Student Loan Forgiveness

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Originally Posted by Brownski

Right. And there are degrees of fucking off too. I didn’t go straight from living in a wall tent in AK straight to the mortgage application.

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Yeah - for sure. The fucking off should *probably* taper off as you get older. Though some seem to be able to continue it... and I envy those folks.

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I started the process around age 26 but was probably 31 and a few years into my final career before the fucking off ceased entirely.

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And let's admit it - it's a SAD day when you realize the fucking off has ceased. :D

Or you could live in VT and pay considerably higher to go to UVM. We got div I basketball and have made it into the first round of march madness a bunch of times.

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Originally Posted by riser4

Or you could live in VT and pay considerably higher to go to UVM. We got div I basketball and have made it into the first round of march madness a bunch of times.

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It says total out of pocket $35k/yr for instate if you dont qualify for any financial aid, and $21k/yr for students recieving an average amount of financial aid. How accurate is that to what you are paying?

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Originally Posted by Danno

I don't have answers for all those questions, but if you look at the SSA link, they did attempt to address some of it: "After controlling for key socio-demographic variables that influence earnings and the probability of college completion, the differences in lifetime earnings by educational attainment are reduced, but still substantial"

Regardless of whether our educational system is efficient, affordable, etc, it seems indisputable to me that two people, all things being equal, the one going to college will earn more money. More doors will open up for them, graduate degrees become attainable, etc. As for why, I think there are a whole host of reasons. Was my college money well spent? I don't know, lord knows I got drunk a lot and fucked off a lot. But I sure as fuck learned a lot of important skills in critical thinking, writing, organization, etc. Could i have learned those in other ways, could we construct an educational system from scratch that could do that better and cheaper? Sure. But that's like looking at a city and saying "if I started from scratch, could I design this network of roads to be more efficient?" The answer is "yes", and the answer is also "but there's no real way to do that".

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I also think the idea of education as job-training-only is really discounting the other things you get from school. Especially for traditional students you get a place to learn responsibility, follow through, and not dying, in a controlled environment, with help along the way. You also make relationships with people that help you down the road either personally or professionally, and you get smarter and more well-rounded. All of those things benefit the individual and society as a whole. I never used my degree in the way I thought I would, but my college years were instrumental in putting me down my career path, and adding to my career success.

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Originally Posted by Supermoon

I also think the idea of education as job-training-only is really discounting the other things you get from school. Especially for traditional students you get a place to learn responsibility, follow through, and not dying, in a controlled environment, with help along the way. You also make relationships with people that help you down the road either personally or professionally, and you get smarter and more well-rounded. All of those things benefit the individual and society as a whole. I never used my degree in the way I thought I would, but my college years were instrumental in putting me down my career path, and adding to my career success.

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100%

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Originally Posted by CarlMega

100%

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Yep agreed. By far the greatest benefit of college for me was the social education, not the academic education.

I went through school a bit out of order, such that I was taking business management courses while managing a business in my early 20’s and could apply a lot of it in real time. It was tremendously valuable and I think I got much, much more out of it than my peers and have retained more of it as well.

I’m not sure how we set things up to replicate that, but the apprenticeship/internship/residency paradigm could be blended a bit into more career paths than we apply them to today.

The cost of attending the university of Colorado is $32k-$38k per year for in state students depending on which major they choose.

https://www.colorado.edu/bursar/cost...orado-resident

That's between $128k and $152k for a bachelor's degree, which is insane for in state at a state school.

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Originally Posted by skaredshtles

I would humbly suggest that *everyone* just fuck off until their early 30's... 'cause you only live once and the 20's are a good time.:D

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Did it to my late 50s and it was still a good time.

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I thought the ideal TGR lifestyle was to move to Montana, smoke weed and work in the ski industry?

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Results may vary but that was the plan and it worked out surprisingly well. Alas that was another time.

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Originally Posted by californiagrown

The U of U should be $13.5k out of pocket for instate according to them: https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges...y-of-utah-3675

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Tuition alone is $9k per year. Add another $11k for room and meal plan. That is this years numbers.

Your article is way off.

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Originally Posted by skaredshtles

I would humbly suggest that *everyone* just fuck off until their early 30's... 'cause you only live once and the 20's are a good time.

:D

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So we’re supposed to stop fucking off at some point?


Huh. That explains a lot.

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Originally Posted by AK47bp

So we’re supposed to stop fucking off at some point?

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i challenge this premise.

University of Oklahoma right now is $20K-$25K per semester out of state including room and board. It wouldn't be happening for our kid without his $8K/semester distinguished scholar awards.. Even with that he's going to be $35K in debt when he graduates.

But Wake Tech Community College is roughly $3K per year with kid 2 living at home... funded with subsidized loans.

Both kids work 25-40 hours a week depending on the school schedule each week.

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Originally Posted by californiagrown

Really? US news says the average annual in-state cost for my alma mater is $15,300 (that's tuition, room+board, books and stuff, minus the average financial aid package). tuition by itself is $12,700. And thats for a large, land grant university with a major athletic program not a rinky dink regional satellite school. It might not have a top tier academic ranking, but the same engineering textbooks are used at Stanford so the education can't be that much different. ironically, the out of pocket cost for stanford likely would have been much cheaper for me had i been able to get in haha.

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Im assuming your alma mater is Cal State something or other? For me, it’s hard to fathom those numbers for any CalState when not dinosaur years ago yet, was only a couple hundred for me and UC was 1300 a year ( and they were supposed to be free originally).

This whole thing seems to have broken hugely in the last couple decades which I’ve heard was driven in large part to when loans were paid out to students instead of the institutions. Or something like that. At any rate, fuckin clouds

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Originally Posted by Kevo

The cost of attending the university of Colorado is $32k-$38k per year for in state students depending on which major they choose.

https://www.colorado.edu/bursar/cost...orado-resident

That's between $128k and $152k for a bachelor's degree, which is insane for in state at a state school.

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Oooof, so glad that expense is behind us. Back in the day I think we paid about $75k for 5 years of SDSU for each of the girls. Yup, they lived at home.

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Originally Posted by californiagrown

It says total out of pocket $35k/yr for instate if you dont qualify for any financial aid, and $21k/yr for students recieving an average amount of financial aid. How accurate is that to what you are paying?

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It's accurate. Thing #2 made a horrible decision and didn't live at home first or second year during the first and second full school years of the pandemic. So he borrowed to live on campus. We tried to warn him. We live 30 minutes away. He did junior year from our house. He plans to start off senior year at home. He's got a line on a few sublets in Burlington for spring semester.

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Originally Posted by mcski

Doing what??

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I know this is California, but today i got a quote to hook up my espresso machine to a water line: 650

This job would take a max of 2 hours. And they proposed a two year warranty for a total of 1850!

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by rod9301

I know this is California, but today i got a quote to hook up my espresso machine to a water line: 650

This job would take a max of 2 hours. And they proposed a two year warranty for a total of 1850!

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

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Plus tip

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Originally Posted by Buzzworthy

Tuition alone is $9k per year. Add another $11k for room and meal plan. That is this years numbers.

Your article is way off.

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That number assumes average financial assistance. I easily got more than $7k in aid more than a decade ago, is it a lot harder now?

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Originally Posted by californiagrown

That number assumes average financial assistance. I easily got more than $7k in aid more than a decade ago, is it a lot harder now?

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In that case I apologize, that $13k and change number is pretty spot on. My daughter is getting $7k a year in assistance. And it’s much more competitive for assistance these days with the overall cost of college compared to when we attended (92-97 for me) as I’ve seen from all of her applications.

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Originally Posted by rod9301

I know this is California, but today i got a quote to hook up my espresso machine to a water line: 650

This job would take a max of 2 hours. And they proposed a two year warranty for a total of 1850!

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

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1st World problem. There was a thread.

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Originally Posted by Vt-Freeheel

My plumber and his son, 27ish both masters. $110 an hour each......

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Huh?

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Originally Posted by californiagrown

It says total out of pocket $35k/yr for instate if you dont qualify for any financial aid, and $21k/yr for students recieving an average amount of financial aid. How accurate is that to what you are paying?

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who gives a shit? Other than status conscious clowns? Opportunity cost is what matters- in money and time

$110/hr depending on factors is cube monkey take home

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Originally Posted by californiagrown

the same engineering textbooks are used at Stanford so the education can't be that much different.

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This is a dumb fucking take, but you are always in these threads preaching bootstraps.

Hardly anyone mentions the intrinsic value of an education. It’s worthwhile for many people and if degrees weren’t pushed as only a means to earn more money maybe your barista would be capable of a more compelling conversation.

This whole saga is a symptom of the drain we’re circling. A poorly educated and indebted population doesn’t benefit any of us.

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Originally Posted by mcski

Doing what??

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Military contracting, gambling, farmers/ranchers, athletes, coding, arts/music, day trading, working hard for a business owner and putting in some time, sales. Also know folks that own businesses and do financially well with no degree. But I was responding to SJG who said "without owning their own business" which to me is a silly statement. What's wrong with creating something that makes money and owning it? All people I know making $200k+ without a four year degree. There's still something to be said said for taking a flyer and dedicating yourself to something. But I doubt most of these folks would be doing what they're doing if they were merely chasing the brass ring. And a lot of them have failed more than once.

But I digress.

For the average, sure a degree will net some money. But that is for people who subscribe to the pattern society sets.