anybody here a vegan?

**Woodsy** · 01-26-2007, 04:05 PM

ib you dobt pwactth mderathon in dat yo tounb wilb swel thup ab mak it thard to talg

**iceman** · 01-26-2007, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by Woodsy

ib you dobt pwactth mderathon in dat yo tounb wilb swel thup ab mak it thard to talg

heh. Damn if I'm not stumped for a witty reply.

Anyone?

**adam** · 01-26-2007, 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by lemon boy

Adam-

God has given us sole dominion over the animals, what we do with them is definitionally right.

AG- homerun.

As for the argument that meat production is an inefficient means of delivering calories: No Sale.

It is silly to reduce all food production to the sole "most efficient" delivery/growth model, this violates our basic omnivorous physiology.

The waste issue is a big issue but one that is by NO MEANS insurmoutable and tagging only meat production for this flat ignores the issues on the agriculture side of the house.

thats the argument my dad uses against me

**Tippster** · 01-26-2007, 04:23 PM

Originally Posted by iceman

heh. Damn if I'm not stumped for a witty reply.

Anyone?

Nope. Sounds about right. Shoulda mentioned the pubes tho, unless.... NO! SHE SHAVES????

**lemon boy** · 01-26-2007, 04:33 PM

HA HA! Woodsy is out of shape! Get some excercise dude.

-------------------------------------------------------

adam- In case you haven't noticed moral absolutism doesn't really get you anywhere, especially on this subject where it should be patently obvious that the extreme end of either of these postions is untenable.

Revolutionary idea for you:
eat a broad based diet that works for you and make those choices that for you seem like the best compromise between health, enjoyment, economics and should you so choose...the welfare/dignified treatment of the animals (if any) that you choose to consume. Nobody can live a completely consistent life, which is not to say that you can't make choices that you feel positively coordinate with your worldview.

I'm sure that your dad resists moral absolutist calls for eschewing meat are whatever but it should be a slam dunk to convince him to patronize meat vendors that are not factory "farming" either. With a tiny bit of effort you can get all the hippy bullshit meat you want (ethically/responsibly treated) at prices way under store bought.

**adam** · 01-26-2007, 04:38 PM

As I said in my earlier post, its hard to tell what is regulation "free range" and what meets me expectations. A lot of communities around the world survived (or survive) on no meat, and I don't think its unnecessary. Why kill if you don't have to?

**Beaver** · 01-26-2007, 04:49 PM

Originally Posted by iceman

Even including eating beaver?

As long as your moderation is moderated you should be good.

**lemon boy** · 01-26-2007, 04:50 PM

Why rely on regulation to tell you what does and does not meet your criteria for happy and environmentally conscious animals?

You (PERSONALLY) can speak directly to producers, schedule humane slaughter and direct the cutting all for much less than store-bought and get a higher quality product to boot!

Make no mistake, you cannot live without causing the death either intentional or indirectly of other animals, period. You may not eat them, but you still bring about their death by your mere existence.

**adam** · 01-26-2007, 05:03 PM

In the society we live where everything is done for us (most of it completely unnecessary) that is very true. Nearly every product you buy in stores, be it hygienics, food, makeup, nearly everything we put in or on our body's is tested on animals. To not support animal death at all, you have to be a minimalist, live outside (or create a squat), steal/dumpster dive food, never pay for gasoline.

I try to steal (never from small, local company's, only from major corporations), dumpster dive, and walk everywhere (my bike got stolen) which is hard because I live four miles up from town. Living that kind of life when your in school is hard, but I do my best. I know I'm no poster child for non-consumerism, but I do my best not to buy a lot of unnecessary items. Its hard not to hurt something or someone when you purchase anything.

**booner** · 01-26-2007, 05:09 PM

I think grilled vegan would taste pretty good.

**booner** · 01-26-2007, 05:10 PM

I want to eat grilled vegan

**Split-It** · 01-26-2007, 05:14 PM

Come here to Argentina, where the last of the vegetarians and vegans died off several years ago. Now I can go to the butcher and nobody looks twice when he starts hacksawing me off a piece of cow hanging next to him. Where during christmas week, a guy got on the bus next to me with an entire skinned chivo (goat, head included) wrapped in plastic wrap, ready for the asado (bbq). nobody stared. when you order a steak, you get fkn a steak. no fancy side dishes or garnished included,dammit. meat on a plate.

this is meat eatin' country dammit!

**Greydon Clark** · 01-26-2007, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by Split-It

Come here to Argentina, where the last of the vegetarians and vegans died off several years ago.

Disregarding Argentina’s astronomical rates of bowel cancer and the hog-like physique of much of the populace, as a vegetarian I ate better in rural Argentina and Chile than in rural Wyoming and Utah.

**Split-It** · 01-26-2007, 05:37 PM

^^^ Im sure you're talking about northern Argentine area, where there actually are tons of great quality food products. Unfortunately, in Patagonia, most of our veggies are shipped in, leaving them always wilted and pathetic looking (and tasting). Of course, Patagonia berries are the delight of summer, but other than that.....

CARNE!!!!! Come Asado o morti!!!

**Greydon Clark** · 01-26-2007, 05:57 PM

Actually, it was in Patagonia. The fresh vegetables were anything but and the restaurants were obviously using frozen produce, they always had a tasty, if cheese laden, pasta or similar item. Salads were, um, creative? Lentils and shredded carrots covered in oil was popular. In fairness, I did eat a lot of pizza too. Food wise, the most appalling thing I encountered was the lack of real coffee. Seriously, what the fuck it up with the Nescafe? I’d rather drink rendered beef fat.

Patagonia would be hell for vegans, but for vegetarians that eat cheese and eggs, it is a pretty easy place to travel and you’ll eat better there than the white trash corners of America. I flew in and out of Santiago, there I ate at an all vegetarian restaurant that was on par with a similarly priced establishment in San Francisco.

**altagirl** · 01-26-2007, 08:46 PM

Originally Posted by Tippster

Kanguruh = Anglos
Mooserwirt = Euros (back in the day. Could be different now) thus my point. Both fucking ROCK.

Come to think of it, all my preference is based on was our general ability to get a table at the Kangaruh (assuming we went early enough), vs. standing around in a crowd at the Mooserwirt. That and the fun of skiing down that bump field once you're too drunk to walk.