Downhill skiers protest against start-number rule

[spook]

Downhill skiers protest against start-number rule dpa German Press Agency
Published: Saturday February 24, 2007



Garmisch-Partenkirchen, Germany- The world's best downhill
alpine skiers protested Saturday to the International Ski Federation
(FIS) over the start-number regulations operating in the World Cup.
"We are asking for a fair chance. The better you are the harder
you are punished," said the Liechtenstein downhill racer Marco
Buechel at a team leaders' meeting in Garmisch-Partenkirchen.

The speed specialists are unhappy at a rule in which the best 30
racers begin in reverse order in the downhill and super-giant slalom.

It means the leading skiers often have to cope with worsening
conditions on the course and have slower times than the earlier
starters. The regulation has led to many upset results this season.

Among the racers asking for a rule change are the downhill world
champion and overall World Cup leader Aksel Lund Svindal of Norway,
the current downhill leader Didier Cuche of Switzerland and 2002
Olympic downhill winner Fritz Strobl of Austria.

FIS race director Guenter Hujara said the federation could decide
on a rule change at its congress in Portoroz, Slovenia in May.

© 2006 - dpa German Press Agency

http://rawstory.com/news/dpa/Downhil..._02242007.html

[Dexter Rutecki]

They should be pissed--when did they start the reverse 30? I thought for awhile the top 15 got to pick their start number within the top 30. I saw that first race at Garmisch and it was ridiculous how chewed up the course got (50 degree weather) by the 30th guy. That Slovenian guy who won is generally a non-contender on the Europa Cup, I think.

[summit]

you mean they dont groom the course after each run?

[Dexter Rutecki]

Actually on the WC they do slip it between every skier, but that only does so much. They just need harder snow.

[powder11]

the DH at the world championships is a prime example of whats been happening. a bunch of nobodys who ran before the course sunbaked got to stand on the podium.

[ak_powder_monkey]

Isn't that the fun of skiing? Changing conditions change everything

[Gripen]

They should be pissed--when did they start the reverse 30? I thought for awhile the top 15 got to pick their start number within the top 30. I saw that first race at Garmisch and it was ridiculous how chewed up the course got (50 degree weather) by the 30th guy. That Slovenian guy who won is generally a non-contender on the Europa Cup, I think.

My brother is working course crew there this year. He said the conditions were miserable at best. He said it is not even fun to slip it, let alone race it.

[GoNads]

the DH at the world championships is a prime example of whats been happening. a bunch of nobodys who ran before the course sunbaked got to stand on the podium.

Uhhh, I fail to see how Eric Guay is a nobody. As a ski racer, I understand the problem with the start order, it sucks. It happens in tech too, for 2nd run when the start order is reversed top 30. But it speed, courses are normally water injected and hold up decently, in relation to tech where the wear is much worse. Hell, The Lake Louise course had 2 days of DH training for men, a race day of DH, SG, and the same for the women. Then we had 3 days of NOR-Am DH training and two more days of racing without ANY grooming. Speed courses do hold up, they just get sketchier and faster. Some of the top American and Canadian girls in the Nor-Ams were posting faster speeds of like 135km/h at the bottom of fallaway in comparison to 122-125km/h reached by the women in the WC DH.

Eric Guay is hardly a nobody, he has numerous podiums on the circuit, this year and in previous years. He was 4th in the World Champs a few weeks ago too. That's fairly offensive, for someone who has worked so long and hard.

Speed courses sometimes get faster as more skiers run, sometimes slower, it depends on the temp, and weather. It's just luck, what the day brings in that regard.

[Dexter Rutecki]

Uhhh, I fail to see how Eric Guay is a nobody.

I thought Guay was in fourth, and I assume 11 was referring to Hudec and Jaerbyn, neither of whom is in the top 25 in DH this year. And that Slovenian guy who won at Garmisch won only because of his start position--I think the last DH he ran was the Italian JUNIOR championships, and he finished ninth. The guy is basically a Europa Cup skier.
I'm not sure why you took that as a slight against your Canadian hero.

As a ski racer, I understand the problem with the start order, it sucks. It happens in tech too, for 2nd run when the start order is reversed top 30. But it speed, courses are normally water injected and hold up decently, in relation to tech where the wear is much worse.

I think you're pretty confused. Most courses that are water injected are the tech courses, and the increased wear in SL/GS is the result of so many more skiers taking exactly the same line. That's why water injection is more necessary--it's also a hell of a lot harder to water inject 2 miles of DH. Sometimes they spray the courses down, but for Garmisch that wouldn't have made a difference (50 degrees at the bottom).

[nick > jesus]

it makes a much smaller difference in DH, racers don't edge as hard, so the ruts are not as large, and the same coarse has been used for every practice and quailifing run in days prior with little repair other that slipping the hill

[GoNads]

I thought Guay was in fourth, and I assume 11 was referring to Hudec and Jaerbyn, neither of whom is in the top 25 in DH this year. And that Slovenian guy who won at Garmisch won only because of his start position--I think the last DH he ran was the Italian JUNIOR championships, and he finished ninth. The guy is basically a Europa Cup skier.
I'm not sure why you took that as a slight against your Canadian hero.



I think you're pretty confused. Most courses that are water injected are the tech courses, and the increased wear in SL/GS is the result of so many more skiers taking exactly the same line. That's why water injection is more necessary--it's also a hell of a lot harder to water inject 2 miles of DH. Sometimes they spray the courses down, but for Garmisch that wouldn't have made a difference (50 degrees at the bottom).

Jan was 2nd in Are, at WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS and has had multiple top tens and top 15s. He has missed the podium by hundredths a few times this year. He's recovering from two ACL reconstructs and he just had a kid last spring. Which DH day are we talking about because there were two races, one to replace the last one which was canceled.

They water inject parts of lots of speed courses. And like nick said, there is very little break down in speed, as opposed to tech. Like I said I raced the Nor-Ams at lake Louise after the same exact line had been skied probably well over 2000 times over 10+ days.


Eric ran 21st today and won. Weather changes, courses deteriorate, gates get re drilled, it's the nature of the beast. Some people get to run in perfect vis, but by the time you run there might only be 30 feet vis. It happens all the time here at Whistler. Sometimes people get mad tail winds, or headwinds which change every few seconds. It's not perfect, it's not fair. It's racing.

[powder11]

the guys with the points should decide where they want to run. Guay and co have shown some promise, but need to show consistancy over time to be in the same league as Raich, Miller or Cuche. I bet Ken Read has told them as much.

[runethechamp]

the guys with the points should decide where they want to run. Guay and co have shown some promise, but need to show consistancy over time to be in the same league as Miller . I bet Ken Read has told them as much.

Consistency in partying then I guess.

[powder11]

Consistency in partying then I guess.

yeah he has 52 wc podiums AND he was drunk! afterall, he had to handicap the competition

[runethechamp]

He's been very consistent in partying and mediocre performance in the last two BIG competitions, you can't argue with that. But when he's on he's pretty fucking good, I can't argue with that.

[GoNads]

Maybe because they're all young? Early twenties and are recovering from injuries? Yes, the Canadian boys party hard, but fuck... Bode was out drinking with playboy bunnies during the Olympics.

Just because you havent heard of them doesn't mean they aren't skiing well. If you want the guys with the "Points" to decide, Canadian's are doing as good or better than Raich, Miller and Cuche.

Current DH cup standings are

1 CUCHE Didier
2 BUECHEL Marco
3 JERMAN Andrej
4 FILL Peter
5 GUAY Erik <--- Canuck
6 WALCHHOFER Michael
7 MILLER Bode
8 SCHEIBER Mario
9 OSBORNE-PARADIS Manuel <---Canuck
10 NYMAN Steven

Guay's last few WC results were..

Garmisch-Partenkirchen 1st
Garmisch-Partenkirchen 3rd
Are World Champs 4th
Val D'Isere 2nd

I fail to see the lack of consistency in that. He was also 4th in the Olympics last year in SG.

As for the SG standings, another nobody, Johnny Kucera is 2nd to Bode.
MILLER Bode USA 1 218
KUCERA John CAN 2 162

You know, he's just another random inconsistent nobody right? Some highlight results from this season..

Are World Champs GS 12th
Wengen SC DH portion 6th
Adelboden GS 12th
Alta Badia GS 5th
Val Gardena SG 3rd
Reiteralm SC 10th
Lake Louise SG 1st

Not bad for his second year racing world cup. The entire Canadian team is doing awesome right now, if you havent been reading newspapers or following WC that doesn't mean it isn't happening. Cuche, Miller, Raich all have 5-10+ years on these guys, give them time. They're only going to get better.

[powder11]

all wc racers are consistant partiers. miller takes the heat because he runs his mouth too much. miller has 42 more wc podiums and two more olympic medals than your boy Svindal. yeah, you cant argue with that.

[GoNads]

all wc racers are consistant partiers. miller takes the heat because he runs his mouth too much. miller has 42 more wc podiums and two more olympic medals than your boy Svindal. yeah, you cant argue with that.

Svindal is also young, he's 24, Kucera is 22, Guay is 25.

How can you compare total WC victories when the likes of Hermann, who is 34 has 10 years on someone like Svindal? Even Bode is 29... thats 7 years on someone like Kucera, and Kucera is 2nd to him in the overall SG standings by 50 points.

[powder11]

How can you compare total WC victories when the likes of Hermann, who is 34 has 10 years on someone like Svindal? Even Bode is 29... thats 7 years on someone like Kucera, and Kucera is 2nd to him in the overall SG standings by 50 points.

my point is those guys have consistantly produced top results over many years. I also like to look at overall wc points. its not very impressive if you cant place in all the events. the young up and comers still have alot to prove. dont get your panties in such a bunch.

[GoNads]

In that case... Svindal is still winning the overall.

[f2f]

the DH at the world championships is a prime example of whats been happening. a bunch of nobodys who ran before the course sunbaked got to stand on the podium.

based on this, i do believe powder11 is the one having his panties in a bunch.

[powder11]

based on this, i do believe powder11 is the one having his panties in a bunch.

no, Im going to wake up tomorrow, ski some nice powder and have forgotten all about this exchange. these are the guys who really have their panties in a bunch.

The world's best downhill
alpine skiers protested Saturday to the International Ski Federation
(FIS) over the start-number regulations operating in the World Cup.

[f2f]

no, Im going to wake up tomorrow, ski some nice powder and have forgotten all about this exchange.

one wonders why you bothered entering the discussion in the first place.

[powder11]

one wonders why you bothered entering the discussion in the first place.

just offering up my opinion about ski racing and you?

[powder11]

Im not bashing anyone and I should know better than getting into a pissing contest on the internet with teenagers