Dumbass shovel question

[hamper]

Not sure if anyone has been stupid enough to ask this q before but why do all avy shovels blades have holes in 'em.

Is it so that you can wire something to them to act as a deadman? If so, have any of you ever tried this?

[AltaPowderDaze]

mostly patrol uses them to strap a shovel/probe on to their back, kind of like a pack. they can be used for a dead man but the holes would be better placed in the center like the G3. it lists that as a selling feature.

btw, there aren't any dumb questions here (slide zone). we have pleanty of other forums to post dumb questions in.

[iskibc]

Although it's not the best technique to rig up a deadman, I've used it in a couple of situations. I would recommend using a pair of skis or a 2-3' picket over a shovel blade. It works though.

[cj001f]

You can also use those holes to rig up an emergency sled w/ skis (the holes in the tips are/were nice)

[DrDre]

Can also use the shovel as a cspine stabilizer with pt's head on blade and handle supporting the spine. Use the holes to attach it to the head/body. Pack is also good for this (Belt going over forehead for stabilization).

[Hacksaw]

I think this would work in a pinch. But, I'd love to see a photo of this set-up first before I put the victim through all the movement to rig this up.

[DrDre]

I think this would work in a pinch. But, I'd love to see a photo of this set-up first before I put the victim through all the movement to rig this up.

I have used the backpack as C-spine/spine stabilization several times in mock wilderness med situations. It works very well. I think the shovel would too, especially if you have padding so they are not lying directly on the shovel handle. If you log roll them and stabilize while you are securing it, you are doing a good job.

I dont know your background, (no insult meant at all!) but remember in the backcountry, when you are truly on your own, not waiting for lifeflight, anything goes. The standard of care is the best you can do. Lawyers haven't begun suing for inappropriate care in the BC yet!

All the best, Dre'

[Hacksaw]

I dont know your background, (no insult meant at all!) but remember in the backcountry, when you are truly on your own, not waiting for lifeflight, anything goes. The standard of care is the best you can do. Lawyers haven't begun suing for inappropriate care in the BC yet!

All the best, Dre'

No insult taken. I'm former ski patrol (14 years) and currently WAFA certififed by Wilderness Medical Associates.

I like you, just like to see how to rig stuff up, before I actually have to do it in the field. Sure, I think I could do it without seeing a good photo, but its always better to have done some "prep," first.

Cheers,
Halsted

[DrDre]

Sounds like you have TONS of experience.

Can't seem to upload the photo. I did use a shovel, in addition to the pack.
I'll try again later.

All the best, Dre'

[summit]

I agree 100% on using stayed packs for makeshift litters or short spineboards + head immobilization and have practiced this a lot. But an avi shovel for c-spine immobilization? that sounds incredibly uncomfortable for the patient. I have a lot of trouble picturing how it is effective. Maybe I am picturing it wrong?

[DrDre]

We used it as additional support for backpack immob set-up. If you had really limited gear though and were self-rescuing, I would use it alone. Since you would likely be using a rope litter or some other soft carriage, you would have to have something rigid. Since the victim is going to be super cold from not generating heat, hopefully they will have a puffy on. THe hood should provide a reasonable amt of padding against the shovel blade.

Just an idea after all.

If you ever extract me though, think comfort last, I would never be mad if you prevented me from being a F'in quad!

I agree 100% on using stayed packs for makeshift litters or short spineboards + head immobilization and have practiced this a lot. But an avi shovel for c-spine immobilization? that sounds incredibly uncomfortable for the patient. I have a lot of trouble picturing how it is effective. Maybe I am picturing it wrong?