U.S. moves to terminate leases on public lands.

[toast2266]

https://www.whitehouse.gov/president...cy-initiative/

Looks to terminate public leases and sell off public land that is deemed "no longer needed."

I don't see this as a win for the ski industry.

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[alias_rice]

There’s very few people that this will be a win for.

[bodywhomper]

Thanks for sharing the EO and link.

I think with the USFS, land “no longer needed” has an existing designation in the current forest plan. Otherwise, the forest or regional ranger likely has an easy argument for not disposing of the property. For leases, I think the assessment would be related to whether the lease is consistent with the forest plan. That’d probably be the process under normal bureaucratic gov paradigm. Hard to say how this’ll play out under the current patrimonial government paradigm.

[Hott Butt Mud]

What is "real property"?

[BCMtnHound]

What is "real property"?

Not sure exact legal terms for the US, but in Canada, this is essentially private property owned by an individual entity, with all the rights normally assigned to such.
Here, it doesn’t usually include mineral or other subsurface rights, or water that flows through overland and foreshore rights.

[toast2266]

Hard to say how this’ll play out under the current patrimonial government paradigm.

Definitely. Really hard to say how this will unfold. I'm sure there will be all kinds of pushback, but there's a lot of potential for this to be pretty bad. Even if the real world ramifications are just putting on pressure to jack up the prices of leases and extract more money out of public land.

If this was any other administration, I'd see this as a bit of tidying up that was probably worthwhile. Of course, I don't think any other administration would have done this kind of thing through an executive order.



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[Hott Butt Mud]

Of course this is scary. This administration has already shown some pretty wild takes (even if they are supposedly joking).

Just today, we had POTUS post an AI generated video to Gaza with golden Trump statues and Trump Gaza tower. The vision is clear - they want to dismantle the federal government, including federal lands, and their final outcome dream is Trump Aspen tower mid-way up Ajax, Trump Moab, Trump Yosemite, etc. Even if it's not a fully gold statue, they will settle for a lesser grandiose land sell-off. The ultra wealthy will purchase who will privatize the tourism, and/or completely block off land and use it for whatever resources they can extract.

[coldfeet]

It's of course utterly unclear what is going on. Most ski areas that I've seen that operate in whole or part on US Forest Service land have a statement like "operated under a special use permit from the USFS." It is probable that the special use permit is not the same, legally, as a lease. (In fact, my workplace, not a ski area, also operates under a similar FS permit.) There are Forest Service leases, which include things like the land under privately owned cabins, and probably a variety of commercial operations (mines? mining is its own bundle of weird and outdated laws).

Regardless, one thing this will do is create more uncertainty, and that's bad for businesses like ski areas.

[TBS]

USFS leases as lot of land to ranchers for grazing.
Terminating those leases (and those with BLM, a much larger expanse, will not go over well with the rugged individual, up-by-the-bootstraps MAGA crowd.

And FWIW, USFS already sells land that isn’t core to its needs.

[The SnowShow]

^^^ hopefully that’s exactly what will happen to these MAGA assholes. And hopefully the lease for whatever ski area our resident MAGAt skis at will be terminated as well.

[Toadman]

https://www.whitehouse.gov/president...cy-initiative/ Looks to terminate public leases and sell off public land that is deemed "no longer needed." I don't see this as a win for the ski industry. Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk

No wonder Trump wants to visit Fort Knox. He's going to do a major gold heist. He needs it for those 100 foot gold statues hes going to build at his properties.

[Hopeless Sinner]

My buddy, retired BLM/USFS says the original intent of the BLM was to dispose of the land under it's jurisdiction, apparently that time has arrived. He also said 300,000 acres was recently turned over to the Utah which would have the ability to sell it as it sees fit.

[jackattack]

Can’t you hear them?

Drill baby drill.

[The SnowShow]

So all that BLM land that off-roading enthusiasts enjoy will now be sold off?? Great job MAGats

[Trackhead]

More political threads…


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[Ikon_Police]

Cool, so world record narcissist/legit sociopath and his new ET-human hybrid psycho buddy are straight up ruining the world? GOOD JOB FUCK NUTS. Surprise! Orange Jesus doesn't give a fuck about you and never ever did. Wait until he makes it illegal to be upside down on your loaned and lifted 2024 Duramax pavement queen and he shuts down all Buffalo Wild Wings. Will you fucking brainless fucks get it then?

[zion zig zag]

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More political threads&hellip; Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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True, and I stay out of them as much as my willpower allows, but....as outdoor enthusiasts and public land users I think this is relevant to get in front of as many people as possible, as soon as posible.</p>

[Trackhead]

Maybe, but it won’t have any meaningful impact in these halls.

[toast2266]

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More political threads&hellip; Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Just because the topic of conversation is something the government is doing doesn&#39;t mean the discussion of it needs to be political.&nbsp; Like ZZZ said, this is obviously relevant to any outdoor recreationist.</p>

[muted reborn]

"He also said 300,000 acres was recently turned over to the Utah which would have the ability to sell it as it sees fit."

It's misleading to write the above and pair it in the context of this thread. SUWA quote:

“The Dingell Act Land Exchange will result in stronger protections for the outstanding San Rafael Swell in southern Utah. It ensures the long-term protection of designated wilderness areas in Emery County – federal public lands that will no longer be at risk from the threat of development and inconsistent management that comes with a checkerboard pattern of state and federal land ownership,” said Travis Hammill, DC Director for SUWA.
“But let’s be clear: in no way, shape, or form does this land exchange “return” federal land to the State of Utah as Governor Cox and Senator Curtis misleadingly claim. The State of Utah has no legitimate claim to federal public lands, and land exchanges like this one are standard action to streamline land management following the designation of wilderness areas, a national park, or a national monument.

[Trackhead]

Toast….are we not being a bit reactionary?

MAGA loves utilization of public land for resource development (logging, grazing, etc). I highly doubt this will have any detrimental effect to the ski industry operating on public lands.

Selling underutilized FS land is not a new concept.
https://www.fs.usda.gov/land/staff/disposal.shtml

[Trackhead]

And….beyond skiers, the biggest proponents of public lands are MAGA hunters/anglers if we follow stereotypes.

[toast2266]

Toast….are we not being a bit reactionary?

MAGA loves utilization of public land for resource development (logging, grazing, etc). I highly doubt this will have any detrimental effect to the ski industry operating on public lands.

Selling underutilized FS land is not a new concept.
https://www.fs.usda.gov/land/staff/disposal.shtml

MAGA also loves privatizing public resources. Why have public lands that are just a bunch of trees when you can have private ranches covering thousands of acres?

It's all speculation at this point, and perhaps it's reactionary. But if there's anything this administration has demonstrated, it's that they're very willing to move quickly and broadly, with relatively little consideration of downstream consequences.

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[singlesline]

What is "real property"?

Basically what everyone who is not a lawyer calls "real estate"

There's more nuance and regional variation in when you would use one term vs the other, but for these purposes it is land/real estate.

[singlesline]

MAGA also loves privatizing public resources. Why have public lands that are just a bunch of trees when you can have private ranches covering thousands of acres?

It's all speculation at this point, and perhaps it's reactionary. But if there's anything this administration has demonstrated, it's that they're very willing to move quickly and broadly, with relatively little consideration of downstream consequences.

This is definitely one of those things where even if the intentions were good (doubt they are), the "move fast and break things" ethos of the tech bros doesn't work.

Public lands aren't a startup you can just cast aside if it fails or some code change you can just roll back. Impacts can take decades (or centuries) to resolve. Once land ownership is broken up it can be impossible to piece it back together.

Just not something you really want done quickly with little oversight at a time when people aren't paying a lot of attention because the zone is being flooded with other stuff. So...somebody has got to pay attention to it and I don't think it is going to be the side-by-side drivers (they'll just wait until its gone and then complain)