Togwotee Pass fatality

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Originally Posted by whipski

Better view of the scene. I thought I was looking at a kicker above the fracture, now not so sure.
https://www.jhavalanche.org/eventMap.php

not sure why it didn't link but click on event detail. they also list the cause of death as trauma

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The kicker is definitely above the fracture, it is above the very first set of trees, just to lookers right of center in the second pic. Looks like there is another kicker towards the left side of the frame, about the same elevation.

This post here:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CLdYCV2H...d=kvshb69pt68q
makes it sound like this is a close to the road, common place to build jumps.

I do think the distinction between ignorance or not is important. Ignorance is actionable. We can make an effort to reach ignorant individuals. How best to do that is very much a topic open for debate. Being involved with an avalanche awareness organization, I think about this A LOT and I certainly don't have all the answers, and maybe none at all.

If not ignorant, getting caught in an avalanche requires making the choice to travel in avalanche terrain, and so all fatal avalanches imply a bad decision, as Danno said. I mention that because it came up here, but I'm generally a lot more interested in what caused someone to make a bad decision, not the fact that they made one. That's actionable material that I can use to improve my decision making and help pass to others.

I don't think there's a big flippy spinny backcountry booter crowd here, but if this was in fact a commonly used jump spot, a short steep slope that's usually fine, traveled on a lot, and people don't really think too much about? That can absolutely apply to other backcountry travel! Are there places you go that have short, steep slopes close to the parking lot/road that you or others generally don't think too much about? There sure are most places I go. Little roadcuts, maybe a creek bank, or just that little pitch right above the lot that "never slides." If it's steep enough to slide, someday it will.

Being able to take something constructive from an accident doesn't require you to be capable of making the exact mistake, on the exact slope, on the exact day as the victim. Or to learn something new that you didn't know. You can look at this accident and instead of saying "they were stupid and I never would have done that" you can say "I wouldn't have been in that exact situation but I need to remember to continue being extremely vigilant of small, steep, consequential terrain even if it's in a commonly used area or close to the car." At least for me, I think that's a lot more constructive to keeping me and my friends safe in the backcountry.

My apologies for coming across poorly, I’m just really tired of hearing about these accidents and all we can offer is vibes.

All of these high profile accidents this season seem like easily avoidable tragedies. I know, hindsight. The thing is, everything in these accidents was pointing to back off.

I’m done.


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Fair enough. I think we are all beyond sick of this death toll.

3 phone calls from my sister in the past 10 days to check if I was being safe.

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Originally Posted by Bunion 2020

Fair enough. I think we are all beyond sick of this death toll.

3 phone calls from my sister in the past 10 days to check if I was being safe.

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28 and counting, with the ID one grrr just posted. Brutal.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/weath...yearly-deaths/

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Originally Posted by adrenalated

.... Are there places you go that have short, steep slopes close to the parking lot/road that you or others generally don't think too much about? There sure are most places I go. Little roadcuts, maybe a creek bank, or just that little pitch right above the lot that "never slides." If it's steep enough to slide, someday it will....

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its possible we develop tunnel-vision when evaluating avy terrain
focusing on big slopes with big consequences
and ignoring micro-terrain that appears harmless

its also possible we are inadvertently conditioned to think this way
just a though ....

vibes to family, friends and community

.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bunion 2020

Fair enough. I think we are all beyond sick of this death toll.

3 phone calls from my sister in the past 10 days to check if I was being safe.

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Similar. My dad has never called me to ask me to stay out of the backcountry and he did last week.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by adrenalated

This post here:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CLdYCV2H...d=kvshb69pt68q
makes it sound like this is a close to the road, common place to build jumps.

I do think the distinction between ignorance or not is important. Ignorance is actionable. We can make an effort to reach ignorant individuals. How best to do that is very much a topic open for debate. Being involved with an avalanche awareness organization, I think about this A LOT and I certainly don't have all the answers, and maybe none at all.

If not ignorant, getting caught in an avalanche requires making the choice to travel in avalanche terrain, and so all fatal avalanches imply a bad decision, as Danno said. I mention that because it came up here, but I'm generally a lot more interested in what caused someone to make a bad decision, not the fact that they made one. That's actionable material that I can use to improve my decision making and help pass to others.

I don't think there's a big flippy spinny backcountry booter crowd here, but if this was in fact a commonly used jump spot, a short steep slope that's usually fine, traveled on a lot, and people don't really think too much about? That can absolutely apply to other backcountry travel! Are there places you go that have short, steep slopes close to the parking lot/road that you or others generally don't think too much about? There sure are most places I go. Little roadcuts, maybe a creek bank, or just that little pitch right above the lot that "never slides." If it's steep enough to slide, someday it will.

Being able to take something constructive from an accident doesn't require you to be capable of making the exact mistake, on the exact slope, on the exact day as the victim. Or to learn something new that you didn't know. You can look at this accident and instead of saying "they were stupid and I never would have done that" you can say "I wouldn't have been in that exact situation but I need to remember to continue being extremely vigilant of small, steep, consequential terrain even if it's in a commonly used area or close to the car." At least for me, I think that's a lot more constructive to keeping me and my friends safe in the backcountry.

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Nicely said, @adrenalated. Trying to extend empathy past the empathy gap. I had a random xc dude at the post office say the same thing as Bunion's sister. Astonishing.

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Originally Posted by simple

Similar. My dad has never called me to ask me to stay out of the backcountry and he did last week.

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Shades of Tunnel Creek, exactly 9 years ago today (in that a lot of people, myself included, got calls from people who don't necessarily ski bc, but were worried because of the national news part of it). I miss Jim Jack a lot :(

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Originally Posted by goldenboy

Shades of Tunnel Creek, exactly 9 years ago today (in that a lot of people, myself included, got calls from people who don't necessarily ski bc, but were worried because of the national news part of it). I miss Jim Jack a lot :(

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Just home from a day on the hill with a lot of people remembering their friends.

I remember the last time I saw Jim Jack alive.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn

Just home from a day on the hill with a lot of people remembering their friends.

I remember the last time I saw Jim Jack alive.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

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That one has still gotta hurt.

BTW you mentioned being mentored by a crusty old fuck.

BW?

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Originally Posted by Bunion 2020

That one has still gotta hurt.

BTW you mentioned being mentored by a crusty old fuck.

BW?

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Former Stevens Pass patrol director RM


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A little more info about the slide and the deceased. RIP.
https://jhsnowboarder.com/2021/02/18...mike-mckelvey/