Rossignol Black Ops?

I had my first outing on the aforementioned BO118 today, riding them back to back with pre-asym BG116s.

My skiing is shit yet due to new liner voes and limited visibilty today, but so far so good. I do not see the BO118s replacing the BGs, the latter are a fair bit easier to ski in denser snow imho - though I kinda expect that delta to diminish as my skiing gets back up to speed. BO118s are noticably heavy, in spite of being fairly similar in weight to the BGs.

I also have BGasyms, to be skied back to back pre-asym BGs.

My quiver is a bit bloated in this segment, so i am running both MF118s and PR-OTOs, but have not ridden mf118s yet this season or the PR-OTO at all. My take thus far is that MF118s are looser than BO118s.

I also run Vision118s (these have surprised me - fun and incredibly easy to ski due to their soft flex and light weight, no comparison to the other skis in variable though - perfect early season ski imho) and Koala119s (fun and great shape, but sooooo stiff).

I mounted the BO118s -3 from recommended so -5.4cm from center, MF/ PR- OTO 189s are both at +1.5 from recommended, the rest are on the line.

My plan here was to:
- try MF118s and PR-OTOs back to back to get a feel for how the different layups feel
- try BGasym and the preceding model b2b to get a feel for what difference the asym makes
- see if the Koala119s can fill the shoes of both BGs and MF118s fulfill the 115mm ish quiver slot for both dense and lighter snow (the answer here is thus far no)
- BO118 and V118 - catch and release after getting a feel for how they and their shapes/constructions ski

time will tell how this little experiment pans out, but they are all great skis imho - if for different uses and riders.

and yes, I love BGs in denser snow, MF118s in lighter snow - both are freaking magical imho

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Originally Posted by Bandit Man

They feel a lot like the pre-Asym model in terms of looseness and specifically the 191 due to weight/mass.

My son has some Asym 184 BG’s (which I have skied) and they feel like a lot less ski than the 186 BO118. Much easier to manage and pivot/slash.

You aren’t wrong about the mount point. On the line, you have to ski the BO with a centered stance. Driving the tips will sink them. I totally agree with what the Blister guys were saying…mount 2-3-cm back to get the best results.

All that being said, I don’t think the BO118 will displace my BG’s, so I’ve got to decide if remounting is even worth it or if I should just pull a catch and release. Like I said previously, I think the BO110 is the one I look forward to.

Finally, I own some Menace Proto 118’s (189’s; supposed to be the same build as the MF 118) but haven’t skied them yet. I don’t expect the MF to handle heavy, dense snow the way that either the BG or BO118 do, but am intrigued by their “slashy” reputation. I plan to get those out in our next storm cycle.

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Thanks for the thorough writeup. I'm really debating which ski to bring together with the mfree 108 for Red Mountain/Revelstoke in February. BG, MF118, BO or maybe lighten kid-kapow of his cease & desist. Sorry for thread drift.

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Originally Posted by ma4b86

Thanks for the thorough writeup. I'm really debating which ski to bring together with the mfree 108 for Red Mountain/Revelstoke in February. BG, MF118, BO or maybe lighten kid-kapow of his cease & desist. Sorry for thread drift.

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I totally get it. As an MFree 108 fan and BG and C&D owner, I’m coming to the conclusion that I should just stop looking at other skis for soft snow conditions. I already have a few of the best around.

If I was headed to Revy/Red, I would go with BG’s and MFrees and not think about it again.

Thanks for letting me see clear, I'll try to never doubt my BG love again.

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Picked up a set of 23 186cm BO 118 that I got on a decent price this week and arrived today. Going to mount mine at -2.5cm from recommended(-5cm from Center) which should be good for 175lbs and a similar mount to my 21 CT skis.
Did notice they now have a +3cm Progressive(actually .5cm in front of true Center which makes no sense), 0 recommended(-2.5cm) and a -3cm(-5.5cm from Center) mark on them now. Quickly checked the tune and both skis base high so will get ground before mounting the bindings. Have a place that charges only $20 CAN for a stone grind and then I will hand tune/wax after so no biggie.

Liking the flex pattern and shape so I’m sure I’ll like them. Looking forward to getting on them and will update once I get on them!

And yes, the MFree 108(and 99) skis are incredibly popular skis at Revelstoke so a perfect fit.

Got on my 21/22 186cm BO 118s the other day. Mounted -3cm back so about -5.5 from center. Was shocked how loose they were given their weight, generous camber, and lack of taper. I did give them a fairly aggressive detune. My pair weighed around 2360g/ski so on the lighter side which I'm quite stoked about. They do feel like BG's. I've skied 184 Asyms and now own the current 187 in 110 width stock layup. I like that the BO 118s have Billy Goat looseness and stability but are more versatile with the ability to ski freestyle and more engaging on groomers. I do think BG's will outperform in heavier funky snowpack however and feel less fatiguing in tight terrain. But the BO 118 is super pivoty as well.

Any tall/heavy folks been on the BO 118? I'm 6'3, 195lbs and wondering if the 118 will feel too short? Current skis are 190 - 192

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Originally Posted by PeachesNCream

Any tall/heavy folks been on the BO 118? I'm 6'3, 195lbs and wondering if the 118 will feel too short? Current skis are 190 - 192

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I'm 5' 8" but coming in at 200-lbs. Unless you like center-mounts, they will feel short. Blister guys like them at about -3-cm from recommended, but I'm worried they'll still feel short. Contemplating a remount for my pair.

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Originally Posted by PeachesNCream

Any tall/heavy folks been on the BO 118? I'm 6'3, 195lbs and wondering if the 118 will feel too short? Current skis are 190 - 192

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They will feel short, wait until February 13th for the new 110 version coming in a 191

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Originally Posted by mr_pretzel

They will feel short, wait until February 13th for the new 110 version coming in a 191

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Is the new 110 confirmed to be a skinnier BO118 as opposed to a different width within the Sender line or something else? Any idea on the 18X length? Hoping for a 184-186…

I’m 6ft 200# on 186 blops118, I’m used to progressive mounts and prefer 185-190cm skis. I’m at -2cm from recommended. These are slightly more prone to tip dive in light powder than my 188 rustler 11 with a more traditional mount point, but for my style they do not feel short. They have a large sweet spot and loose but supportive tails that are great for tail presses, over/under rotations, and for slashing sideways for face shots. I just have a few days on them but early impression is super fun, loose ski with great suspension for bombing variable conditions, they also ski very well switch and are surprisingly very fun at carving on soft groomers.


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Originally Posted by Jongle

Is the new 110 confirmed to be a skinnier BO118 as opposed to a different width within the Sender line or something else? Any idea on the 18X length? Hoping for a 184-186…

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I don't remember where I read this but I thought the new 110 was supposed to be along the lines of the Sender series

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Originally Posted by Jongle

Is the new 110 confirmed to be a skinnier BO118 as opposed to a different width within the Sender line or something else? Any idea on the 18X length? Hoping for a 184-186…

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They have the sender name but are twinned and more center mounted. Saw MarcusG on them up on whis. I think the sizes were 184 and 191.

Saw on Newschoolers that the Sender Free 110 will come in 176cm, 184cm, 191cm with a 20m radius in the 184cm.

Curious to see the weight as it has a poplar core, rubber damping and a binding retention Ti sheet but also talks about an “Air Tip” and lightweight top sheet.

I think all standard construction features as w the squad.

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Similar to the Sender Ti construction but hoping it feels more substantial like the Squad in the wider width. Add some more playfulness compared to the Sender Ti and should be a decent ski.

Was more hoping they just make the BO 118 narrower with a 190cm plus length option and call it a day.

my key take away is that I prefer Dynastar PR-OTOs over BO118s.

While their weights are pretty comparable the lower swing weight of the PR-OTO makes them feel more nimble to me, and I get on better with them a +1.5 than the BO118s at -3.

I only have a few runs on both this season, but I really, really like how PR-OTOs ski. So loose, yet quite stable.

from ns:
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Originally Posted by kid-kapow

my key take away is that I prefer Dynastar PR-OTOs over BO118s.

While their weights are pretty comparable the lower swing weight of the PR-OTO makes them feel more nimble to me, and I get on better with them a +1.5 than the BO118s at -3.

I only have a few runs on both this season, but I really, really like how PR-OTOs ski. So loose, yet quite stable.

from ns:
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Kid - I appreciate your take here. I have some PR-OTOs I have yet to ski :( I took the BO118's out most recently since the conditions from the last storm was deep and heavy and them are supposed to thrive in that setting. I look forward to doing my own comparison, as you get me excited to try the Dynastars.

Also, I don't care about the BO110 vs Sender 110 thing. I like the rocker profile I see in that photo. Seems close to an Enforcer 110 shape with closer to the BO layup. Could be a good ski if the tips aren't too soft. Looking forward to user reviews when they are released over the next few weeks.

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Originally Posted by Bandit Man

Kid - I appreciate your take here. I have some PR-OTOs I have yet to ski :( I took the BO118's out most recently since the conditions from the last storm was deep and heavy and them are supposed to thrive in that setting. I look forward to doing my own comparison, as you get me excited to try the Dynastars.

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Sorry for the thread drift, but M-Free 118s are freaking great. I like to think of them as a BG that is better on groomers and more carvable in light snow, but more work than BGs in dense snow. The tails on the PR-OTOs were a bit too much for me today with shot legs and having grown accustomed to the effortless pivoting machines that is the 16/17 BG. I think my PR-OTOs might benefit from a base grind.

I will try the BO118s a few runs tomorrow in what should be prime BO118 conditions.

Makes sense that the MFree 118 would be the “in between” ski of the more tapered, looser BG and the minimal taper, more carvy BO 118. The tails of the MFree 118 should be more planted than the BG but if it’s WAY different than maybe something is up on the tune. Check that the base is flat(not edge high) and that the base bevel is uniform tip to tail.

My BO 118 were base high so would have been super nervous to ski and like skiing on marbles. Stone grind solved that but the edges and sidewalls were also very inconsistent and coarse. One of the worst factory tunes I’ve seen on new skis.

bandit or kid-kapow if you do end up doing a catch 'n release for your Black ops 118s i'd be very interested. Went for the shorty pair on a good price 2 years ago but I think I really should've gone for the 186 :/ got blinded by the savings.

-2 from rec per the blister rec was spot on in my experience as well.

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Originally Posted by fbw360

kid-kapow if you do end up doing a catch 'n release for your Black ops 118s i'd be very interested.

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Sorry, already sold them.

I posted this in the Squad-thread, but might as well post it here as well as they might be BO110s ;)

https://youtu.be/FlJlb0LccIM

Should have 3 pairs of 184cm sender free 110's available for purchase in the shop come early february. Lemme know if any of you guys want a pair!

Saw this listing of mint BO 118 listed on KSL.com(SLC) with Attack2 14 for $550 in case anyone is looking!

https://classifieds.ksl.com/listing/70668691

supposedly the new BO... errr Sender110 is amazing. I talked to a shop guy who are 3 days in on a demo pair and he freaking loved them. Loose and easy to ski in good snow and on piste, yet able to charge / do massive GS turns at mach schnell.

He interestingly did not love MF108 182s, stating that he felt their tails were more present - an observation I found particularly interesting seeing how I love MF108s. As such, more traditional skiers who like to drive their ski might be better of with the Senders compared to MFs.

They also speculated on how the next step was to kill off thee BO name and introduce Sender100s and 120s for what 2025? since BO98s and 118s carry over unchanged for 2024. So changes are a-coming.

Names aside, I'm really intrigued by the Sender 110. There really is something I like about that BO118/Sender Squad feel and performance in a more all-mtn friendly package. Could also be an interesting alternative to those who feel the MF108 is not damp enough/stable enough for their liking.

yeah, for sure. I think it is SkiEssentials who mention BO98s as a kind of late bloomer, meaning that they see that more and more different kinds of skiers get on the from year to year and that lots of folks seem to be enjoying them - not just the harder charging freestyle crowd that they originally were designed for. BO118s will still arguably be more of a specialist ski due to their width (if not on here than in the real world outside of TGR sized quivers), which makes the new 110 so damned interesting.

I prefer MFs for their looser approach and less turny (ability to reeally lay into them without the arc necessairly getting tighter / want to drag you into a turn) nature, especially on harder snow (even if I preferred BO118 to 98s - less camber, more rockeer/splay). As such, it makes a ton of sense to me that more traditional skiers will get on fabolously with the various BOs, if they can adjust to the tails and progressive mount point. High swing weight seems to be a "feature" of a lot of directional skis, so less of an issue. They way I ski fits better with MFs :)

I must admit to being very impressed with Rossignol's moves in re-designing their lineup post S7s - they make a fair few skis that are really, really interesting imho.

Marcus Goguen just won jr FWT on the new BO110 and he’s a big sender squad fan. I’m super excited for these!

I’d say the BO98 doesn’t really fit in with the 118. It just feels like a wider park ski, I wasn’t remotely impressed when I tried them years ago.

The thing that concerns me about the Sender 110 is that it has “air tip technology”… which I associate more with the Soul 7 than the BO118 or Sender Squad. Much of the BO118’s magic is in those fat, heavy tips.

Finally heard from some people on Newschoolers with their hands on the Sender Free 110 and they said the weight was 2200gr on the 184cm and 2350gr on the 191cm which is around where I was guessing.

Out on my new to me 186cm Blackops 118 mounted -2.5cm behind rec(-5cm total) today in some heavy 6” of fresh that tracked out quickly. Felt instantly comfortable on them and have a very similar, carvy feel to all my 21 CT skis. Didn’t find they skied heavy at all. Not enough coverage in the East yet to try glades out but skied some soft bumps and felt good there. Seem very versatile and anxious to get on them again.

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Originally Posted by noslow

Finally heard from some people on Newschoolers with their hands on the Sender Free 110 and they said the weight was 2200gr on the 184cm and 2350gr on the 191cm which is around where I was guessing.

Out on my new to me 186cm Blackops 118 mounted -2.5cm behind rec(-5cm total) today in some heavy 6” of fresh that tracked out quickly. Felt instantly comfortable on them and have a very similar, carvy feel to all my 21 CT skis. Didn’t find they skied heavy at all. Not enough coverage in the East yet to try glades out but skied some soft bumps and felt good there. Seem very versatile and anxious to get on them again.

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Fuck yeah! Those 191s are going to truck! Im guessing the rec mount is -4 based on what I saw on NS.
This is 100% a blackops ski, not a sender.

While I’m theoretically opposed to the airtip, the ones on the sender ti aren’t noticeable and not soul 7 honeycomb like at all, so I’ll stay reserved. Lots of other brands use light tip spacers too, 4frnt, etc.

Blister Luke just responded on NS about the Sender 110 Free-

“Definitely not light, and for anyone who's worried about Air Tip, don't. The swing weight isn't as hefty as the 118, but that seems more due to the fact that it's simply not quite as heavy. Unlike many Air Tip skis, the Sender Free 110 doesn't have a huge drop off in stiffness once you reach that part of the ski. It's pretty dang strong throughout, actually stiffer through the tips and tails than the 118. If it didn't have the little transparent part in the base, I'd never guess it had that honeycomb insert (in a good way).

It should really be called a BO 110, but I think Senders just sell more, and I'm guessing all their freeride people will (continue to) be on it. It's like a mix between the BO 118 and Sender Ti / Sender 106Ti+, but much more of a 118 than a Sender. Mostly it just has (most of) the edge hold of the Sender Ti and isn't quite as ultra-damp / planted as the 118, but it definitely smooths things out better than the Sender Ti, and it's designed around a way more centered mount point than the other Senders (but you can still drive it). It's cool.”

And yes, -4cm mount point on it with a +2cm Progressive and -2cm Directional line too it looks like.

Has anyone had good luck with mounting far behind the line?
I picked a pair of BO118s for cheap locally. Ideally, I like skis in the -7 to -9 range which would put me 5 to 7cm behind the line.

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Originally Posted by XtrPickels

Has anyone had good luck with mounting far behind the line?
I picked a pair of BO118s for cheap locally. Ideally, I like skis in the -7 to -9 range which would put me 5 to 7cm behind the line.

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-3 form rec is as far as I would go. You’ll get too far into the tail rocker if you go much further.

Limited release graphic (?) Sender Free 110 incoming in....
Attachment 444927
Rossi's alpine category manager, Jake Stevens, mentioned in the 22/23 ski lineup interview over at Blister that they had several, yet to be released graphics for the BlackOps line aka Sender Frees. Could this be one of them? Or is it "just" Max + sharpie = the above personalized graphic?

SkiEssentials currently has last year’s Sender Ti for $359 (187-cm only)

https://www.skiessentials.com/2022-r...r-ti-skis.html

Looks like the Sender Free 110 is cleaning up on the FWT

Shop buddy gave me some deets on the 191 free 110:

- Definitely a twintip like the BO118, not a sender
- 141-111-134mm, 22M radius (He said they look a bit straighter than 22 in his opinion)
- 189cm straight pull
- Rec mount at -3.5 from tc, also a directional line for -2 from that.
- 2360g +- 20g
- Hand flex is even and quite stout, flex with more pop than the BO118 and Squad, similar to the old sickle he dared say.

These look pretty fucking awesome in my book. Smaller squad for those who want one in the 184 and a slightly more easy going squad in the big size for more playful skiing.

Now the question is where to mount hmm. -5cm from tc is the magic on the BO118 and sickle, could work out pretty good here aswell.

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Originally Posted by mr_pretzel

Shop buddy gave me some deets on the 191 free 110:

- 141-111-134mm, 22M radius (He said they look a bit straighter than 22 in his opinion)
- 189cm straight pull
- Rec mount at -3.5 from tc, also a directional line for -2 from that.
- 2360g +- 20g
- Hand flex is even and quite stout, flex with more pop than the BO118 and Squad, similar to the old sickle he dared say.

These look pretty fucking awesome in my book. Smaller squad for those who want one in the 184 and a slightly more easy going squad in the big size for more playful skiing.

Now the question is where to mount hmm. -5cm is the magic on the BO118 and sickle, could work out pretty good here aswell.

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-5 from tc? or -5 from -5 from the directional point?

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Originally Posted by Bushwacka

-5 from tc? or -5 from -5 from the directional point?

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Tc