the answer to "WTF is wrong with my boots?"

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Originally Posted by robnow

This is a VERY supportive boot and you did well to go with a better liner, what gave you the feeling that you are actually "overpowering" the boot? Remember that you are now in a boot with a more 'linear' flex vs 'progressive'.

The 120/125/130 all come with the 'P' tongue which is plenty stiff, however the Factory did come with one even stiffer marked 'B'. Not sure how easy these are to find but possibly the only option.

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On a lighter/softer ski earlier in the day the ski felt it was getting deflected and bucked while I stayed composed and balanced. When I switched to the bigger stiffer ski and skied faster/aggressively the ski would track like I wanted, and I was balanced upper body and I would pressure the front but all that did sometimes was flex my shins forward but not affect the ski instantly. Like the boots flexed more (or earlier) than the ski.

Like you suggested though, this is my first season in a non 4-buckle boot so maybe I'm just noticing the slightly different flex.

Still had a great time in them, and no pain/numbness while still totally locked down is just so nice.

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Originally Posted by ntblanks

i just wear them for a few days on the hill and they're good.

otherwise, hot rice sock method is probably what you want.

i don't bother with the shell at all whatever the old man says.

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I’m feeling like I got a really good fit when my shop fit them to my other boot, but in my Lange RX130 LV, they feel like they have some extra room in the heel - might be an issue of needing to add more cork - but it’s odd because the Lange has less volume in the heel than my other boot. In my mind the difference was the hot shell fitting.


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Been on the struggle bus with some MTN Labs for awhile now. Fit (vague ankle) and flex...just can’t get confident on them. 28.5.

Per fitters - Average forefoot and instep, lv ankle and slightly below average heel. Skinny calves.

Labs...
1. 15-19mm behind heel (the 27.5 pinched like hell walking)
2. Width shell fit - depends on where. Heel good - ankle 3mm gaps - forefoot good.
3. Custom foot beds have me all lined up.
4. Dry ultra thin sock.

Alpine boot is Mach 1 LV in 28.5 with a couple ‘o punches for the malleolus bones, boot board grind and liner mods for instep (12-15mm shell fit). Love everything about them.

Back to the Labs...after farting around with pads and shims and wedges... fitter cooked some Pro Tours, seemingly good fit (toured great and meadow skipped great). 40+ degree tight little chute, there was that familiar sensation, I wasn’t able to engage the tip of the ski quickly and flex the boot properly. Slightly vague in ankle.

Tried spoiler - felt somewhat better with flex but felt pitched forward on tour binders (rad 2)

Booster - no major difference

Was looking at some other boots, decided to drop Hawx liner in Lab, flexed that puppy right away (carpet testing). Heel hold and ankle wasn’t as snug as Pro Tour. Tried Mach 1 liner, same same. But flex felt right. Hawx liner is taller with more plastic in tongue/cuff.

Going to try moving the tongue up a little higher and maybe try a small shim under the heel (2mm or so). To see what happens.

Other suggestions? Swap for Power Tongue? (Am I going to hate the skin track with that?). Different liner? Trim some plastic somewhere to aid in flex?

Am I just used to progressive feel of traditional overlap? Am I just trying to make a boot work that isn’t my glass slipper? Work on my skiing...

This boot is driving me to see a therapist.

Thanks in advance.


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Going from the mach1 lv as your other boot, the rationale behind the MTN doesn't seem accurate. IMO you should be in the cochise, zero g, or a lange.

My gripe with boots that have given me a similar feeling to what you're describing sounds like you're not able to create the amount of leverage you need. Angle of the cuff can cause this, so can an improper heel socket. Lots of pressure on your upper shin or medial malleolus, or foot cramping are all common with this problem

I'd try two things:
1) take the insole, and if it's not already, grind the back of the heel so that it seats your heel as far back into the pocket as possible.

2) if you're not getting equal pressure down your shin it probably means the volume isn't correct (the fact that you're in the mach1 lv also supports this). They make shims that can run underneath the tongue of your liner that'll take the volume out around your lower shin, which I would suspect is the problem area for volume - take out the volume and hopefully the boot will push your heel back into the pocket and create the the pivot point to allow you to leverage your boots.

Thanks DM. The MTN LAB came before the Mach. They sat on the shelf for a few years when I moved and took some time off touring. Moved back to the mountains and looking to get back into touring.

1) yep, did this previously but could look again to see if it’s seated nicely.

2) I will look into some tongue shims to see if I can get comfy.

Your comments on pressure on the upper shim and foot cramping ring true.

In carpet testing the lower/ankle hold of the zero g felt great. I likely will need to add a spoiler/foam to take up some room where my calf should be on the upper but that is likely the nuclear option for the MTN labs.

Thanks again!!!


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Is a Hawx Ultra 120 with an added bolt the same as a 130? Or is the shell stiffness different in the 130? Will I notice a difference between a stock 120 and 130?

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Originally Posted by DarthMarkus

That makes sense to me. Adding weight to already pronating feet causes a lot of trouble. Is he getting pressure on the medial malleolus? Proximal 5th metatarsal? Both common hotspots for people with pronation problems, but not necessarily.

I think if it's just pressure on the 5th metatarsal, you can probably get into something like the LX. If the medial malleolus is also a big problem, I think you'll have a fair bit of trouble without addressing the pronation directly - usually the foot starts to actually drop inside the boot, putting the malleolus into a narrower part of the shell - that shit hurts.

If you haven't done so already, a varus wedge on the inside of the heel has helped a lot of teenagers. If not that, custom footbeds ground flat with a slight lateral twist in the heel has worked for me in the past as well; it shifts weight away from the inside heel and alleviates some of the collapsing of that arch.

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Reporting back after trying some new boots and getting some work done. We went with an Lange LX120. BF re-used his bontex/volume shims and heel lifts. Added generous punches to the inside ankle area to alleviate the medial malleolus pressure and pain. Maybe we are just avoid the problem by dancing around the pronation, but my kid skied yesterday without pain and was ripping. That’s the part that is most important to me. We will see how this approach holds up over the course of the season.

Thanks to DM and gregL for the helpful insights!

gregL - we went to see Eric over at Sturtevants since he has the same over-pronation problem and has helped my son in the past...plus the EVO reservations had us out past January 10th. [emoji12]


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Originally Posted by Bandit Man

gregL - we went to see Eric over at Sturtevants since he has the same over-pronation problem and has helped my son in the past...plus the EVO reservations had us out past January 10th. [emoji12]

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Good call. Tell him I say hello and we should make some turns after we get through the holidays!

Got hit by a snowboarder the other day. He ended up bruising some of my ribs and certainly put an end to my day. Didn't notice till after that he also put some significant damage to my gear as well.

Curious what people think for solutions. I'm thinking I can probably put some metal shavings in mixed with some elmer's glue and slather up the crack. Or just wrap the middle of my foot with some duct tape every day I wanna go ski.

Open to some insight and suggestions. Attachment 355724

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I like the new boots you are getting in a few days.

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Originally Posted by DarthMarkus

Got hit by a snowboarder the other day. ....
Curious what people think for solutions. ....

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Shooting the fuckers on site

Aqua seal

be happy you were not hurt and buy new boots

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Originally Posted by DarthMarkus

Got hit by a snowboarder the other day. He ended up bruising some of my ribs and certainly put an end to my day. Didn't notice till after that he also put some significant damage to my gear as well.

Curious what people think for solutions. I'm thinking I can probably put some metal shavings in mixed with some elmer's glue and slather up the crack. Or just wrap the middle of my foot with some duct tape every day I wanna go ski.

Open to some insight and suggestions.

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Voile strap

I've been dealing with vomit-inducing pain across the mets on my touring boots, massive pain with lasting bruising/tenderness in my 6th toe area on my right foot (some tours I can't even put weight on my right foot for a couple hours). SO......

Did a DIY punch on my Hawx XTD's today. $7 Harbor Freight heat gun and the end of a screwdriver. Put the gun on slow speed, did 3 heat/cools to get it hot all the way through then blew out the forefoot/mets area, held pressure as I rubbed ice over the area. Immediate pressure relief on test fit.

Then end of the handle? And all pressure was by hand? That's cool if that holds!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DarthMarkus

Got hit by a snowboarder the other day. He ended up bruising some of my ribs and certainly put an end to my day. Didn't notice till after that he also put some significant damage to my gear as well.

Curious what people think for solutions. I'm thinking I can probably put some metal shavings in mixed with some elmer's glue and slather up the crack. Or just wrap the middle of my foot with some duct tape every day I wanna go ski.

Open to some insight and suggestions. Attachment 355724

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That’s like when the ski hill would run $2 lift tickets for local residents. Every old piece of gear that had been sitting in the sun for 5 years was out on hill. Exploding boot plastic everywhere.

What size do you wear?


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by DarthMarkus

Got hit by a snowboarder the other day. He ended up bruising some of my ribs and certainly put an end to my day. Didn't notice till after that he also put some significant damage to my gear as well.

Curious what people think for solutions. I'm thinking I can probably put some metal shavings in mixed with some elmer's glue and slather up the crack. Or just wrap the middle of my foot with some duct tape every day I wanna go ski.

Open to some insight and suggestions. Attachment 355724

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Send a note to tecnica and see if they’ll hook you up with a crash replacement


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Originally Posted by Falcon3

I've been dealing with vomit-inducing pain across the mets on my touring boots, massive pain with lasting bruising/tenderness in my 6th toe area on my right foot (some tours I can't even put weight on my right foot for a couple hours). SO......

Did a DIY punch on my Hawx XTD's today. $7 Harbor Freight heat gun and the end of a screwdriver. Put the gun on slow speed, did 3 heat/cools to get it hot all the way through then blew out the forefoot/mets area, held pressure as I rubbed ice over the area. Immediate pressure relief on test fit.

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Ok, now I'm curious. I'm in la sportiva skorpius. The left boot could use maybe a couple mm space around a small bunion (big toe). I don't have access to a bootfitter or a press. Is it possible for me to gain a couple mm space relatively easily? It isn't critical -- i can ski with minimal pain -- but I'm trying to keep the bunion from becoming bigger. Try myself or better to wait until i can get to a fitter?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DarthMarkus

Got hit by a snowboarder the other day. He ended up bruising some of my ribs and certainly put an end to my day. Didn't notice till after that he also put some significant damage to my gear as well.

Curious what people think for solutions. I'm thinking I can probably put some metal shavings in mixed with some elmer's glue and slather up the crack. Or just wrap the middle of my foot with some duct tape every day I wanna go ski.

Open to some insight and suggestions. Attachment 355724

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Bondo!

Not!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DarthMarkus

Got hit by a snowboarder the other day. He ended up bruising some of my ribs and certainly put an end to my day. Didn't notice till after that he also put some significant damage to my gear as well.

Curious what people think for solutions. I'm thinking I can probably put some metal shavings in mixed with some elmer's glue and slather up the crack. Or just wrap the middle of my foot with some duct tape every day I wanna go ski.

If you have to this might actually work-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-5PsKU2ZLY

Open to some insight and suggestions. Attachment 355724

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If you have to this might actually work-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-5PsKU2ZLY

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Originally Posted by NWFlow

Ok, now I'm curious. I'm in la sportiva skorpius. The left boot could use maybe a couple mm space around a small bunion (big toe). I don't have access to a bootfitter or a press. Is it possible for me to gain a couple mm space relatively easily? It isn't critical -- i can ski with minimal pain -- but I'm trying to keep the bunion from becoming bigger. Try myself or better to wait until i can get to a fitter?

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can't make it worse?

heat the shell, pad the foot with 3-5mm of not much compressiable foam, Buckle the CRAP out of it while it cools with your foot in the boot. Stand in snow bank for 10 min while drinking a beer.

https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...rs-and-shells)

Awesome, thanks!

One other question: would it be possible just to mold the toe box with that method? I don't want space anywhere else...so ideally a punch would be best, but i can try just heating the toe box (i.e. only dipping the toe of the boot in the water to try to get more targeted space across the met heads.

to stretch a boot you need both heat and pressure. So if you dont heat an area, it wont stretch.

again, go for it and see.