Oarsman to Paddle Guide?

[stupendous man]

Although I lived in summit for a while with guides, I never took the course or guided commercially. I picked it up the oars for the first time on the Salmon in 2001 and started oaring anybody's boat who wanted a rest. Pretty soon after that I've just started renting boats to be able to guide the oars, and I've gotten pretty good.

I'd like to be able to try to take my friends down in a paddle boat rather than needing to have the whole oar set up (for the tight poudre and day trips), but I'm nervous about it. It seems more crew dependent and with less give than the oars, where I can always bail out or pull real hard if I'm off line.

Anybody have any tips for me? Should I just jump in with a sacrifice crew and try it?
Thanks.

[Tye 1on]

Anybody have any tips for me? Should I just jump in with a sacrifice crew and try it?
Thanks.

Yup. Just don't tell them they're the 'sacrifice' crew.

It's totally different, but you'll find you have a bunch more power. Oar to paddle is like 73 pinto to a suby wrx or whatever the freak that car is. A few tips: think carefully what your commands are, and edumacate the crew to them. All forward, all back, stop! and then the directionals. I used to tell them if they heard their side to back paddle. If i wanted to spin left, i'd say left side back [right side forward]. Practice that one. The other really helpful one is to tell them the number of strokes. Forward 2. Forward 2. Forward 2 more...allllllllllll forward!!! [splash, splash]. Without them paddling forward, you as rudder aren't very effective, so the numbered commands keep some forward mo without hitting top speed, unless you need top speed. The other thing to remember is to try and accompany your sacrifice crew for the entire trip. Being in the far back the 'twang' factor can be large, so figure out a good brace or you'll be flying thru the air with the greatest of ease...Teach 'em about highsiding too...leaning IN to obstacles, etc. Have phun!

[crackboy]

just went through guide training for paddle boats this past weekend

Try and keep it simple. Foward, backwards left turn right turn.

I find myself calling lots of foward 2, it helps keep momentum in check and keep s the crew thinking they are not doing that much.

its way easier to turn the boat without them paddling. but don't be afraid to have the crew turn the boat for you. if turning left, have them through a quick right turn 1 in there at the end to stop your momentum saving you some strength

[stupendous man]

I've had crew members before while at the oars - I actually like to have the front two paddle and sometimes they just want to and I take it easy.

so it totally makes sense that a few more paddlers = more power than me at the oars with some beer toters in front. As an oarsman, I like backing away from stuff - I seem to notice that paddle boats will charge in more, or react quicker, no?

I guess I'm more wondering about the ruddering. When is it used? Is it by stroke or just placing the guide paddle on one side or the other. You occasionally see those paddle guides doing big sort of kayak draws.

[crackboy]

two different styles, i like to throw out back ferrying with some head on type. it depends on the situation. coming from an oar situation you will probably initially think of backing off things, it works.


two main strokes for steering int he back are draws and prys with variations to get some foward momentum. prys give you more power but you can do big style draws, depends on if you are changing your angle alot or just to maintain course. i also use small little course correction type strokes to hold angles.. it really depends on your situations.

it is easy to use your guiding strokes without having the crew paddling, otherwise you are just doing corrective strokes and working harder to get turns in. i almost always have my paddle in the water doing some sort of small ruddering type stroke. then if i need a big correction/change of course, i call a stop, change my angle then call for some strokes

[G]

It would probably be worthwhile to find a decent guide trainer and pay him to take you out for an afternoon.

[stupendous man]

two main strokes for steering int he back are draws and prys with variations to get some foward momentum. prys give you more power but you can do big style draws, depends on if you are changing your angle alot or just to maintain course. i also use small little course correction type strokes to hold angles.. it really depends on your situations.

I don't think I'm familiar with "Prys", can you explain?

To turn direction without the paddlers, are you just doing a forward or back stroke on your side, or is that where the prys come in?

[Tye 1on]

draw=pulling paddle toward boat. Pry=pushing away.
You sit in the very back, on one side or the other [most rightys=right side of boat]. You are a rudder, paddle behind the boat. So you can spin the boat with pry/draws, which are basically back or forward strokes done with the paddle [rudder] extending straight behind the boat. Ya might consider Geoff's post....

[ridinshockgun]

This thread reminds me of the people at work asking if I'm "going canoeing" when the kayak is on the car. I always say "no, thats just an elephant suppository". This of course ranks second to "Its funny, everytime its raining, you bring your kayak", no shit.