accepting applications from the bottom of the barrel.

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Originally Posted by skaredshtles

You probably should have taken that other job...

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that was my exact reaction following the meeting; I think the ops manager is very out of touch with reality and agree with OldNew that I should have thrown it back in her face harder about our wages being below the industry standard in our region. I have since begun looking elsewhere and don't plan on giving them a chance to match this time.

I like the dating analogy, even tho I stayed put I still got slapped on the wrist and nothing's really changed, and that only furthered emphasized my feelings of needing to find something new.

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Originally Posted by Mustonen

That’s how you end up suddenly understaffed and accepting applications from the bottom of the barrel.

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You're telling me that's why I spent my early 20s playing "you'll do" at 2 am last calls?

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Originally Posted by Boosh

that was my exact reaction following the meeting; I think the ops manager is very out of touch with reality and agree with OldNew that I should have thrown it back in her face harder about our wages being below the industry standard in our region. I have since begun looking elsewhere and don't plan on giving them a chance to match this time.

I like the dating analogy, even tho I stayed put I still got slapped on the wrist and nothing's really changed, and that only furthered emphasized my feelings of needing to find something new.

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And that is the "common wisdom" in these situations. Rarely does what you did work out - company views you as about to bail out, regardless of the placation/more $$ in the short-term.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

You're telling me that's why I spent my early 20s playing "you'll do" at 2 am last calls?

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I’m just saying it might have helped if you’d spent some time fattening up your benefits package, threw the occasional pizza party, and considered offering an equity share if you were interested in keeping anybody long term.

You get a lot better candidates by trading up from a position of strength than you do when filling empty seats at a dumpster fire.

I'm in charge of hiring no one. Not sure where I gave that impression.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

I'm in charge of hiring no one. Not sure where I gave that impression.

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Oh sure. No money changed hands. Of course not. You just left some cash on the dresser and it was gone the next morning.

Moths to a flame my man.

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Originally Posted by fastfred

People always say to me, "must be great being your own boss and having your own company."

Depending on how bitter I am that day, I usually have many come backs associated with how shitty it really is. A note to anyone who thinks that having your own business is fun and easy, go fuck your selves, it is truly a stupid idea. Sure the financial benefits can be rewarding but outside of the stress, managing failures, employees with their personal issues you need to stroke, and trying to explain the current massive escalation in costs to a potential customer it's all laughable bullshit.

Inflation is absolutely out of control. Employees finally having the upper hand and demanding excellent wages, is great, but at the same time, the rapid rise in wages is mind blowing. There was no gradual uptick for the service industry and the trades. It was an over night demand this past winter. I have had many employees walk because so and so is offering them considerably more. What they fail to realize is that they are now a 1099 employee, responsible for their own insurance costs, as well as their tax payments. So many people fall into that trap thinking bigger numbers are better but fail to realize the costs of doing business by being an independent contractor. I have had many employees bail only to come back a few weeks later over the past twenty years.

And this being TGR and all....... we are upwardly mobile intelligent go getters. Many of (us) fail to realize how shitty most peoples lives are in this country. I will say that most if not all of these people bring this on themselves by poor life choices. You can all argue that point with me for what it's worth. But in my dealings with people, it is unfortunately true in my book. I just received paper work this week for an ex employee who disappeared on me last December, after I had a few talks about his drug/alcohol use, his poor performance and attitude at work. The courts have a tracked him down to me finally and they want me to start garnishing his wages for child support. Meanwhile he is currently collecting unemployment from the state and my UE account. Which I fought endlessly, even though I was told by my money guy to just walk away and leave it be. This is the country we live in, people will milk it for everything and anything they can. I'm left having to fill out paper work to submit to the court/state to let them know that he is no longer on my payroll. Like I have time for this crap.

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Is this really Fred? or someone hack his account? He's way to coherent.

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Originally Posted by Elkhound Odin

Is this really Fred? or someone hack his account? He's way to coherent.

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Clearly needs to hit up the pot shop

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Originally Posted by Buzzworthy

Clearly needs to hit up the pot shop

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my office is across the street
ran into my bro ealier today on one of the swankiest blocks in town every house has cameras and he's just puffing away in the road as we are having our once every two week therapy session he keeps trying to hand me the bowl I'm like no gotta deal with customers all day meanwhile the ceo of one of the largest fast food chain in the world has us on video being derelicts I'm like begging my bro to keep it on the down low and he's like what are they gonna do fire me? that'd be the best thing to happen me today
and fuck me I want to get baked as hell but I need to go deal with an oil tycoon and his wife in a few and for fun his dad and mom will be there dad is one of the richest texas rednecks in the country the world I live in is not good I need normal people for a change

The more you toke, the more normal they become. Send it.

fred’s addicted to that high class lifestyle… dude’s turnin’ down the dank just to hang in money’s proximity.

https://i.redd.it/6aa01vy21gn91.jpg

Ha. Nice

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Originally Posted by fastfred

People always say to me, "must be great being your own boss and having your own company."


And this being TGR and all....... we are upwardly mobile intelligent go getters. Many of (us) fail to realize how shitty most peoples lives are in this country. I will say that most if not all of these people bring this on themselves by poor life choices. You can all argue that point with me for what it's worth. But in my dealings with people, it is unfortunately true in my book. .

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the last thing I would want to do is run my own company, most of those poor bastards have to work way too hard/ have to think way to much and if/when something fucks up it all on them

Sure some people do just get the shitty end of the stick in life but I do see many people squander chances & make bad choices, they tell ya they did this and I think well if it was me I woulda done that, for some reason what was aparent to you was not apparent to them ... winners and losers dude

right now all this great resignation/ anti-work comes under squandered choices

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Originally Posted by m2711c

fred’s addicted to that high class lifestyle… dude’s turnin’ down the dank just to hang in money’s proximity.

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Money is more addictive than dank don't ya know?

word.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/two...emic-1.6577522

and then there are the people who see an opurtoonity, they are working 2 remote jobs for as long as they can ride the wave

Hate to break it to Pete, but that's not new.

https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/co...go_and_havent/

Attachment 426325


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If they can fulfill the requirements completely of both jobs, who cares?

It's similar to the traditional person who works two jobs one after the other with very long hours tallyed and shows up exhausted to both of them and maybe doesn't perform 100% as effectively as someone with just one of them.

Do you have to be salaried to be Antiwork, or can folks paid hourly (for all their time) be Antiwork?

I'm confused. Why would it matter?

The funemployed are really the royalty of anti work.

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Originally Posted by fastfred

. Many of (us) fail to realize how shitty most peoples lives are in this country. I will say that most if not all of these people bring this on themselves by poor life choices. You can all argue that point with me for what it's worth.

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Actually, it's mostly brought on by their PARENT'S poor life choices. Nobody chooses to be born in an area that has low wages, stagnant economy and piss poor public education just like no child chooses to get dragged to church and have their head filled with useless garbage. Sure, its easy to mythologize bootstraping but the reality is very different in a society that will condemn you to poverty if you have bad teeth and a funny accent.

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Originally Posted by heckacali

If they can fulfill the requirements completely of both jobs, who cares?

It's similar to the traditional person who works two jobs one after the other with very long hours tallyed and shows up exhausted to both of them and maybe doesn't perform 100% as effectively as someone with just one of them.

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Well quiting your job is pretty fucking sexy and very in right now, working 2 jobs not so much\

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Originally Posted by californiagrown

Do you have to be salaried to be Antiwork, or can folks paid hourly (for all their time) be Antiwork?

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So if you’re an anti work independent contractor does that just make you unemployed?


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