Die Traversers Die!

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It's funny, in surfing there are clear rules. They have been developed for people's safety, and if you break the rules surfing you will likely have your face beaten in. This could never occur in skiing.

Silverton has a sign at the top of the lift that says:

"Traversing is LAME. Don't be lame!"

Silverton is right!

Word.......

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Originally Posted by DaveVt

Seems like poeple ski the resorts to get a bunch of vert. and be in the scene.

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I ski because I like skiing. When people screw up perfectly good runs with 1000 traverse tracks, it messes up everyone's skiing. I don't spend much time fuming over it, but I would love it if someone figured out a workable solution.

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Originally Posted by DaveVt

For a while they are bitter in bounds skiers. Then they rediscover skiing away from lift served areas and chill the fuck out again.

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Holier-than-thou BC skiers are just as annoying as obnoxious lift-served skiers. Just sayin'.

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Originally Posted by DaveVt

People suck. If you can't deal, remove yourself.

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If everyone had that attitude, everything would suck and there would be no place left to go.

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Originally Posted by DaveVt

Does anyone remember what it's like to be a beginner at anything, or are you too pridefull to suck at something in public? Get over yourselves.

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Don't put words in others' mouths and then tell them to "get over themselves". It's fine to be a beginner or an intermediate. It's not fine to pretend you're an advanced skier when you're not and screw up everyone else's experience.

Example: I took up mountain biking recently, and often ride with people who are faster than I am....or sometimes random riders catch up with me. So when I notice them, I *let them pass*.

Really this is all about courtesy and etiquette. As addict said, surfing has developed its own set of unwritten rules over the years: skiing, not so much.

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Originally Posted by alto

re: Hardcore inbounds skiers

You are the most despicable type of skier I know. You are the bad attitude ruining the vibe on the playground. You are so blinded by how rad you perceive yourself to be that you can't possibly see the bigger picture. You are skiing at a ski resort, yet complain when someone else skis your line, doesn't do it the cool way, or lacks the skills and knowledge that only someone blessed enough to ski everyday could have. If you yourself were really so much more enlightened, you would just laugh knowingly at what you see below you and drop off the other side of the proverbial ridge into a perfect line, meeting your friends waiting below. But instead you buzz by the person wanting to know more about the mountains, who, until your outburst of aggressive profanity was probably having a great time. You are no better than that novice, in fact you are much worse. Perhaps you should hang up the sticks for something more fitting like being a used car salesman or meter maid, where you are offered a daily opportunity to attack the needy with your malicious, pathetic personality.

/rant

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hey, how's the snow up there in the northwest? nice and fluffy for ya?

And what are your feelings regarding chairlift etiquette ?
I mean, are you supposed to ask before lowering the safety bar ?
My take on this is that the bar is meant to be used and that all you need is a quick visual check before lowering the thing.
But YMMV. WWMD ?

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Originally Posted by Spats

Holier-than-thou BC skiers are just as annoying as obnoxious lift-served skiers.

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On the internet, sure. Otherwise you're just not skinning out far enough.

You pussy.

;)

Shoot. No time to read this thread either but I just hafta say that anyone who has ever spent any time in bookends knows it is a mandatory traverse of about a mile every time if you want the good stuff. Way more than a mile on knucklehead. More than a mile on zen, and sfb's. Likewise, it's a 10 min walk plus about a half-mile traverse each and every North Baldy run.
About a half-mile traverse to Greeley Bowl and/or Rustler, Eagles, etc.
I dunno, no traversing = no much fun in my book.
Whatever.

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Originally Posted by Endlessseason

Shoot. No time to read this thread so i'll just join the conversation anyway and spew some crap to show i dont understand what's being discussed.
Whatever.

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fixed that up for ya endless.

It's German for "The traversers, the!"

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Originally Posted by alto

re: Hardcore inbounds skiers

You are the most despicable type of skier I know. You are the bad attitude ruining the vibe on the playground. You are so blinded by how rad you perceive yourself to be that you can't possibly see the bigger picture. You are skiing at a ski resort, yet complain when someone else skis your line, doesn't do it the cool way, or lacks the skills and knowledge that only someone blessed enough to ski everyday could have. If you yourself were really so much more enlightened, you would just laugh knowingly at what you see below you and drop off the other side of the proverbial ridge into a perfect line, meeting your friends waiting below. But instead you buzz by the person wanting to know more about the mountains, who, until your outburst of aggressive profanity was probably having a great time. You are no better than that novice, in fact you are much worse. Perhaps you should hang up the sticks for something more fitting like being a used car salesman or meter maid, where you are offered a daily opportunity to attack the needy with your malicious, pathetic personality.

/rant

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You don't need to spend every day skiing to have a tiny bit of common sense/courtesy, and situational awareness.

A couple years ago, some gaper fucktard traverser ended my season when he traversed right underneath me (and right past the very visable "NO TRAVERSING" sign) when I was carrying a good deal of speed in highland bowl.

You don't have to be hardcore to look uphill before cutting someone off.

I'm all for being polite to people, but there are lots of people out there that need to be politely reminded to please not turn their brains off.

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Originally Posted by slim

"Get a life beater" is the established correct and appropriate maggot reponse to "Change for a nickle." Search the archives JONG.

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LOL. Nice. I was just thinking, "How'd he know?"

I wish I was traversing right now:frown:

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Originally Posted by BlurredElevens

Most of us definitely take ourselves WAY too seriously. (I'm guilty) :redface:

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Good thing no one else takes you seriously, except for stupid JONGs and a few seriously butthurt regulars.

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Originally Posted by mmmm...pow!

Holy shit! I was going to start this thread myself. For real, if you can't ski it from the ridge, don't do it. In particular, Alpine Meadows. It's bad enough patrol puts in the traverse below Idiots, but what the fuck is up with traversing all the way out under Bernie's, across Sherwood Cliffs, below Keyhole, and all over High T. Do it from the top down, pussies! If you're too lazy to take a five minute walk, go to Squaw, they've got lifts everywhere. And all because you are not man (or woman) enough to huck the cliffs you are traversing under, doesn't mean that someone else isn't going to hit it. The five fresh turns you get fucks up countless lines for others that just want to ride the fall line.

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I hear you. It fucks up the runouts. Especially at Idiots and Keyhole, BUT... every one of those using the traverse paid for a ticket, just like you. From the ridge it is pretty much all double diamond terrain. From the traverse it is single diamond terrain. To suggest that a good portion of the mountain should be roped off to those of lesser ability is just stupid. Sure, I would like it - less skied up down below, but it will not happen. Alpine would lose business, blah, blah, blah. Alpine is not Silverton. If someone is not "man" enough, who are you to judge? Maybe they don't wish to huck a cliff. Right now I am healing a broken bone - when done, I will be out skiing. I will not huck cliffs, or ski any tight lines for some time - but I will traverse out to get powder. If that happens to be below some gnarly lines - so be it. I will of course look up to be sure I am not about to get hit, but I will ski the powder in the apron.

It is funny how some seem to think that ranting about gaper traversers on the TGR board will help fix the problem. Is it assumed that most of those gaper traversers post up here?

I would love a NO TRAVERSE sign and rope off the Chair 10 at KW. The run out off the ridge is teh suc, but it is part of skiing in bounds. I hope the new Platter fixes the traverse problem on the Wave, but it may not.

I agree anyone traversing under a rope should have a pass pulled - but if the rule is not stated by the resort, it is just a skier guideline. I am not surprised lower Flute is traversed out - with the new lift, and people not wanting to hike, but feeling the desire to explore a bit, I can imagine peole traversing out and traversing back.

Finally - anyone who hits some one on purpose is just a stupid selfish asshole.

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Originally Posted by addict

I[INDENT]t's funny, in surfing there are clear rules. They have been developed for people's safety, and if you break the rules surfing you will likely have your face beaten in. This could never occur in skiing.

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Clear rules have been developed. They go, "The downhill skier has the right of way." Valid inbounds, because he can't look behind him to know who's about to fly past. Valid OB because people above him could put him in danger.

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Originally Posted by Lone Star

hey, how's the snow up there in the northwest? nice and fluffy for ya?

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How was Thirds-Eagle's yesterday? Best ever?

When I first moved here, I definitely didn't know all the etiquette and wouldn't always pay attention because it was all so exciting and powder and gnar and steep and whoa! so I'm sure I did the things that today bug me. Geez, I probably still do.

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Originally Posted by alto

Clear rules have been developed. They go, "The downhill skier has the right of way." Valid inbounds, because he can't look behind him to know who's about to fly past. Valid OB because people above him could put him in danger.

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I realise this, but what about in a bowl, ala north bowl of kicking horse like Gripen is talking about. The traverser is coming from higher up the drainage and cutting along the base of the cliffs. The chute skier is coming from immediately higher elevation, but lower down the drainage.

Surfing rules have gray areas too, but they are designed for safety. Traversing is unsafe for the traverser, as well as the skier skiing fall line. Not just from collision, but from an avalanche safety perspective. Imagine someone traversing a whole bowl OB.....

How am I supposed to progress my game from JONG to your level without the tools of traversing, sideslipping, snow plowing, and hiking in the skin track?

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Originally Posted by alto

Clear rules have been developed. They go, "The downhill skier has the right of way." Valid inbounds, because he can't look behind him to know who's about to fly past. Valid OB because people above him could put him in danger.

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i've already explained this once, but it seems to have been missed.

a traversing skier is essentially merging with every line they cross and in that sense have the obligation to look uphill and yield to oncoming skiers.

the whole 'the downhill skier has the right of way' is the only line of the skiers responsibility code that most gapers can quote and as such the use it as carte blanche to be complete inconsiderate (and unsafe) morons assuming that everyone uphill from them is completely under control.

under control means different things in different places. coming out of a chute it may mean barely keeping your shit together until you can reach the apron and cool things down a little. traversers at least need to look uphill while traversing and make sure they dont get themselves or anyone else schmucked.

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Originally Posted by alto

Clear rules have been developed. They go, "The downhill skier has the right of way." Valid inbounds, because he can't look behind him to know who's about to fly past. Valid OB because people above him could put him in danger.


How was Thirds-Eagle's yesterday? Best ever?

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That's 100% valid when both skiers ski in the same direction, down the hill. But when the downhill skier is traversing, ie cutting the fall line, he has a responsability to check that the way is clear.
That's how I understand things, anyway.
On piste or hors piste.

Been skiing 45 years (that's why it says Old Goat)--traversing across a powder field has ALWAYS been bad manners, and if you are traversing below a chute it is up to you to look uphill to keep from getting it (in fact it's the law, sort of)
As far as sidelipping goes--the other day a boarder sideslipped the whole way down a chute at Squaw Palisades--which was closed cause it was Saturday.
I'm not that great of a skiier--never have been, but I see nothing wrong with showing some respect for those who are. When you buy a lift ticket you have the "right" to traverse and sideslip tough terrain, but that doesn't make it right.

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Originally Posted by hutash

It seems to at Alta

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under the high t there are a dozen or more traverses. my kids like to ski sunspot but once you clear the traverses there are only a few turns to be had under them.

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i've already explained this once, but it seems to have been missed.

a traversing skier is essentially merging with every line they cross and in that sense have the obligation to look uphill and yield to oncoming skiers.

the whole 'the downhill skier has the right of way' is the only line of the skiers responsibility code that most gapers can quote and as such the use it as carte blanche to be complete inconsiderate (and unsafe) morons assuming that everyone uphill from them is completely under control.

under control means different things in different places. coming out of a chute it may mean barely keeping your shit together until you can reach the apron and cool things down a little. traversers at least need to look uphill while traversing and make sure they dont get themselves or anyone else schmucked.

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Thought I'd repost this fez, since more people will probably chime in without reading.

And this too.

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Been skiing 45 years (that's why it says Old Goat)--traversing across a powder field has ALWAYS been bad manners, and if you are traversing below a chute it is up to you to look uphill to keep from getting it (in fact it's the law, sort of)
As far as sidelipping goes--the other day a boarder sideslipped the whole way down a chute at Squaw Palisades--which was closed cause it was Saturday.
I'm not that great of a skiier--never have been, but I see nothing wrong with showing some respect for those who are. When you buy a lift ticket you have the "right" to traverse and sideslip tough terrain, but that doesn't make it right.

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Lots of wisdom on this thread. Worth drilling into peoples heads.

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Originally Posted by alto

re: Hardcore inbounds skiers

You are the most despicable type of skier I know. You are the bad attitude ruining the vibe on the playground. You are so blinded by how rad you perceive yourself to be that you can't possibly see the bigger picture. You are skiing at a ski resort, yet complain when someone else skis your line, doesn't do it the cool way, or lacks the skills and knowledge that only someone blessed enough to ski everyday could have. If you yourself were really so much more enlightened, you would just laugh knowingly at what you see below you and drop off the other side of the proverbial ridge into a perfect line, meeting your friends waiting below. But instead you buzz by the person wanting to know more about the mountains, who, until your outburst of aggressive profanity was probably having a great time. You are no better than that novice, in fact you are much worse. Perhaps you should hang up the sticks for something more fitting like being a used car salesman or meter maid, where you are offered a daily opportunity to attack the needy with your malicious, pathetic personality.

/rant

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I wholeheartedly agree with this!

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Originally Posted by alto

re: Hardcore inbounds skiers

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That's all you needed to say.

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Originally Posted by fez

fixed that up for ya endless.

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heh, that was funny.

A picture would make this more clear but. People and were not takling about beginers here , as soon as they are out of the chute start traversing across the side hill. Why ? maybe to get a little more vert at the bottom of ridge? Anyway you can if you go fall line all the way to the valley bottom get caught in a low spot that you have to climb out of but its pretty easy to miss that. We're not talking about a lot of tracks but it does kinda ruin the bottom half of the run having to cross over several traverse lines. Idon't see the point of traversing through powder. Lower down there is a choke point so you don't have any advantage as you can't stay up on the slope.

I'm with Fez on this one.

Your Responsibility Code

* Safety on the slopes is everyone's responsibility. Ski safely-not only for yourself, but for others as well.
* Always stay in control and be able to stop or avoid objects.
* People ahead of you have the right of way. It is your responsibility to avoid them.
* Do not stop where you obstruct the trail or are not visible from above.
* Whenever starting downhill or merging into a trail, yield to others.
* Always use devices to help prevent runaway equipment.
* Observe all posted signs and warnings.
* Keep off closed trails and out of closed areas.
* Prior to using any lift, you must know how to load, ride, and unload safely.

Although I'm not much for law and rules, the above line does apply to this thread in the sense that traversers are merging on to "runs" for every exit they cross.

As someone else mentioned, it's hard to blame the gapers for this when there is so little done to try to let people know the 5 w's about this kind of stuff. This is one topic of many that should be discussed before they rent their first pair of skis.

well heere is a marked up pic, the upper line is the "BAD" traverse the lower line is what you can ski to.

5 pages...?

If you are on a snowboard, on a traverse, not moving, and you see my over 6 foot/200lb ass coming toward you....what are you going to do? :)

Kirkwood is the king of traverses...if we are up above one...we yell down and ask politely to hold up. That seems to work for us.

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Originally Posted by DougW

well heere is a marked up pic, the upper line is the "BAD" traverse the lower line is what you can ski to.

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That picture clears it up a bit. There you are talking about a "boogie-slide" traverse. Kind of what one may do at Jackson, off of Thunder, once in Larame(?) Bowl. Staying right, in the shadows, and traverse, to short fall line, to traverse, to short fall line. I can see why it fucks things up, but people are going to do it to find the better snow.

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Originally Posted by skier666

5 pages...?

Kirkwood is the king of traverses...if we are up above one...we yell down and ask politely to hold up. That seems to work for us.

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Yeah, why not 5? I'm an unemployed gimp. I am just wasting time until my afternoon exercise stroll.

The KW is different than the "boogie-slide". People who do not want to side slip the chute from the top will traverse underneath trying to access the lower 1000' of powder, while you rip the top 200'. At Alpine as well. And it is true, an "excuse me" from the ridge usually does the trick.

there needs to be a "real men of genius" commercial saluting you: mr. hardcore inbounds skier.

When I grow up I wanna be a "Serious Inbounds Skier" wow! I can buzz underling skiers and feel more important.

Got Stoke?

Yeah, dickhead, it's all about being more important. Right. Thats what were talking about here.
Nothing about common courtesy and protocol and what the "skiers code" actually says.

How bout you, you got any stoke? I don't seem to recall you ever posting any

Go fuck off.

I was having a killer run on Paradise Lost at solitude today and fully got rocked by the traverse-then-bumps scenario. As I was fighting to keep my feet under me I thought of this thread.

funny cause i got mad yesterday when someone fell in front of my friend on the traverse. buddy pulled out and dug into stop. i pulled out to stop and almost hit my buddy. then i got mad cause not only did i have to stop, but i could have gotten hurt and i could have hurt my buddy. so then dude keeps going and starts flailing- and so i tell him i am going to pass and he flails more and i am forced out of the traverse- so i can't to where i want to go and am stuck going where i don't want to be.

then next run after calming down, some snowboards are hiking on the traverse- so i say, please don't post hole the traverse- to which i got "they paid as much as you to ski here" back. which is true- but- common sense and etiquette go a long way i think. if you can't ride the traverse- maybe you should think twice about taking it to where you want to go.

and look up when traversing at the ridgeline so you don't get hit or put the skier above you in a dangerous position to have to do something they originally didn't plan to do.

it is not so much who is right/ wrong, but common sense and making sure we all have fun in as safe a manner as possible, whether we are just beginning or have been skiing/ boarding/ butt munching for a long time.

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Originally Posted by Ottime

That picture clears it up a bit. There you are talking about a "boogie-slide" traverse. Kind of what one may do at Jackson, off of Thunder, once in Larame(?) Bowl. Staying right, in the shadows, and traverse, to short fall line, to traverse, to short fall line. I can see why it fucks things up, but people are going to do it to find the better snow.

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It doesn't get you to better snow as far as I can see. As run out from all the chutes is about same angle so the vert you loss on the traverse you don't gain anymore with the drop of the valley. You can kinda see at the top of the valley there are some rollers. Below that you can get stuck in a low spot if not careful esp. on a pow day if one of the first ones in. I've skied knee deep days after a storm by skiing down the fall line longer than most.

here's a look down the ridge

http://www3.telus.net/public/geraldv..._4_12_08_3.jpg