The Ski Industry has turned to the darkside! Public User Fees!

[summit]

This is kind of a post transfer... sorry it's wrong... most of it is in and befor the first big para
<rant>
I was watching flipping channels and suddenly, there was Edna Dercum, co-founder of Arapahoe Basin and Keystone Ski Resorts. She was talking about how lift tickets used to be $2 and how one could find fresh powder on a resort 3 weeks after a storm.

What the hell happened?

Edna continued, the only way to ski powder at a resort these days is to be on the slopes while it is snowing.

Even just 15 years ago, the ski industry was still mostly about skiing. Resort lift prices were high, but still attainable and people in their 20s could find a halfway decent paying job and a place to stay.

Today, lift prices are 2-3X what they were a decade ago despite the fact they operate on public land. The ski industry is no longer about skiing, its about the mega-shopping villages at the base of the mountain that charge 50% more than the town 5 miles away and have 15% tax! The industry is about building more gentle runs at the bottom for the sole purpose of building more ski in ski out condos. Half of the low level industry jobs that were once held by college students taking a semester off are now held by illegal immigrants who don't speak a lick of english. High level jobs are paid for by importing Australian and New Zealanders who will work for far less than Americans. Real Estate prices are so high that most people can only afford the equivelent of a shared college dorm room in the employee housing with shared bathrooms.

I think part of the reason that there has been an explosion in back country skiing is not just because of the pleasure of it, it is also to get away from the unattainable, unaffordable, overskied resorts.

Is this trend only going to get worse or do you think it will reverse itself?

THINK IT DOESN'T MATTER BECAUSE YOU ONLY HIT THE BC?

Consider the fact that there are many out that wish the back country was Pay to Play! Take Vail Pass for instance.

Are you telling me that you have to pay to Ski Vail pass even though it is on National Forest Land. So you hike up and still pay?

Yes and Yes. Vail's mountains and Vail Pass are part of the White River National Forest so you have free access to the land. The free access to Vail Pass is superceded by a congressional bill so you have to pay to hike or ski Vail Pass when there is snow.

THAT'S RIGHT! PAY TO HIKE! The bullshit and ever expanding Recreational Fee Demonstration Program that amount to double taxation if you want to use PUBLIC lands that you already paid for with your yearly taxes. $5/day to ski the pass and they collected over $100,000 from Vail Pass last year. It is part of a congressionally authorized user fee demo program. Expect rates to climb and more free public places to become pay to play. Apparently trying to skirt the fees is punishable by a hefty fine. The GAO reports 30% of the fees collected go back into fee collection efforts and much of the rest goes into paving parking lots, new picnic tables, and bathroom facilities rather than trail maintainence. According to the paper, people have burned down the fee collection station at Cataract Lakes twice.

I'd bet that the big three have their fingers in that. I'd bet they think that if youngins are forced to pay money to walk up hills and ski the BC, they will give up and fork out $110 for a lift ticket.

I have heard little evidence that VailAssociates, Interwest, etc, are directly involved (a lobby group they are part of supports the idea). You better believe they like the idea because it's easier with them to compete with public land that costs money to access than free public land. However, there is no government fee on individuals to use any public land that ski resorts are located on.

Summit Daily Article

Summit Daily Article 2

Summit Daily Article 3

Summit Daily Article 4

Maybe we should schedule a protest where 110 people skin up some crowded runs at Vail and ski down. Remember, it is public land and they can only charge you to ride the lift, not the snow. Ha!

Oh wait... now we are hearing that public land may be closed to the public for "safety reasons" at Silverton if they are granted expansion.

OK my rambly rant has digressed from the main points about the on piste ski industry and its continual bastardization.

[tom]

splat here, tom and I are sharing my computer and I keep logging in as him......

This is serious shit. I'm crossposting my response from there to here because I consider such violations of the public trust indicative of a loss of rights and freedoms basic to the fundamentals of being an American.

---It doesn't end there. As with all National Park and Forest Service usage fees, every time some asshole pays to use PUBLIC lands, their payment is chalked up as an endorsement of the usage fee process UNLESS THE FEE IS PROTESTED. I can't tell you to engage engage in Earth First types of protests (this is the internet)but unless enough people rise up against this schit, only the rich will be able to enjoy the lands our forefathers died to settle and protect. Apathy sucks...

[DaveTV]

They did it in NH several years ago. If you don't have WMNF usage fee permit on your car and you are parked anywhere in the White Mt Nat forest, you get a ticket - - join and supporthttp://www.freeourforests.org/

[summit]

Another post transfer...

Splat:

I agree that apathy sucks. It is rampant.

You gotta love those ELF/Earth First tards... celebrate the environment by torching massive impregnated wood structures, cars full of plastics and adhesives, etc. That is really healthy for the environment! One of these days they'll end up torching a building with someone in it hand Uberfascist Asscroft will come down on em big time.

The Rec Demo Fee program needs to die. It's our land and we pay for it with taxes... double taxation is a load of crap. Write your congressman!


I don't buy into the extreme enviromentalist belief that humans are inherently evil and should be stopped at all attempts to access the environment. These are the tards who want BC skiing and Avvy control work banned because it disturbs the depth hoar that vermin borough easily through in the winter to scavenge. Save the freaking ground squirrels.
</rant>

DaveTV: awesome website!