Is it World War III

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Originally Posted by ninjabirdman

tj - is there something pnwbrit said that specifically offended you, or are you considering all maggots arguing against Israel's actions over the past few days anti-semetic?

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Thankyou

TJ if you can quote me something that I've said that was clearly anti-semitic rather than commenting on the actions of the Nation of Isareal I will apologise to you without reservation.

We obviously have completely opposite views on this argument but your remarks to me are at least as offensive as that which you claim I've made.

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Originally Posted by Rontele

I strongly agree with this opinion. Anti-semitism is the last thing I would expect from maggotdom.

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Rontele, I think you and a few others are making too much of a black and white distinction. Someone who does not fully support Israel is not nessecarily anti-semitic, anti-Israel, pro-terrorism, etc. There are many shades of gray.

The point is that while the Palestinian extremists have certainly commited more horrific acts with greater frequency, the Israelis have commited injustices too. I'm not saying you or anyone else on this board are necessarily overlooking that point, but I think a lot of people in the feverent pro-Israel camp do. I think there's a deep hatred on both sides, in some ways deserved, and in other ways not.

Crossing the Green Line is an interesting book written by an outsider who lived within the Israeli controlled West Bank for several years. It basically examines the social and economic problems faced by Palestinians there. I didn't agree with many of the author's conclusions, but it was still an interesting read.

I don't know what posts you, TJ, and others were refering to, but I greatly apologize if my previous post in this thread was seen as offensive or anti-semitic in any way, because it certainly was not intended to be.

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Originally Posted by PlayHarder

WTF does being a Canuck have to do with being anti-Isreal?

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In my experiences and in the time I have spent in Canada, I have found Canadians to be FAR more sympathetic to the plight of the Palestinian people and anti-Israeli than what I have experienced stateside.

Broad generalizations are obviously not correct, but most people on the far far left (which I think Canada has more of) tend to side with the Palestinians rather than the Israelis.

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Originally Posted by 13

Dexter, I'm really confused by you ...

Here's why -- on one hand, you've staunchly opposed the war in Iraq from the get-go. On the other hand, you seem to be defending Israel's response to the kidnapping of a few soldiers.

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YOu just dont get it, do you. It is not just about the kidnapping and cross border raides. It is the fact that no matter what Israel does to placate the international community (in this case unilaterally withdrawing from Lebanon with the hope that Syria, Iran and the Lebanese govt would control Hezbullah) they still attack Israel Proper. Why is this?
The kidnapping is part of a larger picture that Israel can not ignore. They needed to respond and respond in force, otherwise their lack of actions would be interpreted as weakness.
One could argue their withdrawl from Lebanon was interpreted as a sign of weakness and the Palestinians took adavantage of it and started the second intifada.

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Originally Posted by Dexter Rutecki

Hezbollah has been waging war for years on northern Israel, but Israel showed its usual restraint until the most recent incident. How would you feel if the US military allowed kidnappings and attacks on its own soldiers to go unanswered?

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The Hezbollah was actually formed when Israel went across the border to squeeze the PLO out, who was using the border to attack. As you would say Dex, "stop lying". :rolleyes:

Does this comment make me an anti-semite? ;)

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Originally Posted by PNWbrit

Thankyou

TJ if you can quote me something that I've said that was clearly anti-semitic rather than commenting on the actions of the Nation of Isareal I will apologise to you without reservation.

We obviously have completely opposite views on this argument but your remarks to me are at least as offensive as that which you claim I've made.

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All I have to do is read every post of yours in this thread. You obvious have a problem with Jews. Not just the country of Israel, but you have a problem with anybody that is Jewish IMHO.

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Originally Posted by BlurredElevens

The Hezbollah was actually formed when Israel went across the border to squeeze the PLO out, who was using the border to attack. As you would say Dex, "stop lying". :rolleyes:

Does this comment make me an anti-semite? ;)

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Hitler Youth.

This just in: Palestinians are Semites too. So are the Lebanese.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semite

BTW - Blacks, Asians, and Whites hating each other for their physical attributes is racism. Judaism is a Religion, ergo outside the physical difference discussion. The whole curly hair/big nose thing used to be called "Roman."

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Originally Posted by TJ.Brk

All I have to do is read every post of yours in this thread. You obvious have a problem with Jews. Not just the country of Israel, but you have a problem with anybody that is Jewish IMHO.

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I assure you that you are quite wrong.

Again I'd invite you quote just one single clearly anti-semitic rather than anti israeli statement I have made.

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Originally Posted by jwelch

I think there's a deep hatred on both sides, in some ways deserved, and in other ways not.

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A friend of mine has relatives in Israel who are hard-core extreme settlers. She visited them and the toast at the dinner table was, "To when every Paelstinian is below the ground!" or something like that.

Then she went to bed, listening to bottles and rocks thrown by Palestinian children, who wished her dead, hit the walls of the compound.

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Originally Posted by Rontele

In my experiences and in the time I have spent in Canada, I have found Canadians to be FAR more sympathetic to the plight of the Palestinian people and anti-Israeli than what I have experienced stateside.

Broad generalizations are obviously not correct, but most people on the far far left (which I think Canada has more of) tend to side with the Palestinians rather than the Israelis.

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Ron-
I live in Southern California. I've never lived in Canada. You are as wrong in my geography as my beliefs. Unfounded, Unfair, Unsupportable and just plain wrong accusations of racism are even less maggotly. The only support I've heard for those claims is Dexter, of all people, saying "if you aren't with Israel you are against it"

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Originally Posted by Rontele

In my experiences and in the time I have spent in Canada, I have found Canadians to be FAR more sympathetic to the plight of the Palestinian people and anti-Israeli than what I have experienced stateside.

Broad generalizations are obviously not correct, but most people on the far far left (which I think Canada has more of) tend to side with the Palestinians rather than the Israelis.

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Times have changed,
Our kids are getting worse
They won't obey their parents,
They just want to fart and curse. Should we blame the government, or blame society, or should we blame the images on tv No!
Blame Canada! Blame Canada

With all their beady little eyes,
their flapping heads so full of lies
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
We need to form a full assault, it's Canada's fault! Don't blame me, for my son Stan, He saw the darn cartoon, and now he's off to
join the klan!> And my boy eric once, had my picture on his shelf, but now when I see him, he tells me to fuck myself>

Well, Blame Canada!

It seems that everything's gone wrong since
Canada came along
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada! They're not even a real country anyway. My son could of been a doctor or a lawyer, it's a true, Instead he burned up like a piggie on a barbecue> Should we blame the matches? Should we blame the fire, or the doctor who allowed him to expire. Heck no!
Blame Canada!
Blame Canada!
With all their hockey hubaloo and that bitch Anne Murray too. Blame Canada!
Shame on Canada!

The smut we must stop
The trash we must smash
Laughter and fun
must all be undone
We must blame them and cause a fuss
Before somebody thinks of blaming us!

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Originally Posted by Rontele

In my experiences and in the time I have spent in Canada, I have found Canadians to be FAR more sympathetic to the plight of the Palestinian people and anti-Israeli than what I have experienced stateside.

Broad generalizations are obviously not correct, but most people on the far far left (which I think Canada has more of) tend to side with the Palestinians rather than the Israelis.

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Okay, makes sense. Our bias must be why we charged, convicted and kicked out of the country the last anti-semetic holocaust denier we had show up. Strange, too, that we're taught a pretty favourable view of Isreal in HS as well.
Sure, people are sympathetic to the Palestinians - not because we hate Jews and/or Isreal, but because a huge segment of their population has been getting the short end of the stick from both Isreal and their Arab "brothers".
Edit: Not to say we're not sympathetic to the plight of the average Isreali, as well.

I am bitterly opposed to any sentiment amounting to anti-canuckitism.

However, after spending the winter in Quebec, which has a large number of Arab immigrants, it was related to me numerous times in my conversations with Lebanese and Persian people I met, as to how much bigotry they have experienced from the Quebecois. But then, I'm not sure the Quebecois like anyone. So if you're Jewish, don't take it personally.

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Originally Posted by cj001f

The only support I've heard for those claims is Dexter, of all people, saying "if you aren't with Israel you are against it"

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Isn't it funny how he gets all butthurt about the US in Iraq, but fully supports Israel?

Saddam paid the families of Palestinian suicide bombers $25,000 a pop to attack Israelis. With this logic (which Dex doesn't possess) him being against the US in Iraq means he's against Israel, and therefor an anti-semite. :fm:

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Originally Posted by cj001f

Ron-
I live in Southern California. I've never lived in Canada. You are as wrong in my geography as my beliefs. Unfounded, Unfair, Unsupportable and just plain wrong accusations of racism are even less maggotly. The only support I've heard for those claims is Dexter, of all people, saying "if you aren't with Israel you are against it"

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This was all a ploy to get out where you are from! I thought you lived in Seattle or Vancouver.

I stand corrected and do disagree that I have never once stated that if you are not with israel you are against it...

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Originally Posted by PlayHarder

Okay, makes sense. Our bias must be why we charged, convicted and kicked out of the country the last anti-semetic holocaust denier we had show up. Strange, too, that we're taught a pretty favourable view of Isreal in HS as well.
Sure, people are sympathetic to the Palestinians - not because we hate Jews and/or Isreal, but because a huge segment of their population has been getting the short end of the stick from both Isreal and their Arab "brothers".
Edit: Not to say we're not sympathetic to the plight of the average Isreali, as well.

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Good point, thanks for clarifying.

Deep down, I feel the whole thing reeks of Iranian intelligence sowing discord and creating chaos. Call it a hunch, but I wouldn't put it past them.

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Originally Posted by Dexter Rutecki

I fully supported what the US did in Afghanistan to get rid of the Taliban, as i assume you did. So why would I support going after one set of terrorists but not another?
And to present this as a reaction exclusively to the most recent kidnapping (there have been four other attempts recently in the north) is inaccurate. Hezbollah has been waging war for years on northern Israel, but Israel showed its usual restraint until the most recent incident. How would you feel if the US military allowed kidnappings and attacks on its own soldiers to go unanswered?

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Word -- makes sense now.

One thing I do wish is that IDF forces hadn't targeted bridges, airports, etc. I feel like there has to be a better way to catch/cripple those responsible, just not the way it's been done thus far.

Whatever, both sides in the current crisis will reap what they sow.

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Originally Posted by splat

I'm am bitterly opposed to any sentiment amounting to anti-canuckitism.

However, after spending the winter in Quebec, which has a large number of Arab immigrants, it was related to me numerous times in my conversations with Lebanese and Persian people I met, as to how much bigotry they have experienced from the Quebecois. But then, I'm not sure the Quebecois like anyone. So if you're Jewish, don't take it personally.

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They don't like anybody. Hell when the Ryan's owned Tremblant they would not allow Jews, or Blacks to ski here. Infact in old man Ryan's OB shack just off of the Le Edge part of the mtn there is still a sign above the door that says "No Jew or Niggers". People actually smile and laugh as they have their picture taken with that sign. They may think it is funny or harmless, but I find it just deplorable.

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Originally Posted by 13

Deep down, I feel the whole thing reeks of Iranian intelligence sowing discord and creating chaos. Call it a hunch, but I wouldn't put it past them.



Word -- makes sense now.

One thing I do wish is that IDF forces hadn't targeted bridges, airports, etc. I feel like there has to be a better way to catch/cripple those responsible, just not the way it's been done thus far.

Whatever, both sides in the current crisis will reap what they sow.

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Well said. But they have to do something to slow down resupply from Iran. That is why they first bomb airports, roads, bridges. Cut supply lines. If you can stop their resupply then they run out of rockets/bullets to kill you and then they are more favorable about returning to the bargining table.

If they don't return to the bargining table since you knocked out supply lines your offensive has a better chance of succeeding. But Israel isn't on the offensive. They are strickly defensive and always have been.

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Originally Posted by KQ

No...I haven't seen that, but I've seen this and I like it (I think you might too ;) ):

http://www.youtube.com/watch.php?v=6WiV2fyvRbs

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Nice to have you back, girl. I likey.

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Originally Posted by BlurredElevens

So what solutions have we come up with?

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Let the Palestinians conclude their self imposed genocide with a bang. reduce Demascus and Tehran to rubble.

I'll stop there...

Dude, that'll so totally work!

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Originally Posted by splat

Nice to have you back, girl. I likey.

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Geez - 8K+ posts? Man...you've been busy since I've been gone.

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Originally Posted by mr_gyptian

Let the Palestinians conclude their self imposed genocide with a bang.

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Sabra and Shatila. Not so self-imposed.