Comparison review: 179 BRO "soft" vs. BRO "stiff"

[Deep Days]

As some of you know, I had a rocky process with getting my skis. Regardless, I want to thank splat for making the absolute best of that and giving me much better service than I'd expect. The dude hooked us up with a hotel room just so I could stick around to get my skis. And he loaned me these
softs until my stiffs were ready. So... thanks, man.

At any rate, I skied the softs for I think 8 days (see below), and I have been on my new stiffs the last 2 days. In my opinion, the softs I had felt softer than what I'd expect a BRO "soft" to feel like, and the stiffs still aren't quite what I would expect of a stiff. Could you give your thoughts on that round of stiffs you guys produced, splat? I'd be curious to see how those compare in flex to other batches of stiffs.

REVIEW: 179 SOFT BRO
Me: 160, 5'9, likes big turns and skiing fast, likes bumps less
Other skis in quiver: 175 Pocket Rocket, 178 B3 (my former everyday ski; got the bro as a stiffer replacement), 179 public enemy, 170 Deep Powder, GS, and slalom
Bindings: Solly 997 14 DIN mounted on PMGear line (998 mm from tip, I think...???)
Boots: Fucking plug boots (Solly X2)
Terrain skied: Keystone night skiing fast groomers, Eldora deep powder, Kirkwood chutes, bumps, chalk, and everything else under the sun.
Overall impression: Love the turn shape and light weight, but they're just too soft.

The first few laps I took on my soft BROs were on about 2" of chalky cut up groomer stuff on Peru at Keystone at night. There is a fairly steep pitch at the bottom that is good for going fast. I lapped the hell out of this and loved the "spatulately" feel on the few patches of deeper creamy snow I encountered. They slarved beautifully, but when I wanted to make true racer-style GS turns, the BROs had no gripes about holding an edge. Even on some slick spots, the edges (which were sharp) carved right through, and I had no problems with the tails washing out. These skis were very fun for fast groomer laps, and the light weight made them impressively quick edge-to-edge. At higher speeds, though, they felt a little squirrely (the tips felt like they were flopping in the wind due to being soft and light), but as long as I was hard on the edge, I was ok (not totally comfortable, but ok). The skis were definitely not hard to ski and would probably be great for your 110 lb "advanced skier" girlfriend (they could be overpowered by stronger ladies, I fear). I'd give the overall groomer-ski performance a solid B+.

The following day was about 24" of new fairly sticky heavy powder at Eldora. I kept going over the bars, and I'd imagine the camber had something to do with this (there was a lot). I noticed a LOT of tip deflection in the heavy crud and felt pretty sketchy even at moderate speeds, fearing going over the bars in a transition from slick snow to thick snow. I just felt like I got bounced around and couldn't power through the shitty snow like I wanted to. However, the soft flex was beneficial in the powder bumps, and if I stayed centered on the ski, I had fun in the bumps. Open stuff was not nearly as much fun, and I definitely struggled in the trees (relied on sidecut, not the "slarve," to turn). I'd give the overall deep pow-day (not deep pow... they were just as fun as any ski in untouched stuff) performance a B-.

Then it was time to head to Kirkwood. I skied all sorts of snow: everything from chalky windcrust to some small (5-8 ft.) airs, to steep icy groomers, to sunbaked mushy stuff, and even some cream cheese and icy bumps. The skis performed well on the groomers (see above) and were very fun on chalky and creamy snow. I skied the little shoulder above chair 2 (some very small, tight, semi-tech chutes covered in chalk and crud) many MANY times, and I really liked the soft, easy-to-ski feel on this type of stuff. The skis had a tendency to slide for part of the turn, and the tips would predictably hook up and carve across the fall line. This was fun and was good for scrubbing speed between technical turns. And luckily, this style of skiing has an on-off switch on the soft BROs, as I noticed that as I picked up speed out of the chutes and made big fast turns through really shitty refrozen cut-up powder, the skis held an edge fairly well and didn't slip out unless I told them to. The problem on this kind of snow was (again) the tip deflection. Coming from skiing similar stuff for a couple days on 170 Deep Powders (115 underfoot, much stiffer than the softs, and heavy as shit), which absolutely blast through anything in their path, I wondered if this performance was a function of the weight. The BROs didn't inspire near as much confidence as my Deep Powders on this type of snow, but I could ski them ALMOST as fast as I wanted, getting bucked around a fair amount in the process.

The slarving held true even on firmer snow in chutes in the trees (the tips always predictably finished the turn on the edge, and scrubbing speed when necessary was easier than on other skis I've been on). The edge hold was good on sketchy terrain (and firm snow), and my only gripe was that I still suck too much to appreciate it.

Going over the bars was not an issue landing 6-8 ft. airs with decent speed. I felt solid landing, and the light weight of the skis made maneuvering quickly to double-stage something or whatever absolute cake. Stomping is easy, although landing backseat tends to make the soft tails give way a bit. I just tried to stay forward and was fine.

I do believe I found the speed limit on groomers in Kirkwood. I was straightlining down the race course for probably 150 vert, so I got up to some serious speed, and the tips started to shake and get much more squirrely than I had ever found before. My (ignorant) guess would be that I was going 40+ mph. Anyway, I tried to lay the skis hard on edge cutting left to slow down a bit, and (probably user error) my right ski didn't respond as quick as I thought it would, and I ended up in a split (this was how I did my MCL).

The bottom line: these would make an AWESOME touring ski if you're never skiing any crud. I give them a B for inbounds skiing. But I like crud, and I love going fast through crud, so I just needed something more powerful that would get deflected less. My current BROs are the answer.


See next post for stiff BRO review.

[Deep Days]

REVIEW: 179 "STIFF" BRO
Me, boots, bindings, mount point, everything else the same
NOTE: THERE IS A SIGNIFICANT DECREASE IN THE AMOUNT OF CAMBER FROM THE SOFTS. IF ANYONE IS INTERESTED, I WILL POST A PROFILE PICTURE. The softs felt in deep snow like they had considerably too much camber.
Terrain skied: Loveland pow/windcream

Day 1: 4" in the previous 48 hours, transported all over the mountain. Varied from just margarine spread on toast to sour gream glopped on top of a taco.
It was my first day back on snow in a month, and there had been some pow. It was dumping, so I'd guess that "4 inches" was more like 7 by the time I got there. I skied a couple fast groomer laps and was very impressed by the difference in deflection on bumpy stuff. A lot of what I skied at first was cut up stuff that had been filled in by the wind, so it was fairly dense but smooth. The skis were maybe just a tad less quick edge-to-edge than the softs, but the improvement in edge hold was about as noticeable (not very, as the softs were damn impressive to start with). I felt like I could get some of the power that was lacking in the softs and was totally stoked to be making big GS turns through semi-cut up powder. I skied the lift line on chair 4 a lot faster than I could have on the softs in these conditions. "Solid" would be a great word to describe these skis. Maybe just a tad too soft, as I felt like when I really threw all my weight on the edge, they were a bit too turny, but I noticed a considerably higher speed limit on the stiffs in any type of soft snow. Granted, what I was skiing was not very steep (moderate to shallow blue run), but my confidence was definitely higher. My thought at the end of the day was "Damn, these are SWEET skis!"

I haven't been able to test the groomer speed limit (or bump performance) on them, as the snow has been soft here all week and my knee isn't perfect, but the tips are stiffer, which should help.

Day 2: 8 more inches on top of aforementioned 4. I skied some trees today, and had a hell of a time! The stiffs feel considerably more "spatulatey", probably because of the decrease in camber and the stiffer flex (flexing and thus turning less and sliding more). I normally suck at trees, but it was like cheating. I skied faster than I ever have in the trees on chair 1 and felt totally in control. I could slow down or stop whenever I wanted, or I could accelerate as much as I wanted. It took a few runs to get used to the feel of these skis, as I was throwing them WAY too far sideways at first, expecting them not to be nearly as responsive, but what I found was that if you just put them a little on edge and throw them a little to the side, they'll finish the turn for you (if you let them; it's not very hard to resist and initiate a new turn). It's like all the "parabolic ski" inventors say: the ski turns for you. It's nice!

I skied the short pitch above midway on chair 2, which was a cross between powder bumps, and cream cheese (the wind had filled in a lot of the troughs of the bumps). I skied this pitch a few times as fast as I could and never felt out of control. Like I said, I just felt so much more powerful on these skis. They didn't mind making big turns at all. Loved it. Stayed stable all the way through. Little porpoisey turns were no problem either. They just sorta do it all.

I definitely noticed having to get more on top of them, so caveat to little tiny 100 lb ripper chicks, but they weren't exactly m103s. In other words: I think they're very responsive, so that if you put a lot of power into the turn, they stay nice and solid. But they don't mercilessly punish the lazy. I felt overall aggressive and confident on these skis and am looking strongly forward to putting a bunch of days on them. I think for a guy of my size and ability, these skis are just about perfect. I might like them to be a touch stiffer, but I have no major gripes, and I have many smiles. It should be several seasons before I'm ready for anything burlier.

The bottom line: These skis are awesome. I give the BRO stiff an A- for inbounds skiing. I'll fill in this thread if I find anything unusual or ski any weird terrain.

Again, thanks to splat for helping me out (and for the skis!) Sorry if I was a douche, man. Just frustrated with the wait was all.


Marshal, could you flex these, and give me assign a number on your scale, so I could post it here? It would be appreciated (just like the mount... thanks, dood!)

[Yossarian]

Very nice work Max.

[GBB]

Great review man. Thanks.

[pechelman]

were your softs the real soft flex or the super soft flex where biaxially glass was used instead of triax? maybe pat can comment?

good reviews man!

one question though, what flex were your boots if you ahd to guess. (i know theyre plugs, but you can tune flex)

[Deep Days]

were your softs the real soft flex or the super soft flex where biaxially glass was used instead of triax? maybe pat can comment?

I'm wondering that myself. Splat said they were softs, but (and I don't mean to be antagonistic, just dubious) I'm not sure I believe that.

good reviews man!

Thanks.

one question though, what flex were your boots if you ahd to guess. (i know theyre plugs, but you can tune flex)

Meh... 120? I took out the back rivets to soften them up a little. Maybe Marshal can comment on the flex, having skied the same boot with the same type of thing done...? They're pretty stiff, probably a little too stiff for me for freeskiing.


On a side note, I'll be skiing Keystone tonight, repeating the process of before. There could be some cut-up stuff left to ski at silly speeds, so I'll comment on my experience if so.

[pechelman]

Meh... 120? I took out the back rivets to soften them up a little. Maybe Marshal can comment on the flex, having skied the same boot with the same type of thing done...? They're pretty stiff, probably a little too stiff for me for freeskiing.

thats what i was thinking, especially on such a soft ski (if it was those blems).

[Larryl]

Thanks for the review. I ordered the 179 soft back on Nov. 1, 2006, and am still waiting for the pair to come. At least I know there may be an end to the tunnel. I am going to mount the soft Bro (if and when they arrive) with the dynafit verticals primarily for long distance touring. Based on your review, that may be a good fit.

[Chiz]

Nice review. Im trying to decide between seths and bros, you're making me lean towards the latter. Any chance of posting a few pics?

[adimmen]

You shouldn't even have to think about that one. Go with the Bros. You can get blems very quickly without sacrificing performance.

[Deep Days]

Any chance of posting a few pics?

Not for a few days. I'm in the swamp right now and won't be back in Boulder til Tuesday night.

Never skied Seths, so I can't tell you for sure.

[Camel Toad]

I am going to mount the soft Bro (if and when they arrive) with the dynafit verticals primarily for long distance touring. Based on your review, that may be a good fit.

I've been skiing this setup for a couple of months now. absolutely kills it. Super light, yet still able to charge. Now I just need to mount up my BROhemoths. They are all shiny and white and waiting in my living room for some bindings. They are huge, they scare me, and I can't freaking wait!

[C_Free]

Thanks alot deep days for the comparison, it is great for those whoe don't know whether to buy the stiffs or the softs. Very helpful.

[jrf]

Has anyone skied the super stiffs? i'm in the market for an inbounds everyday ripping ski and dont know whether to go stiff or super. Id be going 188s though, as im 5 10 190.

[MTT]

Has anyone skied the super stiffs? i'm in the market for an inbounds everyday ripping ski and dont know whether to go stiff or super. Id be going 188s though, as im 5 10 190.

You have Tahoe listed as your location.

Why don't you take a ride down to Reno and visit the factory?

BTW my knee jerk awnser would be 188 Stiff with Alpine bindings. (Lotta Ski)

[Shepherd Wong]

Has anyone skied the super stiffs? i'm in the market for an inbounds everyday ripping ski and dont know whether to go stiff or super. Id be going 188s though, as im 5 10 190.

The super stiff 188 are pretty dog-gone stiff. I love mine but it's worth the time to hand flex them compared to some skis you know you like.

[jrf]

You have Tahoe listed as your location.

Why don't you take a ride down to Reno and visit the factory?

BTW my knee jerk awnser would be 188 Stiff with Alpine bindings. (Lotta Ski)

I spoke to Splat a few days ago and will check out a pair at their shop, but it sounds like he doesnt have any superstiffs to demo.

[smmokan]

Just an FYI, my 179 softs have almost no camber at all.

[Core Shot]

Has anyone skied the super stiffs? i'm in the market for an inbounds everyday ripping ski and dont know whether to go stiff or super. Id be going 188s though, as im 5 10 190.

6'4" 215lbs.
At least 25 days on each ski.
I prefer regular stiff over super stiff 188s, but its all personal preference.

Super stiff kills at mach looney speed and through crud.

regular stiff is plenty stiff. Its more versatile (particularly if you have to ski bumps). Super stiff in bumps is more challenging.

If you like real stiff skis, but don't have to ski bumps then super stiff will be lots of fun.

YMMV

[hoarhey]

Just an FYI, my 179 softs have almost no camber at all.

Neither do mine.
179 softs received last month (Jan 2007).

When did you get yours, smmokan?

[pechelman]

x3 on no camber
the 179 super softs when base to base have roughly .25" of camber total.
(ie ~.125" per ski)
recently delivered but fab'd a while ago

[splat]

I spoke to Splat a few days ago and will check out a pair at their shop, but it sounds like he doesnt have any superstiffs to demo.

Shit - I forgot - there's a pair of supa stiff demos at Cornice Sports in Kirkwood. Just tell Chewie I sent you.

[jrf]

Shit - I forgot - there's a pair of supa stiff demos at Cornice Sports in Kirkwood. Just tell Chewie I sent you.

damn! if i knew, i was down there on monday. i'll still plan to stop by friday and check out whatya got.

[Boss Hogg Barbarian]

Wow, that made my future decision a lot easier.

[Deep Days]

this space reserved for pictures that I promise to take very soon.