Once again, Snowbird isn't going to be open on Memorial Day...

**Endlessseason** · 05-17-2007, 12:39 PM

Yeah, I know. I sound like a spoiled little local. Most of the other resorts in the country have already closed and I'm complaining that the Bird is closing "early" again.

I'm sure it sounds petty to people outside the state but this really sucks.

I thought part of the Bird's marketing strategy was to differentiate themselves and showcase that their season runs from before Thanksgiving through Memorial Day. I know that's what I've seen them advertise on street billboards and the internet before.

They didn't make it to Memorial Day 2000. Nor did they in '01. They weren't open on Memorial weekend in '02 or '03. Same with 2004. Now '07 is added to the list. In fact, this will make 6 OUT OF THE LAST 8 YEARS that they will NOT be open on Memorial Day.

Yes, I'm venting but, what gives? Are they just giving up on the marketing cachet that came from that campaign?

**Rideski** · 05-17-2007, 01:07 PM

I have a problem with the resorts closing down due to the fact they aren't selling day tix, or the old stand by excuse that the deer need to migrate. What bs. They have a ton of snow, and I bought my season passes partly due to the fact I enjoy Spring corn and slush.

They do not seem to be factoring that into the economics. Just because they aren't selling day tix does not mean they are not making money. They made my money so that I could enjoy Spring.

**telepow** · 05-17-2007, 01:15 PM

Will you still get a pass to Snowbird next year?

**Rideski** · 05-17-2007, 01:37 PM

I will absolutely NOT be getting a snowbird pass next year.

**Trackhead** · 05-17-2007, 01:43 PM

I know your bummed, but it's hard to complain when the last 2/3 years were WAY above average snow totals.

04/05-700"
05/06-600"
06/07-360"

I quit skiing last week. I don't have the motivation to make June turns this year. Go with the flow I guess.

**zion zig zag** · 05-17-2007, 01:55 PM

Originally Posted by Trackhead

I quit skiing last week. I don't have the motivation to make June turns this year. Go with the flow I guess.

Same here, I guess you're OK that I didnt call then huh?

**Trackhead** · 05-17-2007, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by flykdog

Same here, I guess you're OK that I didnt call then huh?

Climbing now, and slogging dirt.

**phUnk** · 05-17-2007, 02:06 PM

Originally Posted by Trackhead

Climbing now

I just got some cams.

**Trackhead** · 05-17-2007, 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by phUnk

I just got some cams.

But do you have any NUTS?

**f2f** · 05-17-2007, 02:24 PM

i debated whether to put this gloomy picture in a separate thread. for now, here it is (the original is much larger and found here)

**Endlessseason** · 05-17-2007, 02:41 PM

F2F, it's not necessarily the snowpack that makes the bird decide whether to stay open or not. Although it has been a crappy snow year, we can't always blame the snowpack. In '02 and '03, for example, they closed early with tons of snow.

The head of patrol told me last weekend their worker shortage caused the earlier closing this year, not the snow. He said they just "didn't have the manpower to continue providing a good product in Mineral Basin."

I say the bird should have continued opening Mineral Basin at 8 AM, switching their crew over to LC as they shut MB down when it got sticky.

Had they just offered their employees a little bit more to hang around they would have been able to stay open until Memorial. It's apparently a problem that a little bit of money could fix. They just aren't committed to doing it.

**Plakespear** · 05-17-2007, 02:42 PM

It's the third week in may and you still have lift serviced skiing.

You have no right to complain.

**Endlessseason** · 05-17-2007, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by Plakespear

It's the third week in may and you still have lift serviced skiing.

You have no right to complain.

I knew going in that someone would say that. I know. I suck. But Plakester, it just ain't right.

**Endlessseason** · 05-17-2007, 02:46 PM

Originally Posted by telepow

Will you still get a pass to Snowbird next year?

Likely not. Seriously.

...but not just because of this.

**beaterdit** · 05-17-2007, 03:06 PM

Seriously, it's still some of the best skiing in NA with one of the longest seasons. Everywhere else around here's been closed for over a month.

Sure they could stay open based on current snow levels but what else is new, my old area, Wolf Creek in CO closed with over a hundred inch base this year. There's just no interest in skiing past April, even for most season pass holders.

Personally, if the lifts turn, I will ski there. If they don't, I may ski elsewhere, but I'm not even considering giving up my season over a couple weekends of operation.

Bad marketing on thier part? Absolutely, welcome the ski industry. Like it or not, baldfaced lying about everything from conditions to daily operations is the norm.

We've still got it better than most.

**snoboy** · 05-17-2007, 03:24 PM

CS · 05-17-2007, 03:32 PM

Originally Posted by phUnk

I just got some cams.

Oh boy.

When you are ready to really man up, let me know and I'll meet you in the Valley.

I need a new wall partner.

**erica_z** · 05-17-2007, 03:33 PM

Utards, come to Mammoth!

we don't have a whole lot open, but there are still 4 lifts and the upper gondi.

but it ain't gonna last much longer.

we'll make memorial day, but this sure ain't the mega-summer of last year. Last years 4th of July close was pretty spectacular.

**AltaPowderDaze** · 05-17-2007, 03:41 PM

Ok, i'll go ahead and call bullshit on most of this thread. mineral was closed partly because of lack of lifties but also because we didn't want to move bondary lines daily. We've done everything we can to try and stay open to memorial day at bonars request. the fact is that there is not enough snow to support the operation. you can thank turnin pete for some of that. he skis one bump run into the ground that allows more snow to melt due to the exposed ground and then moves somewhere else and does it again.

FOR THE RECORD:

We have more than enough people in all departments to operate Little Cloud. The only thing lacking is enough SNOW to safely open the mountain for memorial day weekend. it's a shame because we still have pleanty of patrol that want to work but these pesky seasons keep getting in the way.

FYI: Moderate South winds with a high of 68 tomorrow. that plus the second worst year of snowfall since records began make for a short season.

btw, who are you calling the head of patrol?

**Endlessseason** · 05-17-2007, 04:18 PM

Interesting, APD.
Since you're calling BS on "most" of the thread (in your words), I'd be curious to know which parts. A re-read of my post doesn't seem to have anything in direct contradiction with what you've said, other than what P.S. told me exactly (in quotations in the second paragraph).
He also asked me (facetiously) if I knew anyone who wanted to work. He stated that if they'd had enough of a crew they wouldn't have closed MB for the rest of the season right after the big dump. This was last Friday at noon. Unless things changed dramatically in the last 6 days I can only conclude he was yanking my chain, which I have no reason to suspect.
It's probably what happens with all large corporations; lots of rumors and stories and very few people who really know the real poop.

Here is what I posted:

...it's not necessarily the snowpack that makes the bird decide whether to stay open or not. Although it has been a crappy snow year, we can't always blame the snowpack. In '02 and '03, for example, they closed early with tons of snow.

The head of patrol told me last weekend their worker shortage caused the earlier closing this year, not the snow. He said they just "didn't have the manpower to continue providing a good product in Mineral Basin."

I say the bird should have continued opening Mineral Basin at 8 AM, switching their crew over to LC as they shut MB down when it got sticky.

Had they just offered their employees a little bit more to hang around they would have been able to stay open until Memorial. It's apparently a problem that a little bit of money could fix. They just aren't committed to doing it.

**ColdSmoke** · 05-17-2007, 04:39 PM

Originally Posted by AltaPowderDaze

mineral was closed partly because of lack of lifties but also because we didn't want to move bondary lines daily. We've done everything we can to try and stay open to memorial day at bonars request. the fact is that there is not enough snow to support the operation. you can thank turnin pete for some of that. he skis one bump run into the ground that allows more snow to melt due to the exposed ground and then moves somewhere else and does it again.

Let me get this straight. APD says its not that snowbird ran out of employees, it's that the employees just didn't want to move the ropes or tell one single skier that he might shorten the entire ski season for thousands of people.
I think I liked it better when I thought it was just a lack of employees.

4-TEEF · 05-17-2007, 05:09 PM

All this speculation is pretty funny...

Come up to Snowbird tomorrow and see for yourself how much snow is left. My bet is that you will be unhappily surprised by how fast the snow has been melting in 60F heat and blazing sunshine.

Or just stay home and bitch about how much it sucks to "only" be able to ski until May 20.

**AltaPowderDaze** · 05-17-2007, 10:08 PM

Originally Posted by ColdSmoke

Let me get this straight. APD says its not that snowbird ran out of employees, it's that the employees just didn't want to move the ropes or tell one single skier that he might shorten the entire ski season for thousands of people.
I think I liked it better when I thought it was just a lack of employees.

coldsmoke,
whether you like it or not, we have a responsibility to keep skiers safe to some degree. we could not maintain that degree of safety on the whole mountain with mineral open since it was going fast in a few key spots. we closed mineral first because the lift could not run, then beacuse of avalanche danger. we used the manpower elsewhere until late in the week following the storm and then it reopened.

the one single skier can not be remedied by ropes. he's skiing in little cloud and if you put up a rope it would have to be around the dock on hidden peak since everything would be closed.

endless,
mongo wouldn't have been yanking your chain and i suppose he though that to be the best answer to give public. i have not heard that answer from him or other supervisors in our morning meetings, in which we are informed of pertinent things.

think back to previous years and tell me when mineral basin closes in relation to little cloud. it's not often that the dates are less than 3 weeks of each other.

people are pissed because the only open resort in town can't sustain a skiing public in all areas of the mountain. you can actually ski mineral right now. you just have to work for it and know when to be off of it.

we have to the longest lift accessed season in utah to my knowledge and if you read a day ticket it will tell you that refunds aren't given due to weather amongst other things. well, we just don't have the weather to run year round for skiers. the higher ups really push to stay open as long as we can, since we are a 4-season resort and the between times are what loses money. and that is where i call BS.

if you can convince another resort to stay open longer than the bird then i'll be skiing there with you.

**TahoePowShredder** · 05-17-2007, 11:26 PM

Originally Posted by Endlessseason

Yeah,I thought part of the Bird's marketing strategy was to differentiate themselves and showcase that their season runs from before Thanksgiving through Memorial Day. I know that's what I've seen them advertise on street billboards and the internet before.

They didn't make it to Memorial Day 2000. Nor did they in '01. They weren't open on Memorial weekend in '02 or '03. Same with 2004. Now '07 is added to the list. In fact, this will make 6 OUT OF THE LAST 8 YEARS that they will NOT be open on Memorial Day.

I wish weather followed the calender yearly, open thanksgiving, closed memorial day. not a bad thought, but I think mother nature comes and goes as she pleases. some years she like to shit a lot, some years she doesn't. this year I think she was constipated. hopefully next year and years to come, will be a lot better than the 06/07 season. alpine meadows(where I ski) stayed open untill May 22nd last year, and this year we only made it until the last sunday of april. it blows, but I really can't get mad at the alpine staff, there wasn't enough snow to work with. what I can get mad with, is how gay the alpine ski patrol has become compared to past years. anyways......keep truckin. next season my friend, next season!

**BushwackerinPA** · 05-17-2007, 11:39 PM

Seth is that one guy making those bump lines in LC bowl?

Ron I hate to say it but they are out of snow, really. Bonar(he was out last sunday) loves to ski and he wants that place open as much as you.

No other resort in utah will ever match snowbird season length and remember last year closing early was brought on by P-dog being built.