ON3P SKIS Discussion

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Originally Posted by kid-kapow

Sweet - thanks for the update!

C&D day for me today. Bluebird-ish, lots of snow after a big storm and stoke through the roof in spite of being a bit under the weather.

On a side note, I've spent a few days on Wildcat108s over the past week. I must admit to preferring Woodsman108s over Wildcat108s. Wildcats are fun on groomers, but get knocked around quite a bit more in variable. While I haven't tried them back to back, my take so far is that you do not gain enough playfulness to make up for the loss in stability when going from a wood to wild. Using wildcat108s also makes me even more curious on how a jeffrey108 that is custom stiffer and mounted 2cm back would ride, especially as I am finally starting to make sense of my custom stiffer k116s :) .

The main takeaway so far is that I am considering remounting my wood108/116s with Shifts over Castified Pivots (Shifts work better with the XTDs I mainly use) - or perhaps I should get a second pair of wood108s this summer. Dunno. Prob can't afford the latter. ;)

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I only have 1 day on my 187cm woodsman 108, 15+ days on 190 wildcat 116, and 50+ days on a 186 Jeffrey 108 proto. Here’s my take, which will change when I get more days on my woodsman.

185lbs
Comfortable initiating turns in either forward or neutral stance
Used to be a jibber

Wildcat 116 vs Jeffrey 108

Overall Feel
Jeffrey is stiffer but looser. Similar suspension and playfulness.

Powder
Jeffrey Floats much better in any stance.

Chop
Jeffrey blasts through it, wildcat gets deflected easily.

Groomers
Wildcat is a more natural carver, Jeffrey is a bit loose

Summary
Why would you buy the wildcat? It doesn’t float as well, gets deflected more easily, similar playfulness and suspension.


Woodsman 108

Only one day so far on shit snow. Felt NOTICEABLY stiffer than the Jeffrey. Biggest difference so far is that it’s not as loose. Still plenty of pop, but with more camber and less rocker I felt like I was fighting the ski a little bit in rock hard crud, but it definitely was much more stout than either of the other skis, especially in the tip. On groomers it had similar performance to the wildcat.







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Good keep skiing the woodsman — maybe my 3 days on the skis just were shit days haha I want to hear more from what people like or don’t like about it.


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Originally Posted by tuco

God damn I love these Caylors! You should do a limited time repress of these gems.

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Totally agree! I bought Powtron’s old Caylors last year. They’re the most fun skis I have. Mood usually dictates C&D or Caylor on a fresh snow day (bouncy/air-time = Caylor, or charge/destroy trees = C&D). They Caylors tho, happy, fun, bouncy, playful skis!

I’m looking at the Wrenegade 96 ti. Be honest: for groomer skiing (or any type, for that matter), is its construction as sound as a Euro OEM ski?

Like, Euro OEMs have manufactured skis for many decades and kind of know what do do. Just wondering if ON3P compares.

Also, can someone speak to the quality of the raw materials? I’m not insinuating anything, but I know USA-based companies (of any type ) try to get the ass-cheapest stuff. (Really not trying to single any one company out, but perhaps you know what I’m trying to communicate).


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Originally Posted by Gaperious Basterd

I’m looking at the Wrenegade 96 ti. Be honest: for groomer skiing (or any type, for that matter), is its construction as sound as a Euro OEM ski?

Like, Euro OEMs have manufactured skis for many decades and kind of know what do do. Just wondering if ON3P compares.

Also, can someone speak to the quality of the raw materials? I’m not insinuating anything, but I know USA-based companies (of any type ) try to get the ass-cheapest stuff. (Really not trying to single any one company out, but perhaps you know what I’m trying to communicate).


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The (successful) independent American ski companies survive amongst the long-established European brands because they are using top quality materials with very careful craftmanship, plus have the scale to really innovate. Construction methods are pretty much the same across the board.

I prefer the feel of the ON3P build to just about anything, including double metal laminates. The bamboo core is so solid... damp but responsive. Try em, man. You'll be stoked.

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Originally Posted by Gaperious Basterd

I’m looking at the Wrenegade 96 ti. Be honest: for groomer skiing (or any type, for that matter), is its construction as sound as a Euro OEM ski?

Like, Euro OEMs have manufactured skis for many decades and kind of know what do do. Just wondering if ON3P compares.

Also, can someone speak to the quality of the raw materials? I’m not insinuating anything, but I know USA-based companies (of any type ) try to get the ass-cheapest stuff. (Really not trying to single any one company out, but perhaps you know what I’m trying to communicate).


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The construction is much better than most of the big name euro brands.

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Are you conserned by lack of quality, or bad design?
Quality is superb, however I'm not sure that I'd reccomend any ON3P for groomers.

Depends on what you're looking for in a groomer-ski.
- bombing roughed up, but soft groomers? Sure, get some Wrens.
- carving hard snow / ice?
Maybe something else

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Originally Posted by MHSP1497

Totally agree! I bought Powtron’s old Caylors last year. They’re the most fun skis I have. Mood usually dictates C&D or Caylor on a fresh snow day (bouncy/air-time = Caylor, or charge/destroy trees = C&D). They Caylors tho, happy, fun, bouncy, playful skis!

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I've been skiing them on hard snow too. These skis charge too. Terrain eaters.

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Originally Posted by Gaperious Basterd

I’m looking at the Wrenegade 96 ti. Be honest: for groomer skiing (or any type, for that matter), is its construction as sound as a Euro OEM ski?

Like, Euro OEMs have manufactured skis for many decades and kind of know what do do. Just wondering if ON3P compares.

Also, can someone speak to the quality of the raw materials? I’m not insinuating anything, but I know USA-based companies (of any type ) try to get the ass-cheapest stuff. (Really not trying to single any one company out, but perhaps you know what I’m trying to communicate).


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This EURO quality shit is WAAAY overblown. I've had 2 skis come apart on me, both of which were Euro built(1 of which resulted in injury). In fact, 1 pair was built by the company credited with building the 1st laminate ski

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Originally Posted by Norseman

The (successful) independent American ski companies survive amongst the long-established European brands because they are using top quality materials with very careful craftmanship, plus have the scale to really innovate. Construction methods are pretty much the same across the board.

I prefer the feel of the ON3P build to just about anything, including double metal laminates. The bamboo core is so solid... damp but responsive. Try em, man. You'll be stoked.

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What he said.

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Originally Posted by Gaperious Basterd

Also, can someone speak to the quality of the raw materials? I’m not insinuating anything, but I know USA-based companies (of any type ) try to get the ass-cheapest stuff. (Really not trying to single any one company out, but perhaps you know what I’m trying to communicate).

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Re ON3P this made me LOL


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Originally Posted by 123ski

Re ON3P this made me LOL


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Yeah. Read through this thread and you will learn that ON3P uses the best raw materials you can find.

ON3P’s e-store pate for Wrenegade 96 ti speaks of metal laminates, but the infographic doesn’t show any.

Does the ski have metal laminates in it, or not?

Attachment 317123


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That layup cross-section hasn't been updated to ti construction

Ok collective - need input.
Just finished my third day on my wren96.
After the first two days (both without new snow) I was thinking that I may need to sell them. We just weren’t getting along. Felt like I could never really get the ski under control. Things improved when I tightened up my core and put more input into them, but still just felt like they didn’t wanna corporate. Figured I may be getting soft and losing my edge.
Today, storm skiing with wind distributed 1-4”. They killed it - anything with any softness and they just lock in and ride out and underlying bumps. However, whenever I’d hit a completely wind scoured pitch, back to that out of control feeing. Opposite of locked it.
Is it the tune?! The factory tune came unlike anything I’ve seen - incredibly detuned front and back and underfoot the edge is so rounded I struggle to call it an edge. I emailed the factory about it when I first got them cuz I thought they seriously came untuned. Apparently this is the correct stock tune?
So if I get some actual edges tuned in around my underfoot (keeping tips and tails heavily detuned) can I get some hard snow performance?!?

LOL at all you dudes expecting your ON3P’s to rail hard pack. It’s not the tune. Get them in the air over the hard stuff.

You need a heavy stiff metal laminate euro ski for that.

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Originally Posted by TripleT

Is it the tune?! The factory tune came unlike anything I’ve seen - incredibly detuned front and back and underfoot the edge is so rounded I struggle to call it an edge. I emailed the factory about it when I first got them cuz I thought they seriously came untuned. Apparently this is the correct stock tune?
So if I get some actual edges tuned in around my underfoot (keeping tips and tails heavily detuned) can I get some hard snow performance?!?

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I remember having the same impression about the factory detune on the Kartels. They were so dulled out I thought it must be a mistake. I’m digging it now, but after a couple of close calls on sneaker boilerplate last week, am reluctantly considering giving them some more bite underfoot. Luckily there’s a lot of edge material available for experimentation on these skis.

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Originally Posted by TripleT

Ok collective - need input.
Just finished my third day on my wren96.
After the first two days (both without new snow) I was thinking that I may need to sell them. We just weren’t getting along. Felt like I could never really get the ski under control. Things improved when I tightened up my core and put more input into them, but still just felt like they didn’t wanna corporate. Figured I may be getting soft and losing my edge.
Today, storm skiing with wind distributed 1-4”. They killed it - anything with any softness and they just lock in and ride out and underlying bumps. However, whenever I’d hit a completely wind scoured pitch, back to that out of control feeing. Opposite of locked it.
Is it the tune?! The factory tune came unlike anything I’ve seen - incredibly detuned front and back and underfoot the edge is so rounded I struggle to call it an edge. I emailed the factory about it when I first got them cuz I thought they seriously came untuned. Apparently this is the correct stock tune?
So if I get some actual edges tuned in around my underfoot (keeping tips and tails heavily detuned) can I get some hard snow performance?!?

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Could you guys have ended up with the "park detune"? https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...f8e612392e.jpg

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Originally Posted by jackattack

LOL at all you dudes expecting your ON3P’s to rail hard pack. It’s not the tune. Get them in the air over the hard stuff.

You need a heavy stiff metal laminate euro ski for that.

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My 189 / 108 Wrenegades ski great on hardpack, as do my 184 / 98 Wrens. Are you saying that they should suck in those conditions?

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Originally Posted by Viva

My 189 / 108 Wrenegades ski great on hardpack, as do my 184 / 98 Wrens. Are you saying that they should suck in those conditions?

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Could not agree more... I have both the Wren 98 and 108 in 189 and both hold a killer edge on groomers... Blue boiler plate ice no but firm there are no issues at all... Not sure what Jack is talking about but not the experience I have had with them...


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They’re certainly not optimized for it.

Just sick of people posting here complaining that their on3ps are rad everywhere but wind scoured hardpack and refrozen bumps. That’s NOT the design goal from my perspective.

I am tracking with you, but there is a big difference between groomers and scoured hard pack and refrozen bumps... I may have missed it but TripleT did not mention anything about scoured hard pack and frozen bumps... It is either the tune or to much ski for him... My 98s are a breeze to ski and rail groomers (even firm groomers) and actually do a decent job on dust on crust... On the conditions you describe yeah they would be full on suck and the only ski I would be on in those conditions would be a sub 80 ski..,


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For anyone looking... there were just some Wren 114’s in 184cm that were listed on eBay. Buy it now, not auction.

had a hell of a sleeper day on my wren 108s today. 3-12” wind loaded on chalk and ice. killer ski for high speed variable. my legs are finally strong enough to keep up for most of the fall line. i started the day on some shorter invictus 99ti until i was more worried about float than edge. definitely too short to ski soft snow aggressively. the wren is gonna be the ski i take to europe this year.

my kartel shapes don’t get tuned so are much more saucer status as i tool them for.

i need to dig through this thread and track down that bozone demo fleet. skiing 28/29 and the forecast is lookin wren ti inclined. id drop to 184 for sure. maybe 179.

fuck, those woodsman demos on the site are tempting though, i need a touring ski.

I wanted to share some thoughts/review now that I have 8 days on my 187cm Woodsman 108s. I am 6'0, 160lbs, 19yo.
I've had these on everything from ice to waist deep powder.
In 20-30 inches of fresh, light Jackson Hole blower, they were incredible. They float, charge, slash/slarve/pivot, etc. so much fun. I was never wishing for anything wider either. They were amazing.
In heavier/not fresh powder, the tail felt a little bit too locked into the turn, although that may have been because I haven't waxed or detuned them at all since they came from the factory. This wasn't too noticeable though.
I have never had a problem with tip dive in any conditions, though strangely I can tell that I definitely would if I had gone with the 182. Worth mentioning they are mounted -1cm (because I am 19 and can't really afford a dedicated powder ski, so these are my widest ski in the quiver, and I live in New England (not sure why I thought I could afford an ON3P at all, but whatever)).
For a substantially rockered, 108mm underfoot ski, they are really fun on groomers. Their weight and stiffness makes them really stable, and although I initially thought they felt dead, after skiing on them for a couple days I have found them to be surprisingly fun and playful now that I'm used to the weight. They are just so solid over any rough snow. I have been skiing 180cm 1800g Blizzard Rustler 10s for the last 2 years (they are now my tree/hardpack east coast ski) so it was just an adjustment curve. The more I ski it and get used to it, the more I love these skis. They are also great in both soft and denser chop, I can really just point and charge through. And they are very solid on landings on any type of surface. In soft moguls with a bit of snow on top, they are fine if you take it slow, but when the moguls get bigger and steeper and harder, or you want to go faster, they are quite tiring for me.
*side note: If I knew I wouldn't be able to take it out west and ski more open terrain, I'd definitely opt for the 182cm for moguls and tight east coast trees. And I already have my Rustlers for that, so I'd size up to the 116 waist for new england powder days. But I plan to and have basically just used these every day, regardless of conditions, when I go out West.

I've noticed some people selling them because they tried them for a couple days and didn't like them. I was almost in that boat. But give them time before you list them. It took me about 4 or 5 days before they really started to shine for me, now I love them.

Thanks for input everyone.

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Originally Posted by Viva

My 189 / 108 Wrenegades ski great on hardpack, as do my 184 / 98 Wrens. Are you saying that they should suck in those conditions?

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Originally Posted by Undertow

Could not agree more... I have both the Wren 98 and 108 in 189 and both hold a killer edge on groomers... Blue boiler plate ice no but firm there are no issues at all... Not sure what Jack is talking about but not the experience I have had with them...

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And how do you have yours tuned?

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Originally Posted by jackattack

They’re certainly not optimized for it.

Just sick of people posting here complaining that their on3ps are rad everywhere but wind scoured hardpack and refrozen bumps. That’s NOT the design goal from my perspective.

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Not complaining, seeking understanding. If these skis aren’t able to handle variable snow (which wind scoured hard park and refrozen bumps are a part of), then what is the goal? Not expecting that to be their forte but I hoped that managing an array of variable conditions would be well within their comfort zone

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Originally Posted by Undertow

... It is either the tune or to much ski for him...

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Bingo. Thought it could be too much ski and then they came alive today so now I’m wondering about the tune.

I had my first day on on3p skis yesterday - wren 108s/184. This got me thinking, perhaps I need 184 1.5 BGs to replace my white room 186 renegades. Any fellow cult member care to comment on how they compare (BGs vs white room rens)?