U.S. moves to terminate leases on public lands.

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Originally Posted by Trackhead

And….beyond skiers, the biggest proponents of public lands are MAGA hunters/anglers if we follow stereotypes.

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Hopefully those hunters like hiking over trees. The non reactionary, and not speculative consequence of this is that pretty much all public and private trail crews are done. FS trail crews have been laid off. Private trail crews are largely funded through federal dollars (GAOA, etc.). That's done, so those crews aren't getting hired this year. So trails aren't getting cleared or otherwise maintained this year, and quite a few people that I personally know are out of a job.

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Toast, I agree with your sentiment 100%. We live in Montana or the west because there is public land available for use. The alternate is Texas, a privately owned shithole essentially.

That said, these concepts of selling US public assets appears to be decades old.
https://www.hcn.org/issues/issue-299...anger-station/

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Originally Posted by Trackhead

Toast, I agree with your sentiment 100%. We live in Montana or the west because there is public land available for use. The alternate is Texas, a privately owned shithole essentially.

That said, these concepts of selling US public assets appears to be decades old.
https://www.hcn.org/issues/issue-299...anger-station/

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Definitely. I have no issue with the general concept of selling US public assets from time to time. I'm extremely skeptical that the selling of public lands under this executive order will be measured or based on a reasonable cost benefit analysis. But we'll see.

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Well, the Whitehouse just deleted the webpage with the executive order, so maybe they realized that it'd be a terrible idea.

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Originally Posted by toast2266

Well, the Whitehouse just deleted the webpage with the executive order, so maybe they realized that it'd be a terrible idea. Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk

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JHFC. Its quite literally like the whole show is a giant circus run by morans.

Nice job, America. :mad:

only the best morans. only the best.

How many EO’s were signed yesterday? None from yesterday are showing up on the site.


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I think that’s because one EO decreed that moving forward EO’s will be secret and stuff. Here’s a link to that EO:

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Originally Posted by toast2266

Well, the Whitehouse just deleted the webpage with the executive order, so maybe they realized that it'd be a terrible idea.

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It's still visible for me....unfortunately.

Maybe they use executive orders like Tweets now. Post, then rapidly say ooops, and delete.

That said, speculation is pointless. Probably more effective to drive to your local forest service district and talk to a human, in person, before they get fired from DOGE. Any respectable forest service office has people you can talk to, in person, or arrange for an appointment to do so.

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Originally Posted by Trackhead

Any respectable forest service office has people you can talk to, in person, or arrange for an appointment to do so.

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Please make an appointment to see Steve. The soonest he has a slot to meet with you will be in October, 2027. Assuming Steve isnt fired by then.

Steve will be gone in a week.

In reality though, I've walked into FS offices a few times and asked questions about permitting, etc. It's seriously a productive way to figure shit out.

I can tell you from recent experiences that contacting the USFS or even SS is hit or miss at best right now

Local Forest Service has no idea what's going to happen. Everything is up in the air, and the decisions are being made in an opaque manner that does not involve the local field offices at all.



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Originally Posted by John_B

It's still visible for me....unfortunately.

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Huh, weird. It was gone (404 page in it's place). Now it's back.

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I can drive two minutes to a FS office and walk in the door to see a human, could do the same likely in Gallatin County.

Social Security is a different beast.

Certainly more effective than postulating on TGR.

Sure thing buddy. I was just discussing this very thing with a district ranger in a nearby but unnamed National Forest. They have no idea A. if they will have a job in 6 months B. what any of this will mean for public lands.

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Originally Posted by Trackhead

I can drive two minutes to a FS office and walk in the door to see a human, could do the same likely in Gallatin County.

Social Security is a different beast.

Certainly more effective than postulating on TGR.

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I'm not posting postulations. I work closely with my local non profit bike organization. A lot of that organization's funding comes from federal grants. We work closely with the forest service on many, many projects. Our E.D. talks to forest service personnel several times a week. We're all on a first name basis with most of the local forest service employees that handle recreation and public access.

Things are fucked, and they're rapidly getting worse. People are losing their jobs, and popular programs that support public recreation on public lands are getting shut down or severely cut back.

Recreation in Montana is a $3.4 billion industry that employs 30,000 people. The government's moves to kneecap federal land managers and non-profits is going to lose far more money in this state than they're ever going to save at a federal level.

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Originally Posted by toast2266

I'm not posting postulations. I work closely with my local non profit bike organization. A lot of that organization's funding comes from federal grants. We work closely with the forest service on many, many projects. Our E.D. talks to forest service personnel several times a week. We're all on a first name basis with most of the local forest service employees that handle recreation and public access.

Things are fucked, and they're rapidly getting worse. People are losing their jobs, and popular programs that support public recreation on public lands are getting shut down or severely cut back.

Recreation in Montana is a $3.4 billion industry that employs 30,000 people. The government's moves to kneecap federal land managers and non-profits is going to lose far more money in this state than they're ever going to save at a federal level.

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I hear are zero GIS employees left in the local region

Good luck actually managing the forests if you can't tell where anything is.

Toast, not arguing the concern at all.

Just saying maybe others (not you who is connected) need to show up at their local office and:

A - voice concern
B - find out if anyone knows what might actually happen

TGR can raise the alarm, cause awareness, outside of that has minimal benefit.

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Originally Posted by Trackhead

Toast, not arguing the concern at all.

Just saying maybe others (not you who is connected) need to show up at their local office and:

A - voice concern
B - find out if anyone knows what might actually happen

TGR can raise the alarm, cause awareness, outside of that has minimal benefit.

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I think it is well beyond the local office at this point. Those who are left are well aware and VERY full of concern...but nobody is listening to them.

The elected officials *can* do something if they wanted to. But they won't if they don't hear from enough of their constituents (even though all you will get back from them is a form letter praising DOGE...they are tallying the comments they receive and will act out of self preservation if they feel the tide is turning).

Doesn't matter what side of the aisle they sit on. Tell the Ds "this is one of the important issues where you need to draw the line and take a stand", tell the Rs "this is one you need to push back on, take back control from the executive branch for a minute and protect your back yard"

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Originally Posted by Trackhead

Toast, not arguing the concern at all.

Just saying maybe others (not you who is connected) need to show up at their local office and:

A - voice concern
B - find out if anyone knows what might actually happen

TGR can raise the alarm, cause awareness, outside of that has minimal benefit.

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I don't mean this negatively but the local folks have no clue what is going on. I work for a non fed govt agency that deals closely with various ologists from the FS on a weekly basis. I ran into a forest level ologist who is crucial to the work we do yesterday and he asked if we have any open positions. He has worked permanently in the area for >15 years and is now not sure if his position will exist.

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Originally Posted by toast2266

FS trail crews have been laid off. Private trail crews are largely funded through federal dollars (GAOA, etc.). That's done, so those crews aren't getting hired this year. So trails aren't getting cleared or otherwise maintained this year

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This is going to have a big impact on mountain bikers this year. We are going to have to clear all deadfall ourselves and sure I can see that happening in a lot of places, but it won't be anything like a full-time staff of pros getting shit done. I don't forsee the majority of lightly travelled trails getting cleared.

I mainly ride Park City and deadfall and trimming is taken care by a non-profit, thankfully.

The forest service budget for 2025 put in place in 2024 was a HALF BILLION less than needed or requested.

Apparently supplemental FS funding from through Inflation Reduction Act and Infrastructure Investment Act has also run out in 2024.

The forest service cuts have been coming for a while. And while it sucks, what the hell can we do about it in a government that has been overspending for the past 40+ years with trillions in debt? Pay to play in the forest, like Millcreek and American Fork canyons in Utah, charging for season passes? There's no money, where's it going to come from? Who's going to pay for it?

Tax the fuck out of the rich, that's where.

O wait no, extend tax cuts for the rich. Copy.