PARK CITY (and all) SKI PATROLLERS DESERVE MORE.

^^^^ hahaha amazing!

tentative agreement

https://www.kpcw.org/ski-resorts/202...tive-agreement

[ATTACH]5[emoji[emoji642]4[emoji642]][emoji[emoji642]45]55[emoji[emoji642]4[emoji642]][/ATTACH]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/park-city...063403372.html

another report of tentative agreement.

Hope no one shorted MTN

The only people that are pissed are the holiday crowds that got shafted. The typical epic skier doesn’t know and could care less.

While I am glad that it is over, I can't help but wonder how the strike will affect tourism in P.C. and UT over the next 5 years. Will the strike be "here today and gone tomorrow", or does the skiing public have the "memory of an elephant"? I wouldn't mind if this redefines skiing in P.C. for the next few years.

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Originally Posted by Core Shot

The only people that are pissed are the holiday crowds that got shafted.

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uhhh, and also every single PC local who had to deal with angry people in shops, restaurants, etc.

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Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIpscE8VWU8

I'm assuming this is national news and people still watch this? I have no idea if this will spin into a Cancel Park City type of think or if it is just a hot take to be replaced by something else.

I'm the Treasurer (elected official) of our $1mm budget local water and sewer district. We have four employees. For years, I've said that our most valuable asset is our employees and that we should position ourselves as a premium employer. I'd estimate 85% of the homeowners in the district are something other than people that work in the community.

It is interesting to hear them support higher wages generally but then start to push back when they have to pay the bill. But me being me...I phrase in terms of Starbucks per week, puffy coats in the closet or some other bougie metric and shame them into keeping their mouth shut. As said prior, their is a vocal minority that has no idea what the actual costs of living are (I ask then, they don't know what rent is, they don't know what health insurance costs), but even the illusion of coming close to their pocket books makes them rage. We start at $30 with benefits and go up from there. Lots of training and advancement. Employees stick around and have that feeling that their job provides.

So I wonder, within the fabric of the movers and shakers in PC, what the cocktail party chat is. Because this whole thing is propped up on sub living wages. And the service industry, real or imagined, loves to cry out not enough help, but doesn't pay up. So when we've got, hour plus long lines at the grocery and hour long commutes from in town to the ski area and so on, I have to wonder if it is sustainable and what the collective business owning class thinks about all of it. I do know that there is a lot of conversation locally on both sides of the paycheck about wages spurred by this strike. I've said forever that labor should have a sick out of something around here.

I do know that +/- 10year patrollers with avi control experience make about $30/hr. at Winter Park. They can work 4 or 5 (with overtime) days a week. The profile is either people that work there winter only as a break from their higher paying job, no kids dirty baggy types making in happen or second income family folks that highly value the benefits. I'll tell you, I'd hire any of them in a second. They tend to be really high quality, very hardworking, smart people.

So maybe put a study on your supply and demand model for labor pricing and see where it falls on its face in the USA. People love to lean on the highschool econ without an understanding of imperfect markets. So high fives to you if your made the life choices and have been fortunate enough to feel financially successful. But we as a society need the rank and file worker bees and right now they are not making it, ski patrollers and otherwise.

So think about what you want life to look at for these people. What are you willing to give up? How much more would you be willing to pay for your season pass? Because that's the calculus that will make a difference. We don't get to socially engineer some solution where we say Fuck Vail and Alterra and every other corporate and non corporate ski town business owner but yeah cheap passes and $100 house cleans and $18 hr. dishwashers and cheap Chinese Crap.

Its all of it.

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I've commented on this topic before and been called elitist. I'd easily pay double for my pass if the experience was of that caliber. In fact, I used to. The Squaw Valley season passes were $1400/yr back in the early 2000's if I recall correctly (someone surely has better recollection).

I don't think that's what they're after. They want all of the revenue from cheap passes for folks that use them a minimum number of times per year, but spend all of the money on rentals a d concessions when they vacation. A quality experience for people that ski 30-100/times per year isn't on their radar.

I suppose I'm part of the problem here. I've been successful enough in life that I can afford to work at the resort for pennies ($23/hr) as a coach. I don't complain about the wages at all because I consider them inconsequential. I am quite mindful that some of the folks I work with are actually trying to live on those wages.

Look, there are resort roles that don't require a lot of wage (bumping chairs, concessions, etc), but retaining patrollers seems wise. Give them an option to make it a career (albeit seasonal).

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Originally Posted by old goat

Henry Ford (racist SOB that he was) had it figured out. Pay his workers enough to buy his cars.

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Conversely, he built cars cheap enough that his employees could buy them.

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Originally Posted by summit

Which is why VR won't incentivize it by caving to wild demands like the (unasked in the real world but proposed in this thread) $30/hr. They aren't even caving to reasonable demands they should have granted before this labor dispute that would have avoided this labor dispute... then because of greed, and now because they don't want to incentivize unionization.

That said, Unions are NOT all roses and unicorn glitter. I was in one. Had some upsides, but plenty of downsides. The seniority structure for vacation weeks was brutal, but not as brutal watching the union put the exact same effort into defending good employees unfairly in trouble as they put in into defending absolutely shitty coworkers who legitimately fucked up so that you were still stuck with them and carrying all the workload they didn't. Shit workers most definitely were protected. Unions were political and it was also shitty watching your money go to pay a union steward to 90% of the time sit on his fat ass in a top floor office making more money than you to watch movies and wait around just in case maybe a member needed something.

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My family's business built those fucking offices. As a non union guy I found it disgusting, but I understand the role of the unions.

Conveniently, the union comes to an agreement the day they have to start $300 weekly checks to the striking patrollers. Will be interesting to see what the settlement is.

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Originally Posted by summit

Which is why VR won't incentivize it by caving to wild demands like the (unasked in the real world but proposed in this thread) $30/hr.

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Settle down a little there. I didn’t propose $30 /hr, I said it was justified. You seem to be getting a little worked up in your views on this topic.

Park city has always sucked, even worse with limited terrain. They don’t get shit for snow. I think it’s hilarious that it took a patrol strike for people to realize this. Go back to Colorado you’ll be happier


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

You raised the point. I discussed it. Worked up? Hardly. I don't have a dog in this fight other than seeing folks I know get hosed by Vail, knowing that Vail Resorts leadership fucked the pooch and I hope the patrollers get a win. But I am up for critically discussing some of the rather wild declarations around this. :)

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Originally Posted by frorider

As a half (assed) Swiss I’ve been familiar with the German model my whole life & I wish we had something less simplistic than the ‘us vs them’ mentality I see in labor relations here. In Germany companies with over 2000 employees have labor elected officials serving on the company board. How much reduction in stock dividends is appropriate to enable appropriate Vail wages for new & experienced employees?—that’s a great topic for a Board with skin in all aspects of the game.

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It's almost as if *other* countries have figured some of this shit out and could be used as a model for things here in the U.S.

But, of course, that's all Communism, so will be a non-starter for a whole shitload of brainwashed people here.

https://i.imgflip.com/7uw5yj.png?a482136

https://www.shutterstock.com/image-p...05122.jpg[

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Originally Posted by gtid

Park city has always sucked

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I mean - it didn't get the nickname "Park Shitty" for no reason. :D

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Originally Posted by summit

You raised the point. I discussed it. Worked up? Hardly. I don't have a dog in this fight other than seeing folks I know get hosed by Vail, knowing that Vail Resorts leadership fucked the pooch and I hope the patrollers get a win.

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I mean - I don't *directly* have a dog in this fight, as I'm not in a union nor have I ever been in one. But I think we *all* have a dog (indirectly) in the issue of seeing wealth inequality addressed in this country.

And I think unions have been pretty key in a lot of 1st world countries in at least making the inequality a little less... stark, shall we say?

I was in a union for 5 years. Good old Teamsters. There is good and bad just like everyone says, it was super fun breaking peoples knees for instance. My current job isn't union but is still a good job because of the locals around the country that keep my company on its toes. They treat us well to keep us from having the desire to organize.

I'm waiting to hear the details of this agreement. Happy the parties could come to agreement. It also relieves some stress on me, since we have a mini trip planned to PC, and we are not monied enough to be able to afford to blow off non refundable hotel reservations and flights, or change our dates on a whim.

Macro America seems to be a shithole without a compass, micro America seems to be much more sane. Focus on the micro.

https://www.deseret.com/utah/2025/01...-vail-resorts/


https://www.sltrib.com/news/environm...-mountain-ski/

wage increase.
longevity pay scale.

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Originally Posted by uglymoney

I was in a union for 5 years. Good old Teamsters. There is good and bad just like everyone says, it was super fun breaking peoples knees for instance.

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lol

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Originally Posted by skiJ

https://www.deseret.com/utah/2025/01...-vail-resorts/


https://www.sltrib.com/news/environm...-mountain-ski/

wage increase.
longevity pay scale.

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I really question just how long Vail had this offer on the table. I suspect it was there for a while despite what the union claimed (or at least very close to it). The real cost was in the health care benefits, which the union folded on the second they had to start paying the striking patrollers and was clearly what Vail was fighting against.

Good on the patrol though for getting both entry level and long term employee wages bumped. Seems like the right number balancing the training and skillsets necessary and the inherent surplus of qualified applicants. The last round of negotiations didn't really help the established members so it is good to see both get their due.

bless your heart

Keystone Patrollers have entered the chat.

https://www.9news.com/article/money/...0-a8bf4dc6fb2a

Class action lawsuit by pissed off guests has started

https://www.kpcw.org/ski-resorts/202...rk-city-strike

They are not super far in the process. Much discontent. I am very hopefuly the resolution in PC will give the framework needed.