One tip to meeting Maggots for ski touring

**rideit** · 01-21-2007, 06:34 PM

try multiple beacons...it's a start.

**Trackhead** · 01-21-2007, 06:39 PM

Originally Posted by jahoney

how would you guys want us to practice this kinda stuff

Well, many locations throughout the west have beacon training sites.

There is a convenient location at Snowbird, by the heli outfit.

**Dexter Rutecki** · 01-21-2007, 06:42 PM

Crystal has a beacon pit I used for practice last year. They also had probes you could practice with.

**mc_roon** · 01-21-2007, 06:45 PM

heres an question for you. What do all of you as a whole feel about your touring partners having tiny non-extendably shitty shovels that would take forever to dig someone out?

Also, minimum acceptable length for a probe?

**smitchell333** · 01-21-2007, 06:49 PM

Originally Posted by Rontele

When in the peloton, I am anal about getting off the track and probing around to test the snow surface. If not just for my own knowledge, but to contribute when a snowpack assesment is made.

Thats good. I do try to do the same but find its easy to just follow and sometimes decisions are de-facto made as the tour goes on based on where the lead skier sets the route.

**InspectorGadget** · 01-21-2007, 07:37 PM

Originally Posted by mc_roon

heres an question for you. What do all of you as a whole feel about your touring partners having tiny non-extendably shitty shovels that would take forever to dig someone out?

While this technique may be problematic with more than two people, you get the general idea and so will the members of your touring party.

Buy the shovel you would want somebody using to dig you out, then trade your touring partner shovels at the trailhead.

**Rontele** · 01-21-2007, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by smitchell333

Thats good. I do try to do the same but find its easy to just follow and sometimes decisions are de-facto made as the tour goes on based on where the lead skier sets the route.

Agreed. And I tour with real experience people, so I feel like I am really missing out if I have gotten to the top and the pit is already being dug or analysis is made.

**Trackhead** · 01-21-2007, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by InspectorGadget

While this technique may be problematic with more than two people, you get the general idea and so will the members of your touring party.

Buy the shovel you would want somebody using to dig you out, then trade your touring partner shovels at the trailhead.

Exactly. Show up with a plastic shovel, or some light weight crap, and I'll shove it up your ass. Cause that's the only shit it will ever dig.

**Fritz** · 01-21-2007, 07:51 PM

Originally Posted by Trackhead

Exactly. Show up with a plastic shovel, or some light weight crap, and I'll shove it up your ass. Cause that's the only shit it will ever dig.

I usually don't bring a shovel cuz I can move mass amounts of snow just using my helmet

. No seriously.

G · 01-21-2007, 08:29 PM

Oh crap. I'm so sorry Trackhead. I really did think that my beacon was solar-powered. I totally promise to bring batteries next time.

But seriously, I really do think that an aluminum tent pole does make a perfectly acceptable avalanche probe. It would have worked just fine, I'm sure.

**oftpiste** · 01-21-2007, 10:30 PM

Originally Posted by Trackhead

Perhaps you're going to be in Utah, or Colorado, and you would like someone to show you around, no problem. Happy to show people around, but there are some common sense points that obviously need to be addressed.

1. Have a beacon, shovel, AND A PROBE! And don't show up in the morning never having used any of them. Do you think we want to tour with someone who has never done a search with their beacon? It's entirely disrespectful to be part of a group, and not know how to use the basic avy tools. I don't assume people know, I ask. Yeah, it may seem harsh, but I enjoy my life, and I expect my partners to be atleast versed in beacon searches, and HAVE A PROBE!

It's not cool on a bluebird powder day to show up unprepared, and completely lacking any prior motivation to have rudimentary knowledge about beacons-probes-shovels. You're part of a touring group, you're not being guided. If you need a guide, hire one.

Again, if you don't have the knowledge, just be honest and let your partners know. If you don't, have fun living with the guilt when your partner takes his last breath while you try to figure out how to turn your beacon to search mode.

End rant.

OK, so there's got to be a good story behind this post.....

**huk** · 01-21-2007, 10:37 PM

Originally Posted by Trackhead

Perhaps you're going to be in Utah, or Colorado, and you would like someone to show you around, no problem. Happy to show people around, but there are some common sense points that obviously need to be addressed.

1. Have a beacon, shovel, AND A PROBE! And don't show up in the morning never having used any of them. Do you think we want to tour with someone who has never done a search with their beacon? It's entirely disrespectful to be part of a group, and not know how to use the basic avy tools. I don't assume people know, I ask. Yeah, it may seem harsh, but I enjoy my life, and I expect my partners to be atleast versed in beacon searches, and HAVE A PROBE!

It's not cool on a bluebird powder day to show up unprepared, and completely lacking any prior motivation to have rudimentary knowledge about beacons-probes-shovels. You're part of a touring group, you're not being guided. If you need a guide, hire one.

Again, if you don't have the knowledge, just be honest and let your partners know. If you don't, have fun living with the guilt when your partner takes his last breath while you try to figure out how to turn your beacon to search mode.

End rant.

Take an experienced partner who is good with a beacon and shovel over somebody just getting started who has a beacon, shovel and a PROBE, anyday. Besides, send the less experienced first if you have a concern. What good is their PROBE then?

**Trackhead** · 01-21-2007, 10:43 PM

Originally Posted by huk

Take an experienced partner who is good with a beacon and shovel over somebody just getting started who has a beacon, shovel and a PROBE, anyday. Besides, send the less experienced first if you have a concern. What good is their PROBE then?

Having never used a beacon in search mode, then showing up for a tour is bad form.

Don't get too hung up on the probe capitalization I made.

**P_McPoser** · 01-21-2007, 11:01 PM

Here's a question then. How is one supposed to become "experienced" if no one is willing to take an in-experienced person?

Or do you just mean at least knowing how to use the beacon and having the right equipment? Or was the inexperience not mentioned before hand that pissed you off?

**rideit** · 01-21-2007, 11:08 PM

By taking an avy 1-2 class, or being very exposed to a variety of situations.
Classes are the best intro, but common sense (and discretion) can go a long way towards gaining experience.

**jahoney** · 01-21-2007, 11:09 PM

Originally Posted by P_McPoser

Here's a question then. How is one supposed to become "experienced" if no one is willing to take an in-experienced person?

Or do you just mean at least knowing how to use the beacon and having the right equipment? Or was the inexperience not mentioned before hand that pissed you off?

yeah, this too

I don't do much backountry skiing, but I do plan on getting into it. i remember the ski patrols did a short intro to beacons and probes and shovels to my race team after a couple kids (on the same team) died in an avalanche off the backside of KT getting to their cabin over near alpine i think

**Steepdeepnlong** · 01-21-2007, 11:16 PM

As a relative noob to bc skiing, I've found it helpful to let partners know about my experience level up front, like when we are talking about going out. This usually results in them teaching me something (days before we even head out, instead of while we skin up). Before I was familiar with a beacon, a couple friends and I went out into the local hills, hid a beacon in a backpack, and got some practical experience searching around (hint, be sure to turn the beacon in the pack on before you hide it!).

**huk** · 01-21-2007, 11:18 PM

Originally Posted by Trackhead

Having never used a beacon in search mode, then showing up for a tour is bad form.

That happened to you? Crazy. Shoulda put the beacon in the car and handed him the sharp end all day.

**slim** · 01-21-2007, 11:25 PM

Originally Posted by Geoff

Oh crap. I'm so sorry Trackhead. I really did think that my beacon was solar-powered. I totally promise to bring batteries next time.

You should have brought your stud-finder. He wouldn't have known the difference.

**DownhillRider** · 01-21-2007, 11:29 PM

Originally Posted by mc_roon

heres an question for you. What do all of you as a whole feel about your touring partners having tiny non-extendably shitty shovels that would take forever to dig someone out?

Also, minimum acceptable length for a probe?

If a shovels non extendable it doesnt mean its crap...mine doesnt extend but i've spent lots of time building jumps with it (thankfully havent had to use it in other situations) and it can dig very well, not as well as some others, but it definately isnt like a plastic one... (just throwing that out there)

**JoshP** · 01-21-2007, 11:32 PM

Building kickers is not quite the same as digging out your dying friend

**DownhillRider** · 01-21-2007, 11:34 PM

Originally Posted by JoshP

Building kickers is not quite the same as digging out your dying friend

Woah never said it was.

I'm saying upfront thats the ONLY experience i've had with it....the blades big and i've never had a problem digging fast with it. Just saying that non extendable shovels arent always absolute shit.

**ill-advised strategy** · 01-21-2007, 11:38 PM

you guys sound like a lot of fun to ski with

**JoshP** · 01-21-2007, 11:45 PM

Originally Posted by DownhillRider

Woah never said it was.

I'm saying upfront thats the ONLY experience i've had with it....the blades big and i've never had a problem digging fast with it. Just saying that non extendable shovels arent always absolute shit.

Sorry, hit me a little wrong is all.

**JoeStrummer** · 01-21-2007, 11:50 PM

Also, make sure you know the Canadian drop loop system for crevasse rescue, can explain the principles of age hardening, realign C-Spine and tib/fib injuries, and have no Nickelback in your ipod. Letters of recoomendation from Reudi Beglinger a plus!

As an alternative, bring naked pix of your dirty, boozy sister who makes bad personal choices and has a Brazilian below the firn line, not the born again sister with trust issues who had a Dungeons and Dragons phase in college and is now looking for a surrogate father for her surly teenager!