Guinea Pigging the Scarpa Spirit 3

**Yossarian** · 10-28-2006, 05:34 PM

After skiing Bootfitter Larry's hand-me-down original red Denalis for the last 5 years or so (after he skied them for a season or two?), it's time to get some new AT boots. I'm picking up some Spirit 3s when I get a chance - just thought I'd let y'all know. I'll do a few reviews through the first couple months of the season as soon as I'm set up.

Anybody else already been on them much? Care to compare to the Laser/Denali/Megaride?

I've already read the old threads on the topic...some good introductory info out there, but not that much recent/updated "in-house" experience yet it seems.

**Will** · 10-28-2006, 06:08 PM

I'll just assume you've read this, right?

http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=466

**upallnight** · 10-28-2006, 10:45 PM

i chose the megaride last year over the spirit3, as i didn't have the ability to try the spirit3 on without ordering it from europer, and i was gussing it might have inherit the same bucket-fit as the red/red denalis.

(i loved the denalis, incidentally, but not without major work to get the fit right; had them a great many years. with denali toe inserts, i felt they'd be perfect.)

anyhoo, i'd be curious to hear what you think of them. the spirit4 seems, to me, like overkill for a bc setup. that 4th buckle doesn't do much (hell, one really should/could be riding with with lower buckles undone in a boot that fits properly).

i liked the fit of the megarides better than the scarpa matrix, for whatever that's worth (not much). the matrix seemed a bit soft, so i'd hope the spirit3 improves on that.

**Yossarian** · 10-29-2006, 03:54 PM

yes, and will do (respectively).

Hopefully will have something intelligent to say on the topic within the next month.

**Sierra Cement** · 10-30-2006, 07:04 PM

Anyone else find it funny that AT is now gravitating towards 3 buckle boots (Spirit 3), while Tele is going to 4 buckle (T Race and T1)? Seems they are always a step behind....

I'm definitely eager to hear reviews on the Spirit 3. The slightly higher cuff on the inside vs. outside is an interesting downhill benefit too. I have a Scarpa compatable foot and would love to hear how they do on the down and up.

**Meadow Skipper** · 10-31-2006, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by Sierra Cement

Anyone else find it funny that AT is now gravitating towards 3 buckle boots (Spirit 3), while Tele is going to 4 buckle (T Race and T1)?

Like the Garmont Adreniline, Endorphine, G-Ride and Mega Ride, the Scarpa Denali and Tornado, the Lowa Structura, and the Crispi Diablo - those three-buckle AT boots? Count much?

Seems they are always a step behind....

Heh - sorta seems like you're the one that's a step behind.

**Kellie** · 10-31-2006, 06:12 PM

Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper

Like the Garmont Adreniline, Endorphine, G-Ride and Mega Ride, the Scarpa Denali and Tornado, the Lowa Structura, and the Crispi Diablo - those three-buckle AT boots? Count much?

Heh - sorta seems like you're the one that's a step behind.

Umm, I think those are all 4 buckle boots . . . at least the Denalis were yesterday

Yoss, I have nothing to add to this topic, but anxiously await your review - I have a Scarpa-compatible foot too and am in the market for dynafit boots, enjoy the benefits of a stiffer boot, and need to order sometime soon (in case the Bros ever show up!).

**Meadow Skipper** · 10-31-2006, 06:13 PM

Originally Posted by Kellie

Umm, I think those are all 4 buckle boots . . . at least the Denalis were yesterday

You're cute, you know that? Anyway, I was being sarcastic.

**upallnight** · 10-31-2006, 06:17 PM

Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper

Like the Garmont Adreniline, Endorphine, G-Ride and Mega Ride, the Scarpa Denali and Tornado, the Lowa Structura, and the Crispi Diablo - those three-buckle AT boots? Count much?

Heh - sorta seems like you're the one that's a step behind.

the 4-buckle designs were either cross-over/borrowed from alpine design (boots like the Tornado don't really make much sense as an "AT" boot), and most of the designs you cite (G-Ride, MegaRide, Denali, Structura, at least) are "older" designs -- some quite old (Denali, at least).

The Spirit3 is an example of innovation in terms of how they designed the lower buckle -- it appears to be more efficient use of one buckle and good distribution of the force across the lower foot.

Guess I'm w/ Sierra Cement here -- the more forward-thinking AT designs are 3-buckle boots that are recognizing the thing to do is strengthen the boot without adding weight.

Not gonna step into the "is AT or telemark more involved" debate.

One should be able to ski (alpine/AT) with their lower buckles completely undone, anyway... Seriously.

**uglymoney** · 10-31-2006, 06:17 PM

Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper

You're cute, you know that? Anyway, I was being sarcastic.

Many trick or treators tonight?

I just hit my 3rd beer and 17th treater.

**wilcox510** · 10-31-2006, 06:28 PM

As UAN suggests, the actual number of buckles is pretty much irrelevent. The toe buckle on my Mega Rides does nothing. I've actually been toying with the idea of removing it. All it really does is ice up and add one more thing to deal with. If Scarpas fit me better, I would be very interested in the Spirit 3. It seems to have several features which seem more advanced than the megaride, now if they only made a low volume version of it....Interesting that they are using a hinged tongue like some of the Lowas do (or at least used to). I imagine many folks will toss those aside and replace them with flexon tongues or the like.

**Meadow Skipper** · 10-31-2006, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by upallnight

the 4-buckle designs were either cross-over/borrowed from alpine design (boots like the Tornado don't really make much sense as an "AT" boot), and most of the designs you cite (G-Ride, MegaRide, Denali, Structura, at least) are "older" designs -- some quite old (Denali, at least).

The Adreneline, Endorphine, and the Tornado are just one season old, and the Denali has been pretty thoroughly redesigned recently.

The Spirit3 is an example of innovation in terms of how they designed the lower buckle -- it appears to be more efficient use of one buckle and good distribution of the force across the lower foot.

Guess I'm w/ Sierra Cement here -- the more forward-thinking AT designs are 3-buckle boots that are recognizing the thing to do is strengthen the boot without adding weight.

Not gonna step into the "is AT or telemark more involved" debate.

One should be able to ski (alpine/AT) with their lower buckles completely undone, anyway... Seriously.

So how long has there been three buckle tele boots? Since the mid-90's or so? And the cutting edge F2 AT boot has finally "involved" to two buckles, just like tele boots of the early 90s.

I was just rippin' on SC's silly assertion that AT boots were a step ahead of tele boots because of going to three buckles. Don't get me started on bellows toes.

**Meadow Skipper** · 10-31-2006, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by uglymoney

Many trick or treators tonight?

I just hit my 3rd beer and 17th treater.

Nah, we live on a dark scary road and keep all the lights off so we can drink in peace and eat all the candy ourselves. I'm going to start drinking añejo tequila right now though.

**dk_alaskan** · 10-31-2006, 06:53 PM

UAN, so what is the deal the the Tornado Pro's? How are they not AT's? I have not heard anything about them (started a thread a few weeks ago trying to find the diff. between the only 2 boots close to my size-31, and they were the Denali TT and the Tornado's). Any enlightenment?

**wilcox510** · 10-31-2006, 07:37 PM

My understanding of the Tornado Pro is that they've done away with the interchangeable soles and now only use one sole that will work with AT(non-dynafit) or Alpine bindings. The sole has some rubber on it, but not nearly as much as other AT boots. It does have a walk mode as well. So it technically is an AT boot, but its heavy and wont scramble as well as other AT boots. If you need this amount of boot in the backcountry, great, but otherwise if you are looking for a boot solely for touring, something like the Denali TT or another boot with a full vibram sole may be a better choice.

**dk_alaskan** · 10-31-2006, 07:50 PM

want an high perf. Alpine boot with the AT weight, comfort and mountaineering ability. those are the 2 choices for me in my size

**wilcox510** · 10-31-2006, 08:40 PM

alaskan - will you be using them in alpine bindings at all? If so, the Tornado would definitely be the better choice. It looks like the Tornado is about 250 grams heavier per pair. If you really want to feel like your in an alpine boot, try the Tornado. I cant comment on how the two fit comparatively, never tried on a Tornado. Plus with the Tornado, you get that white stormtrooper look, always a winner. Any white ski boot instantly reminds me of rear entry Salomons from aroun 1990.

**corn dog** · 10-31-2006, 09:07 PM

Originally Posted by wilcox510

If Scarpas fit me better, I would be very interested in the Spirit 3.

Have you tried it on? I only put one on in the store but it felt different, snugger around my foot, than say my lasers.

**dk_alaskan** · 10-31-2006, 10:55 PM

will be most likely 90% in an AT binder.

Sorry Yossarian, feel like i am riding your thread

**wilcox510** · 10-31-2006, 11:06 PM

alaskan - even with 10% of your days in alpine bindings I would go with the Tornado. There are multiple threads here about AT boots in alpine bindings, but overall its not recommended.

Corndog - great, if they Spirits are lower volume than the Lasers/Matrix, then I will be tempted to blow even more money that I dont have!

**dk_alaskan** · 10-31-2006, 11:20 PM

used my lowa struktura lights most of last season mainly in alpine binders. only had one pre release and that was on the dreaded markers. But i am leaning the tornado route right now, unless someone has insight into the Denali's...which ever fits the biggest will turn the tables i think

**steved** · 10-31-2006, 11:47 PM

$.01,
...light weight, multi-degrees of stiffness in materials...Dalbello Krypton's three buckles(only a little lower cuff)...in multiple volumes!;-) Walk-mode with slide & click-in/out soles(rockered/flat...that can then be tweaked) without the dozen or so screws

**upallnight** · 11-01-2006, 12:10 AM

Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper

The Adreneline, Endorphine, and the Tornado are just one season old, and the Denali has been pretty thoroughly redesigned recently.

So how long has there been three buckle tele boots? Since the mid-90's or so? And the cutting edge F2 AT boot has finally "involved" to two buckles, just like tele boots of the early 90s.

I was just rippin' on SC's silly assertion that AT boots were a step ahead of tele boots because of going to three buckles. Don't get me started on bellows toes.

hey, meadow skipper -- the adrenalin's been on the feet of people i know for longer than a year...and the denali is hardly a 'complete overhaul'...the've just been tweaking it for years.

anyhoo -- it's not so much about the # of boots (but, yes, there are 1-buckle AT boots available, too) as it is about how the spirit 3 handles the lower buckle and gives it the efficacy of two lower buckles w/o the weight.

i know you were just poking fun of that one comment by SC. don't want people to lose the idea here that it's about implementation, not specs.

**upallnight** · 11-01-2006, 12:13 AM

Originally Posted by dk_alaskan

UAN, so what is the deal the the Tornado Pro's? How are they not AT's? I have not heard anything about them (started a thread a few weeks ago trying to find the diff. between the only 2 boots close to my size-31, and they were the Denali TT and the Tornado's). Any enlightenment?

hey, dk--
are those really the only options for AT boots?

the reason i made the comments above is that those boots are heavy (about as heavy as a full-on alpine boot) and stiff (particularly in the ankle), making walking less pleasant.

they do have a bit of vibram on the sole, which means they will grip a little better than an alpine boot -- but the overall facility in hiking, rock scrambling, etc. will not compare to lighter-weight options that still ski well.

it could be that they work just fine for you, and if you're a "bigger" guy you may want/prefer/need something quite stiff. just don't expect them to feel like air on your feet. other lighter AT boots can shave pounds off your feet.

just my $0.02.