putting scales on an alpine ski?

[Platinum Pete]

Someone was talking about a shop in Bend that can put scales on your skis, just like the ones on the Karhu XCD Guides. Unpossible? Unsmart?

My thinking is that I'd be interested in a ski like the xcd guides if I wasn't a big dude that likes fat, semi-stiff skis for the descent. Scaling up a lightweight ski I already like would give me the skinless and weight benefits without a crapola descent, right?

Thoughts?

[Conundrum]

Never used a ski with scales but my bet is they would suck on the ups compared to skins except for the weight.

[summit]

aren't scales only for low angle harder snow?

(XC JONG)

[marshalolson]

get your hands on an exacto-knife and some meth, and give'r

[laseranimal]

PP

my guess is that you'd be putting a negative(recessed) pattern on your skis not a positive(raised) pattern like the XCD Guides and Cross Terrains. Negative pattern is it'll ski better, but it'll suck for climbing meaning you'll probably still need skins. A positive base will give you better climb but your still looking at 15-20% as the max angle you're gonna be able to hold w/o skins.

only reason I could see putting scales on an alpine ski would be if you had a lot of flat approach to cover and didn't want to use skins.

[El Chupacabra]

I have some Fischer Boundless Crown skis that are basically skinny, soft alpine-cambered skis, with a fish scale pattern cut into the ptex under foot. They work OK for gentle uphills, but anything steeper or icy, and they don't grip.

I would think you could make a similar pattern using a router or Dremel.

[ulty_guy]

powderfarmer

[pechelman]

hey pete
checkout my karhu xcd thread and the link i put in it to ttips.

theyve got a good discussion over there.

the verdict seems to be that a positive pattern like the guides, works pretty damned well in most snow, so long as it isnt super hard\ice and has a decent moisture content. The ideal snow sounds like PNW heavy wet stuff and the worst 3-5% Colorado blower.

[awineke]

I've got a pair of Alpina Cross Terrains that I stuck 404's on. It's a great hut trip ski -- almost all of the huts have a lot of gradual or rolling terrain that skins suck on, followed by a final steep push. The Alpina's can only climb maybe 10-12 degrees without skins.

Drawbacks are that when you do put skins on, they tend to get snow under them because of the scales. The skis are skinny (102-64-87, I think) and short (I think the longest is 178 and mine are 168), so they're not good in the soft stuff. I wouldn't take them in-bounds, but they ski pretty well on corn or packed powder.

I think this kind of ski has its role, but you could get a lot of the same benefits from kicker skins.

[lemon boy]

Scales IME have only marginal better holding power than some proper kick wax, course I've never tried to use KW on a alpine cambered ski either.

[DJMingus]

Just use wax if you don't want to use skins - and there are lots of places/reasons not to use skins. Works fine - way better than most people seem to think. A single cambered ski has plenty of uphill grip with the right wax on, especially in any snow that isn't old and icy. Basically, skins blow on slopes that are less than steep IMHO.

Thin smooth layer from tip to tail, or at least a really long section underfoot.

[Ira]

a great tip for the upcoming spring days is to put a layer of duct tape over the middle of you ski and then apply kick wax or Klister over that. when you are done climbing, peel the tape off and put it in a zip lock baggie. klister and kick wax and duct tape make a wonderful firestarter at the little hut woodstoves...

burns hot and long...

Ira

[altasnob]

powderfarmer

Ya, Farmer Dave supposedly cuts scales into his bases:

"Hearsay on the mountain indicates he uses a half-skin or three-quarter skin, but Van Dame dismisses these methods and reluctantly admits he cuts fish scales into the bottom of his bases."

http://www.netscape.com/viewstory/20...tml&frame=true
http://www.netscape.com/viewstory/20...tml&frame=true