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I said that a long time ago, fart knocker.Quote:
Originally posted by phUnk
Just because you can't imagine where it could go next, doesn't mean it isn't going places. I think the rate of innovation is good and will continue.
(I just wanted to call you a fart knocker.)
You know we're doing alot better when you got Shane McConkey talking about picking his nose and skiing the bumps naked in Vail in Sports Illustrated.
Compared to 10 years ago, the sport has flourished. The freeride scene has pushed the sport to the envelope, and Big Mountain Skiing is going over the Razor's Edge into the unknown. As far as skiing as a past time to take the kids up to Loveland before the Broncos game, not a whole lot has changed.
As a chick who loves to rip with the boys, drop off of shit, competes, and wouldn't mind a sponsor or two....I have come to realize that guy skiers and girls skiers are playing in two different games. As far as competing big mountain goes, guys are almost expected to pick lines that don't necessarily reflect how well they ski but how big they will huck. I don't feel that same pressure. I feel like women are judged for how well they ski. Period. So from that perspective, I think that female skiers are proving that you can rip hairy shit and still make it look good technically. Female skiers are keeping the competition about skiing in it's purest form.
On the other hand, this separate expectation doesn't pave the way for men to coddle us or treat us as inferiors, the way that I believe other athletics do. Unlike other sports where women are often forced to choose between being an athlete and being feminine (remember the Brandy Chastain sports bra debacle in the Womens World Cup Soccer tourney a few years back???) I don't feel that female skiers are being forced to make that decision. Some may call the latest all-girl issues of skiing publications objectifying, but I look at it as an opportuniy for women like Meg Oster (Meg, you kick ass!) and Charlotte Moats to trade in the full faces and body armor for a thong and a little tank top. I think that articles like those recognize that they are girls, but they could kick any guys ass on a hill. And most guys I know would love every minute of it!
Skiing keeps me sane. Without it, I am just another financial supporter (not by choice) of psychiatry.
Not blaming those issues solely on "skiing's popularity," but the growth of the industry (in terms of people and dollars i guess) does have indirect negative effects that should not be overlooked.Quote:
Originally posted by phUnk
I dig the avatar, but I think you're off-base if you're blaming problems like irresponsible land development, overcrowded population centers (or insufficient infrastructure) near ski areas and insufficient snowfall all on skiing's "popularity."
Lurkmode reactivated
First of all, let me make it clear that I'm not singling you out, but that's just a jongish thing to say.Quote:
Originally posted by girlski0912
As far as competing big mountain goes, guys are almost expected to pick lines that don't necessarily reflect how well they ski but how big they will huck. I don't feel that same pressure. I feel like women are judged for how well they ski. Period. So from that perspective, I think that female skiers are proving that you can rip hairy shit and still make it look good technically. Female skiers are keeping the competition about skiing in it's purest form.
I, personally, will ski anything, steeps don't scare me. Hucking 40-50 feet in a competition to hardpack does. Hucking is part of skiing, Women that you speak of just haven't reached that level yet. Hucking is MUCH more difficult than just skiing a tech line. If you wanted to, you could huck that whole tech line. Hucking is part of skiing, and is above and beyond skiing tech lines.
Sorry to say, but women are only skiing at their level, don't confuse that with your misconception of "women keeping skiing in its purest form".
How do you view the state of our sport today?
I have no problems. Although the innovation rate has begun to slow down (equipment wise) it seems that this has resulted in a distillation of the better ideas and the removal of stupid shit like LEDs on the top of skis (K2, get some frikin brains). Although there still isn't a ski that does exactly what I would like. Twin the xplosiv and you're basically there....
-Do you think our sport is stagnant at the moment?
-Do you think it still becoming more and more popular/'cool' in comparison to the sport industry or have we somewhat reached a plateau?
Stagnant? No. Competition-wise, there are only certain things that are physically possible from a flippy spinny shit POV. Same true of big mountain. Eventually one of the Jamie Pierres/other big huckstars will die on a huck (knock on wood). There are physical limits to what our bodies can endure, even with high-tech, high intensity training. It's just the scale of the physical forces. And I think we're getting pretty close on a hucking scale. I do think we have room to improve fluidity in transitions between hucking and techy shit.
-What about talking to people (who aren't involved in the sport at all), what is their reaction to your being a 'skier'?
1st reaction is always an "oh". Then they always ask "Are you good?". And I usually say, "I only ski 30 or so days a year so I kinda gape compared to the local rippers". The usual resonse is, "30 days! Holy shit! By the way, what is "gaping" and who are "rippers"?"
-Do you think our sport is capable of ever being more mainstrem as surfing has become? Or is the sport just too expensive and inaccessible for most people to afford?
No. The skaters can show off a cool trick in a cafeteria or on any handrail. We have to drag people all the way up to the mountains. And yes, our "cool tricks" are way cooler than theirs, but a non-skier can't tell the difference between something truly amazing and someone simply fucking around.
Also,
-What kind of role do girls in the sport now have?
They're awesome. FKNA. I love girls who ski. I've almost made a policy not to date any girl who doens't ski. It's pretty self selecting too, on two fronts: a) if they don't ski, they can't take me constantly talking about it in 100 degree, 98% humidity in july b) skier girls are so much cooler than other girls and thus I am more interested in them. BTW, racoon eye tans are hot. Good indicator ;).
In a more serious note, I don't see why girls can't be part of the sport in the same way guys are. It's not like guys won't buy gloves if the ad in the magazine shows a girl hucking a cliff wearing the gloves rather than a guy. It's just irrelevant b/c of matters of distance, clothing, etc. Because at this point guys are doing the more extremo shit, they are holding most of the spancerships.
However, this ignores the whole realm that you can put a picture of a pretty skier girl in an ad and sell whatever, whereas you can't really put a portrait of a random ripper dude in an ad and expect to attract attention of any sort.
Enough. It's 4:00 am. I'm out. More (maybe) to come if I come up with anything coherent.
Gotta call you out on this one Phunk. I've been in the thick of it for 8 years now, watching from the front row how the progression of skiing with it's popularity growth has been growing on the back of shameless land developement that has forever changed landscapes and ecosystems - large and small. Not to mention the taxation on the land that the massive snowmaking systems are inflicting.Quote:
Originally posted by phUnk
I dig the avatar, but I think you're off-base if you're blaming problems like irresponsible land development, overcrowded population centers (or insufficient infrastructure) near ski areas and insufficient snowfall all on skiing's "popularity."
I know where you're coming from and I know you understand the whole picture of how the consuming public "demands" lead to a circle of expansion and growth in equiptment, resort sizes, access, road expansion, villages, condos, ect which have all flurished over the past 5-10 years to our benefit or detriment.
If we are skiers then we are part of the "popularity" and participate as benefactors of both the positive and negative elements that drive the growth. We can't just pick and choose which elements of the growth of skiing that we'll call our own and which elements we'll dis-own.
If we see negative aspects that we do not want as part of the growth then we should be more active in shunning those things and taking our dollar somewhere else that's inline with where we'd like to see skiing go. (i.e. Silverton, Black Diamond, Patagonia, and other companies that operate with purposes that stand along side that of making money rather than in the shadow of it)
[inhale]
I think increased popularity of our sport is possible without contributing to those negative aspects listed by Egon. Meaning, our numbers could increase and those negative aspects don't need to continue/get-worse to "support" those increased numbers.
Possible, yes. Likely or easy? No.
I suck at the debating.
I think it's cool. Do we want skiing to become mainstream?
Women have boobs. Men do not. Both ski.
I prefer retro grouch BusterQuote:
Originally posted by Buster Highmen
Or a(n aging) snowboarder?
Care to join Curmudgeons Without Boarders?
seriously though skiing/boarding is about personal experience not industry growth. I cringe every time I read/hear someone complaining about "flat sales ". I know we were all weaned on the milky teet of capitalism but does this have to bleed into every activity ? Is there no room for areas of our lives where we can't relax a little and not worry about increasing consumer awareness, technological innovation, increasing market share ... Ok enough from me I don't want this to turn into more of a diatribe than it already is. It should be pretty obvious my opinion is skewed in that I'm a long haired turn hiking hippie who has long ranted about my loathing of ski areas ( even though I'm still buying passes ). I also understand that there of plenty of people here who's incomes are directly derived form skiing so I can appreciate their need for a healthy industry. All that being said a bright future for me does not need to include more skiers bigger ski areas and higher tech equipment. I would be happy to be left alone in my stagnant world of uncrowded and untracked pow !
Board, all the gear you ride in is the result of industry growth.
Iceman and I want to know if you're going to whittle your next snowboard out of maple, or alder?
all you need is a caffeteria tray, some old sneakers, and some super glue. no problem.
Quote:
In comparison to surfing?....Definately too expensive. You want to surf? buy a board for $350 and you're made.
I think that unless you live on a coast-you have to leave surfing out of the inexpensive mixQuote:
Skiing (and snowboarding) is expensive, and IMO that's the biggest thing holding it back, especially compared to surfing/skating/bmx/basketball/etc.
I was born an "ashman" and I will die and "ashman " ! Maple ? what are you Canadian ? If so that would explain allotQuote:
Originally posted by phUnk
Board, all the gear you ride in is the result of industry growth.
Iceman and I want to know if you're going to whittle your next snowboard out of maple, or alder?
;)
I think skiing will still evolve.....
but it may only happen on a personal level.....
For instance: I ski all winter long up north in Michigan but usually just do the drinking while skiing thing because our hills suck ass here.......this past winter I went to Idaho and Jackson hole to ski and fell in love with the sport all over again....and on a more serious level.....I have found myself becoming more and more interested in all aspects of the sport and wanting to learn more....
I've been skiing for nineteen years but really only began to appreciate it as much as I do this past season....
As far as girls in the sport are concerned I'll take the horny male approach and say that girls make a good thing better......most of these chicks rip harder than me (if one can say that I rip at all)
MD ~ There's a dozen or so of us in this general area..Quote:
Originally posted by jayfrizzo
EP -- Where in the Midatlantic are you?
wow, only 12 people in the state of Maryland?Quote:
Originally posted by EPSkis
MD ~ There's a dozen or so of us in this general area..
must be creepy in the cities when they are so empty.
Sometimes it's cool, though. Like I just went to the liquor store and there was no one there to pay, so I just took everything and walked out.
nice. bet you got pretty loaded that night.
Watching the trailer for Soul Purpose made me think one thing: compared to the past several years our sport appears to have really stalled last season. The trailer should show the most progressive stuff in the video, but everything in that trailer could have appeared in any video of the past 3 years as nothing looked new. So, Yes, if that trailer is an indication of things to come then our sport has become stagnant.
But did you have to pay the lemonaid tax on the way there and back??Quote:
Originally posted by iceman
Sometimes it's cool, though. Like I just went to the liquor store and there was no one there to pay, so I just took everything and walked out.
Yeah. Thank god for the internet or I'd be really lonely.Quote:
Originally posted by basom
nice. bet you got pretty loaded that night.
Ain't that a bitch? Only a dozen people in the whole damn state and three of them are always trying to sell me crappy lemonade.Quote:
Originally posted by VTskibum
But did you have to pay the lemonaid tax on the way there and back??
Quote:
Originally posted by BlurredElevens
First of all, let me make it clear that I'm not singling you out, but that's just a jongish thing to say.
I, personally, will ski anything, steeps don't scare me. Hucking 40-50 feet in a competition to hardpack does. Hucking is part of skiing, Women that you speak of just haven't reached that level yet. Hucking is MUCH more difficult than just skiing a tech line. If you wanted to, you could huck that whole tech line. Hucking is part of skiing, and is above and beyond skiing tech lines.
Sorry to say, but women are only skiing at their level, don't confuse that with your misconception of "women keeping skiing in its purest form".
No offense taken and I am not replying to this out of defense for my stance....I just want to take an opportunity to clarify my point about guys and girls in big mountain comps.
Incorporating a huge cliff into a line and actually landing it is a definate indicator of how well you ski. But I know alot of guys who aren't necessarily the best skiers entering comps, throwing huge airs and by some off chance sticking it. To me that isn't skiing. I am in agreement with you.
On the other hand, the girls that I compete against select hucks that they can incorporate into their skiing to up their line score. What I was saying is that I think that men have implicitly been encouraged to increase the hairball factor in their lines via huge drops and the effect that this is having is that the higher line scores are going to guys who are dropping huge but who maybe aren't the best skiers all around. It's called Big MOUNTAIN, not Big AIR for a reason.
Because of this, yes Blurred Elevens, I still beleive that women are keeping big mountain skiing in it's purest form. You wouldn't huck something you couldn't land if you were out in BC, so why is there such a need to do it in competition? That isn't skiing, it's a sausage fest at that point.