DOI list of office closures. Unclear if this is a proposed list or an approved/scheduled/set list: https://democrats-naturalresources.h...rminations.pdf
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DOI list of office closures. Unclear if this is a proposed list or an approved/scheduled/set list: https://democrats-naturalresources.h...rminations.pdf
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Trump wants to cut down America's forest. Just sign an EO, and viola! Timber!!!
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...xecutive-order
The president, in an executive order, has demanded an expansion in tree cutting across 280m acres (113m hectares) of national forests and other public lands, claiming that “heavy-handed federal policies” have made America reliant on foreign imports of timber.“It is vital that we reverse these policies and increase domestic timber production to protect our national and economic security,” the order adds.Trump has instructed the US Forest Service and Bureau of Land Management to increase logging targets and for officials to circumvent the US’s Endangered Species Act by using unspecified emergency powers to ignore protections placed upon vulnerable creatures’ habitats.
anytime a company wants to right size they rid of the oldest guys who also make the most money, Trump keeps the oldest guys, gets rid of the youngest guys, will still have to retire the old guys and hire back the young guys if they are still around TO hire
but along with tarrifs this is be great ... you will see !
Well, I have no issue with supporting the timber industry on face value. Like it or not, we need the stuff. South East Alaska had a robust timber industry that essentially evaporated before I moved there. The pulp mill and timber industry was a big employer in Ketchikan/Sitka.
Timber is like oil, nobody likes to admit we need it, but we do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackhead
interesting read http://www.sitnews.us/Kiffer/Ketchik...pulp_mill.html
I am close to paper manufacturing and know there is more supply than demand in the US, and consolidation due to that. trend is also US companies selling out to international ownership
But yet existing timber sales on forest service land are going without any bids because the value of the wood is too low right now. Flooding the market isn't going to improve that situation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackhead
I have no issue with timber production. Like virtually everything Trump does, this is an order that has some vague correlation to a good idea, carried out in the dumbest way possible without any regard for how to actually achieve tangible benefits.
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Yup, agreed. Wonder if that will change with Mr. Tariff going all crazy.
No idea.
GSA list of Fed buildings and facilities for disposal. I have no idea if there are USFS/BLM facilities included: https://www.gsa.gov/real-estate/real...-property-list
This is different than the list I posted upthread which are building leases under DOI to be ended.
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^^per that list, the first property I researched, and it's totally justified to sell. Read this article from 2022. For those with short attention span, the feds spend $800k per year maintaining the property, it isn't used, and was purchased as a "security buffer" around the courthouse. They spend $70k per year on scaffolding to protect the public from the building falling apart on pedestrians.
https://wgntv.com/news/wgn-investiga...t-to-demolish/
A lot of this is utter fucking hysteria, some of it is bullshit, but a bunch of it is justified.
The first building I looked at was the Henry Jackson Federal Building which is a 37 story sky scraper in downtown Seattle. I think that's likely a bit less cut and dry than Trackhead's example. According to the Googles that has 1900 fed employees in it.
Is the idea that the govt would sell the building to a private entity who would then rent to the feds?
just a random private entity
That list includes several agency HQ buildings, like HHS and HUD. Also includes the DC “Steam Distri Tunnels” and the federal buildings’ central heating plant. lol
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I'm trying to stay out of Polyass.Quote:
Originally Posted by shroom
<p>
</p>Quote:
Originally Posted by bodywhomper
<p>
But think of how much money the taxpayers will save if federal employees just wear jackets. Heating is for socialists.</p>
I have no doubt the cost of controlling adjacent properties is exponentially cheaper than the cost of probable upgrades needed to harden that facility against the very real threats a fed courthouse in downtown Chicago would face. I guess you could "let it roll" and risk another OKC or '93 WTC, but 800k/yr is probably a relative bargain compared to the cost of a successful attack.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackhead
I like to flirtQuote:
Originally Posted by John_B
Quote:
Originally Posted by toast2266
Newsletter came out today - they said don't worry nothing is different for them and they are hiring 5 more "pro trail maintence workers" this summer. Time to bump up my annual donation.Quote:
Originally Posted by muted reborn
Super late to the timber discussion, but my anecdote on the matter comes from being around Montana during the 2000s.
Montana also used to have a pretty solid timber industry that employed a lot of people in the local economy, and paid fairly well for the times.
But Montana timber could ever stand against any competition over the long run. Its timber is farther from ports and markets than many other states, and has a far longer replacement rate than any forest along the west coast. Throw in international competition and the 2009 recession, and the industry simply withered. Tons of mills closed and hurt many local communities.
And it really never came back. Some have hoped for a resurgence, but the timber industry is just a footnote in today’s MT economy.
It’s mostly a niche gig up here now.
In a related issue, Federal appeals court just ruled that corner crossing is legal, at least in the 6 states in the court's jurisdiction. The case was in Wyoming. My source is paywalled. Look it up yourself.
In a related issue, Federal appeals court just ruled that corner crossing is legal, at least in the 6 states in the court's jurisdiction. The case was in Wyoming. The territorial jurisdiction of the Tenth Circuit includes the six states of Oklahoma, Kansas, New Mexico, Colorado, Wyoming, and Utah, plus those portions of the Yellowstone National Park extending into Montana and Idaho.
Deny Depose Delay
Decide
https://www.wilderness.org/articles/...iation-package
- The bill forces the arbitrary sale of at least 2 million acres of Forest Service and Bureau of Land Management lands in 11 Western states over the next five years, and it gives the secretaries of the interior and agriculture broad discretion to choose which places should be sold off. This, just weeks after bipartisan outrage over land sell off text threatened passage of the House bill. That provision was ultimately removed from the House bill and should be removed from the Senate accordingly.
- The bill directs what is likely the largest single sale of national public lands in modern history to help cut taxes for the richest people in the country. It trades ordinary Americans’ access to outdoor recreation for a short-term payoff that disproportionately benefits the privileged and well-connected.
Fuck Mike Lee
Yes and call or email the living daylights out of your senators and congressional representatives.Quote:
Originally Posted by brutah
The outdoor alliance has a form you can use that takes literally 20 seconds. https://www.outdooralliance.org/blog...of-public-land
I'd imagine this is fairly farfetched? Ppl on both sides will be like yeah nah.
Although I've been joking ynp is being sold to Saudi Arabia to pay off national debt
Since Trump is president, why doesn't he just declare the U.S. bankrupt and screw over all our creditors? Wipe the slate clean. That's what he does with his own businesses, right? Surprised he hasn't threatened to do it.
There are many that fear Trump will attempt just that. Then our economy will be truly fucked and everyone’s mortgage will be underwater. Just the mention of it as a real possibility causes the markets to freak out
Guess I better get more trumpcoin. The only way out
Interesting that no public lands in Montana are included...
Was wondering if that was a glitch. Quiet up here.
Its suprisingly looking possible at this point, although Id guess the terms and amount of acres will change and no its not a sure thing anything passes.Quote:
Originally Posted by byates1
While the over the top non-profit wilderness fearmongers will lead you to believe we are putting new neighborhoods and a local Chevron in the middle of Bears Ears or your local shangri-la, most likely it will be limited to checkerboard acres near or on city limits adjacent to existing infrastructure. Then again, they are liars not to be trusted. So Im completely opposed to this and fuck mike lee and fuck Lyman and Celeste and the Sagebrush rebellion 2.0 because ultimately they want all federal land in Utah to be run by Utah and this is a great first step/lie.
The majority of lands to be sold are in the PNW and California. It’s actually very surprising how few federal lands in Utah are included in the bill. Obviously they are trying to get Zinke to vote for it by not selling Montana lands. The entire GOP is fucking evil. Selling public lands and taking away healthcare to fund tax cuts for the richest people in the world. While still creating a huge add on to the debt.
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I think the intent is to open up protected areas for resource extraction (mineral, fossile fuel, timber, etc), along with providing the billionaire class new opportunity to buy up vast swathes for their ranches/estates... there are currently way more people with money looking for huge acreage in the west to build a compound, than there is available, desireable land to buy. This would fix that. The obvious concern is that this would actually eliminate access to your shangri-la, because it would either now be on private property, or the trail/road access to it would be on private property... and timber sales would greatly impact the ecology and aesthetics of way more places.Quote:
Originally Posted by muted reborn
On the whole this is a terrible, awful, shortsighted idea. But, if it does go through, i garauntee there will be more than a few TGR mags looking to buy up mountain acreage themselves, or to pool money into buying up large mountain acreage. It could be interesting.
UT inclusion has changed. They removed grazing as a protected lease in recent update yesterday. Most of UT is on the chopping block right now.
I wanna buy a mountain top!
Well Im sorry, my son, you are too late in asking. Mr Peabodys coal train has hauled it away.Quote:
Originally Posted by m2711c
Sent form email to my reps got form email back. Maybe I should do everything via forms and just have form comms. Forms for everything
That seems like exactly the land that is most worth protecting.Quote:
Originally Posted by muted reborn
While yes, the land near dense population centers is the land that is most tempting for developers to buy and build on (especially at a chummy discount for donors...)...that's also the land that has some of the most possible recreation and environmental value.
A square of checkerboard in the middle of nowhere, maybe not a big deal. But the chunks of forest near a city? That's the most accessible type of public land. It provides places for trails, it provides greenery and helps clean the air. Not to mention habitat for animals and vegetation.
It is also the hardest type of land to replace. Once it is gone it is gone. Occasionally you get cities creating new parks from previously developed land but it is rare (and usually small and limited in scope). If they take the land and develop it, it is now developed land pretty much forever. Its not like that land will end up in the hands of a timber company or even an oil drilling company that will keep it mostly wild where it could potentially be returned to the public at some point.
The map looks to include forest service land that is already leased to ski resorts (and other types of operators), so normally I'd say this has a 0% chance of actually happening. But since the current executive branch seems ready to completely ignore the courts I'm terrified and enraged now. WTF?!?Take a look at the Chair 4 area of Kirkwood for example, which looks to be for sale. And most of Heavenly.