Sadly people (married) fall in and out of love all the time. As a father of 2 just a few years younger than yours, I feel for you Fred. Accept the situation and role with it- but realize that in all likelihood none of your actions from here will have a significant impact on your wife's decision to stay married or move on.
This is going to be tough for you, if it works great, but if it doesn't then, you said it: drawn out. She will be in control, you will be waiting in limbo, hoping and trying really hard (too hard?) to win her back. Sounds like you have tried hard already.Quote:
Originally Posted by frozenwater
Lot's of wisdom in the posts here particularly from Bean dip & Tim.
Take a break, keep busy, get counseling, And really take up those ski offers above. That will take you out of the situation, and you will be doing something really good for yourself .
Good luck and best wishes man
Keep your chin up Fred.
It'll be o.k. eventually no matter how impossible that might seem to you right now.
This always helped me.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_tVNzK4Cv1B...0/mt.Ogden.jpg
Money is just money. It will sort itself out. Put that frustration down when you can.
Don't focus on the love you have lossed, try to find new opportunities to surround yourself with the love of your children and friends.
Friends (including maggots) are there for you when you need them. Don't be afraid to ask for help.
Good luck man.
You'll get through this as long as you don't give up.
Work on yourself, recreate your own identity, and you'll make it.
Didn't read through the thread.
This part caught my attention.
THIS is the problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by alias
The harder you tried, the more her love for you disappeared.
Instead of being "Fred Johnson, or frozenwater, or alias", you became "HER HUSBAND". You lost your identity in your struggle to be accepted and loved by her. You had/have a void of some kind in you that you tried filling with her. Subconsciously, your mind was telling you "If she loves me, I'm good/worthy/confident/..." and instead of becoming a worthy and confident person from within, you tried to gain worthiness and confidence from her love and approval.
In the long run, she lost attraction. Exactly because you became nothing but a shell. You tried being the super husband, ever day trying to get her to love you...By working on *external* "things", like buying her flowers, cooking her dinner, telling her you love her, or *gasp* by ignoring your friends for her! Instead, you needed to work on your *internal* frame, creating your identity independently of her, being YOU.
Or, I have no fucking clue and I'm just full of shit.
Vibes nonetheless! Get through this...
Frozen, I can't say anything any better than others have already put it. And frankly, if I tried, it would surely come out worse!
I just wanted to say that I'm happy that you turned to the TGR peeps and were able to see the incredible amounts of support out there for you.
I will just reiterate a common theme: you will get through this by looking inward and not outward.
Stay strong,
Gary...
Thank you for all of the PM's, and offers of being there and phone numbers. Thank you all for your kind words.
somehow calling up someone and talking to them seems way to hard right now. It's almost like I wouldn't know who to "Be" on the phone - that doesn't make sense, but should I be the i'll be ok guy, the fuck her I'm mad guy, the horrible sad guy? Will talking to someone in this state of affair push them away from me?
Its all to much - don't give up on me just because I am not calling you - PLEASE!
Getting a lawyer - maybe I am naive, but we aren't arguing over finance stuff. We are going to sit down over the weekend and just figure shit out that way.
She doesn't want child support or alimony. She wants to be 50/50 with the kids.
Am I dumb in thinking I don't need a lawyer right now?
---She called me about an hour ago. Want's to go to lunch.
I am afraid about everything. Is she feeling sorry for me, and the fact that this is a tough decision for her (even if it is the right one) making her once again say nevermind & forget I said I wanted a seperation (this has happened a lot)
IF I don't take the opportunity to go back to her if it is presented - but rather tell her she & I need to figure some stuff out first - am I going to regret it for the rest of my life? (right now it is the love of my life rejecting me - that is really hard, but if I become complicit with it, and she moves on - can I handle that???)
ugh. How can she destroy me - in every way a man can be destroyed, and them be nice to me too? I mean she held hands with me last night as she fell asleep. but she won't kiss me.
-way to much information, but somehow this is all I have.
You distanced yourself from your friends and you are worried by this. Don't be. Your friends will be your friends whether you hang with them nightly or once every 5 years. True friends will be there when you need them. Call them, lean on them, use them (just not in the biblical sense,;)) they will help. Peeps like MD9 summed it up...even though you haven't skied together much recently he is there and ready, that is what makes a true friend.
Try to keep perspective on the big picture. One day you will be holding one of your daughters children and this part of your life will be a distant memory.
Good luck FrozenWater.
Don't worry about the too much info stuff. It is just a way of letting people know what is on your mind and what worrys you. You are trying to communicate and clear your head. That is what this place is for to lean on others when you are in need.
I would accept her offer for lunch but be prepared for the good and bad in what she might have to say. If you go and it gets awkward with silence you always have your daughters to talk about...special moments funny moments.
You mentioned she spoke of separation and not divorce but some of the things you wrote in your last post look more like divorce discussion rather that separation.
Fight the good fight, you have plenty of the right thoughts in your head (focus on your children etc.) and things WILL get better, whether its the path you'd prefer them to go on or not. Maybe she'll come back around, maybe not, no use obsessing over that when it's her choice, not yours. Focus on your kids and getting whatever joy you can back into your life. And we all do care for you, whether we've just known you through the internet or in real life.
Fred,
My parents got separated when I was 5 years old which led to a divorce. For the next 5-6 years my father was a few days a month kind of visitor. When I was 10ish my parents decided to move to a new house and live together as a family again. Senior year of high school I watched my parents get remarried. They couldn't be happier today and they absolutely have the greatest relationship.
Problem was, raising 3 young boys, them still being relatively young, a recent move to a different state and having work problems (sound familiar?) took a toll on them. They needed to get their heads straight and their priorities down to make it all work. And it DID work. So, even if it looks hopeless don't give up the fight. You can still win this one with time.
Its hard to not talk about those issues in relationship to seperation. Since we have been tetering on this edge for years those conversations have taken place.Quote:
Originally Posted by atomicboy
---sorry for the flip/flop from alias/frozenwater. I was reading pms on alias account and forgot to log out. I am trying to be frozenwater again. - I knew who that guy was.
wow, what an insensitive post. the only thing missing is a reminder to wear a helmet. i would be surprised if you have had anything devastating emotionally crush your life, and overtake your waking thoughts, and rob your sleep. Have a heart for God's sake.Quote:
Originally Posted by ProHoHater
time + friends + ripping big powder lines + your kidsQuote:
Originally Posted by alias
Fred, I just picked up on this, sorry to hear. You know I got your back if you need something.
In the meantime maybe go kill some ducklings. I have a hammer you can borrow if you want..
So... SHE'S paying the mortgage on her place herself? SHE'S buying all the food for that residence, the electricity, the heat, absolutely everything??? If not, then you ARE paying child support and/or alimony things, just in a round-about way.Quote:
Originally Posted by alias
Good regards the 50/50 with the kids... make sure you remind her as often as you can that you'll accept nothing less. That's both a parental and financial decision... Often in a divorce the court continues what ever the existing situation is, make sure you are getting your half in case she sours and a Judge somewhere is going to make this decision for you two.
If you can at all afford one, YES, I think you need at least some advice now. There is "separation" meaning we just live separately; then "separation" meaning we've signed all the paperwork at the court house and in one year we can convert it straight to a divorce. As I understand it many things that you agree to now are likely to become permanent should this go divorce-ward.
Lastly, remember YOU can set some expectations for this arrangement too. If you have certain expectations for this living apart time, or things you'll want, now is the time to ask for them/assert some rights. Hell, you can tell her that YOU'LL be the one to start a divorce if she isn't willing to give you what you want/need. It's probably adding fuel to the fire, but could help you learn if this is planned as just a step towards eventual divorce?
Frozen, another mag that sends his best wishes and has lived barely long enough to know that it WILL get better. I will stay out of interpersonal recommendations, but follow MD9's advise and exercise a whole hell of a lot. Good luck buddy.
Froz, hang in there, man.
THis hit me: "She wants to see if seperation will make her a happier person. She wants to try and hang out still, date each other as it were - and maybe she can get happy again and fall in love again.
I am torn. That SOUNDS good, I mean I don't want to leave her - but the drawn out process, me trying to get her to fall in love with me again, being in limbo for who knows how long - man that sounds tough too."
Make her do the work, play hard to get. If you do all the work, I really don't think it's going to help, but prolong your misery. I may be off the mark, but that's my $.02.
Hope thats not the way it was taken. I meant it to help. Its helped others in the past. I didn't write it to you, so perhaps your take on it is not the way someone in pain would take it.Quote:
Originally Posted by MagicMtnPinhead
Best of luck, be glad for your health, your kids, and the air you breath.
Edit: And yes wear a helmet
It's gonna sound dumb.. but take it back to the dating "games" in your youth... remember... if you played it all lovey like you wanted them they walked away... if you played it cool and aloof, went and did the stuf you like that is separate from her... they'd (sometimes) fall all over you.
My guess... you're trying too hard and worrying too much. Get away from the situation for even a day. then see what is going on.
could be wrong, but at least you get a day of doing something YOU want to do.
Yo, Fred....although this is a sad time indeed, it will get better and you will be able to cope better with time.
pm or call me. I might have something for you.
Don't even think about what you might want. Give her EVERYTHING.
You are young enough to start over and the fight for material shit will only drain you until you are empty.
Fred,
Nothing to add but to wish you well. Good luck with everything.
Off the topic but I will throw it out. I would keep a journal of your actions with $ and time spent with your kids...especially with your kids. Took them to school, picked them up, too them to the park, they slept over on this date and that date. I have all the hope for you in making this work but you never know how it is going to play out down the line. If it goes the wrong direction and both of you lawyer up it is good to have documentation if and when you ever need it. Separation and divorce can do strange things to people.
You love your girls and 50/50 is great but what if she through the advice of her attorney want 80/20 etc etc. If you can prove you have been 50/50 or maybe the kids stayed longer with you it is important to substantiate it with documentation. My best friend went through a similar situation with separation and divorce and his documentation saved his ass. I know you may think I am jumping the gun with this advice but four months ago did you think you might be living on your own come April 1st. Stay positive and I hope lunch went well.