To Vaccinate or Not---The Rat Flu Odyssey Continues

[Danno]

But the employee share of the premium varies based on those health and wellness credits... so employers can incentiize things that would drop the overall average utilization and thus premiums. Vaccine = health and wellness credit? That's easy.

For my incentive program, to get $20 off per month, I need to accumulate 240 "points" the previous fiscal year. Getting a flu vax is 80 points. So yes, pretty easy to do. Essentially, the flu vaccine is worth $80 to me.

[Benny Profane]

Felony abuse of statistics should be an actual crime.

Maybe, but, bottom line, there are a whole bunch more old people alive today than just fifty years ago.

[altasnob]

Props to WA for being one of the top vaccinated state in the US. Stay out of Idaho and Wyoming



https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...smid=url-share

[bennymac]

Maybe, but, bottom line, there are a whole bunch more old people alive today than just fifty years ago.

Brilliant.

[XXX-er]

Life expectancy in 1900 was 50, yes 50 years old. as of 2020, life expectancy is closer to 78. Modern medicine is keeping people alive longer.

Nature comes along with a virus and brings us back closer to the mean, but this angle gets no press. Lots of deaths due to covid can be contributed to people that modern medicine has artificially kept them living longer.

Goggle life expectancy by country, for a 1st world country America's stats are abysmal,

Cuba was often ahead of America in spite of being embargo'd by America for > 50 yrs

fire arms also help to keep the population down in a big way

If you check around a bit you will find young people with no preexisting conditions are getting sick and dying of covid

[summit]

Goggle life expectancy by country, for a 1st world country America's stats are abysmal,

Cuba was often ahead of America in spite of being embargo'd by America for > 50 yrs

fire arms also help to keep the population down in a big way

FFS what a bunch of bull.

US life expectancy is #6 for G20 because, in order,:
1. Our infant mortality rates are bad for G20
2. Our diet sucks ass
3. Preventative care is not free

Our infant mortality rates are primarily due to congenital malformation and low birth weight. These are the top 2 causes and are in sum the cause of more than all other causes combined. Not my specialty, but these stem from the cultural/legal abortion issues, lack of prenatal care, and maternal substance abuse.

Murder is not even in the top 10 causes of death, much less fire-arm specific.

[XXX-er]

yeah so leave out firearm deaths but even then did none of those people not really die, where did they get the stats from , fake news ?

[summit]

yeah so leave out firearm deaths but even then did none of those people not really die, where did they get the stats from , fake news ?

I'm not clear what you are asking? Say it again a different way?

[Benny Profane]

Cuba was often ahead of America in spite of being embargo'd by America for > 50 yrs

That is one of the best arguments for universal health care. Their health care system was so good, it was exported to other countries as a sort of natural resource by Castro in exchange for goods and alliances. I read that they tried to develop a vaccine, but couldn't because they are so starved of infrastructure. They probably don't have much of a Covid problem because Trump closed them back down again from a lot of travel.

[Benny Profane]

If you check around a bit you will find young people with no preexisting conditions are getting sick and dying of covid

Sure, but, how many? In relation to other victims? And, you say no "pre-existing conditions", but, what exactly do you mean by that? Maybe a product of poor personal health choices since an early age? Smoking? Obesity? Lack of exercise? Needless stress?

I'm pretty sure you can come back with the rare young athlete who actually died of Covid, let alone hospitalized in an ICU, but, dig deep for those stories.

[paulster2626]

I thought it was just making more babies survive that made life expectancy jump so much. As in, the main thing. People still got old way back in the day. Once you got past 20 or whatever it was smooth sailing. Source: saw this on a TV show once.

[Danno]

I thought it was just making more babies survive that made life expectancy jump so much. As in, the main thing. People still got old way back in the day. Once you got past 20 or whatever it was smooth sailing. Source: saw this on a TV show once.

That is my understanding as well. That the life expectancy for someone who was 20 -- to use your number -- back then isn't all that different from the life expectancy of a 20 year old today.

[bennymac]

obese diabetic pregnant moms leads to a lot of issues for the soon to be born kid - especially when combined with poor access to prenatal care

[dunfree]

I thought it was just making more babies survive that made life expectancy jump so much. As in, the main thing. People still got old way back in the day. Once you got past 20 or whatever it was smooth sailing. Source: saw this on a TV show once.

life expectancy at birth, at age 50 and at age 65 have all gone up.

Id expect some of that for adults is because of occupational health & workplace reform. Mesothelioma was a predictable killer, silicosis, lead, on and on.

[Benny Profane]

I thought it was just making more babies survive that made life expectancy jump so much. As in, the main thing. People still got old way back in the day. Once you got past 20 or whatever it was smooth sailing. Source: saw this on a TV show once.

If you made it into adulthood, you had to worry about diseases. Tuberculosis was America's biggest killer in the early mid 20th century. Now it's heart disease and cancer. Cancer is pretty much an old person's last attacker. Every one of us males will get prostate cancer if we live long enough.

[summit]

I thought it was just making more babies survive that made life expectancy jump so much. As in, the main thing. People still got old way back in the day. Once you got past 20 or whatever it was smooth sailing. Source: saw this on a TV show once.

Yes. Think of it this way.

The following have the same effect on AVERAGE Life Expectancy:
Saving ONE baby from infant mortality who then lives to age 80
Making SIXTEEN 75 year olds live 5 years longer each.

Obviously that is just for illustrative purposes.... but look at the disparity in life expectancy vs infant mortality rates.

2019 Life Expectancy:
US: 78.8y
Cuba: 78.8y
Japan: 85.0y
US has 93% the average life expectancy of Japan

2019 Infant Mortality per 1000 live births:
US: 5.8
Cuba: 3.8
Japan: 2.0
US: has 290% the infant mortality rate of Japan

Cuba has a lower infant mortality rate and the same life expectancy as USA thus if you survive infancy you'll likely live longer in the US than in Cuba.

Put another way, your life expectancy at age 60 (additional average years you'll live if you make it to 60):
USA: 23.1y
Cuba: 21.6y
Japan: 26.3y

But how long will you be be healthy on average if you make it to be 60 (HALE 60)?
USA: 16.4
Cuba: 16.3
Japan: 20.4
So that indicates that US and Cuba citizens have similar healthy average life expectancies (and Japan is longer) but the US has a longer life expectancy (similar to Japan) after you lose your health than Cuba.

You can read the definitions for these health metrics on WHO.

[The AD]

life expectancy at birth, at age 50 and at age 65 have all gone up.

Id expect some of that for adults is because of occupational health & workplace reform. Mesothelioma was a predictable killer, silicosis, lead, on and on.

Also things like heart attacks and cancer are not a virtual death sentence like they used to be.

[XXX-er]

well your assertion that my assertion is a load of bull and you got 3 bullet points why

did those people not die in America or did the cubans lie or what happened to make life expectancy in America so abysmal

or is it not really abysmal?

[XXX-er]

Sure, but, how many? In relation to other victims? And, you say no "pre-existing conditions", but, what exactly do you mean by that? Maybe a product of poor personal health choices since an early age? Smoking? Obesity? Lack of exercise? Needless stress?

I'm pretty sure you can come back with the rare young athlete who actually died of Covid, let alone hospitalized in an ICU, but, dig deep for those stories.

The averge age in India is 29 more than half the population is under 25 and they are dropping like flys, I think they will surpass the offcial Amercian death count and in fact have probably already have unofficialy beat America

[summit]

well your assertion that my assertion is a load of bull and you got 3 bullet points why

did those people not die in America or did the cubans lie or what happened to make life expectancy in America so abysmal

or is it not really abysmal?

I think you are responding to me...

I'm not clear on what your bullet points are? Did what people not die in America?

Please see my previous post on life expectancy comparison vs infant mortality comparing Cuba, Japan, and the US and maybe that will help clear things up?

[Benny Profane]

The averge age in India is 29 more than half the population is under 25 and they are dropping like flys, I think they will surpass the offcial Amercian death count and in fact have probably already have unofficialy beat America

Yeah, but, the pictures I see from India are of fat older people in oxygen masks. What are the statistics? Who is dying there?

[XXX-er]

Yeah, but, the pictures I see from India are of fat older people in oxygen masks. What are the statistics? Who is dying there?

its everybody, almost all of them brown people,

if you wana say its only old people you find the stats

[summit]

Do we trust Indian government stats? We know they are suppressing case numbers... perhaps the trends are accurate but not the totals?

Gotta be more trustworthy than made up PRC stats for the last year.

[XXX-er]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ife_expectancy

USA is 40th, Cuba is 46th but there have been years they were ahead

Canada limps in at 15th, used to be more like 11th before Fentynal

earlier on it read like you were making lame excuses as to why people died as if it didnt count

[XXX-er]

Do we trust Indian government stats? We know they are suppressing case numbers... perhaps the trends are accurate but not the totals?

Gotta be more trustworthy than made up PRC stats for the last year.

they figure somewhere between 3 and 10 times as many people have died in India from Covid

which is not actualy that bad percapita cuz there were 1.4 billion people