what is wrong with our country>?!?

[rideit]

Of course, no one will ever think they are an idiot, so that means there are no idiots.

Zane is NO idiot.

[Steven S. Dallas]

I don't think I have ever seen so many limousine liberals convene in one place.....

I'm afraid the average american is busting their balls trying to put food on the table for their family, put their kids through college and maybe take a week of vacation once a year. It is a shame they can't refresh cnn.com every 30 seconds to keep up with the worlds woes....

I have no idea what this has to do with the original post, or the direction that the thread took afterwards. You don't need to be a liberal to disagree with the current administration.

Regarding the comment about fewer than 25% of people voting: IMO, the problem is not that too few people vote. I think that, if anything, too many people vote. If you don't know about and haven't formed your own opinion on what the issues in a given election are, then you shouldn't go out and cast a ballot. An uninformed vote is no better than an uncast vote, and may well be worse.

[Chainsaw_Willie]

Vote all the rotten bastards out. Vote against every incumbent. Repeat at every election until only people truly interested in serving their country run.

As a general rule, politicians are scum. There are very few who aren't doing it to line their pockets or feed their ego. This, and the attitude of the average knee-jerk reactionary who gets their opinions from talk radio is why our country has gone from being widely respected to widely reviled.

Viva la revolucion!

[GoldMember]

"It's not our (the media's) fault, folks - we just peddle what you want to buy. We get more e-mails about Pam Anderson's boobs than we do about "No Child Left Behind.""

And there you have it. That's to the point. The media covers what people want to know about. Like any business, they are playing to the whims of their customers and to keep the customers, they play the crap. With that comes higher ratings and better advertising sales, hence higher profits. That's not the media's fault, it's ours as the public mass.

We have tattooed gangsta' athletes and entertainers, who may have graduated high school, making millions of dollars using their bully pulpits for political posturing and we seem to think they're 'enlightened' and follow their lead. Then we turnaround and scream about doctors/lawyers/engineers/scientists who keep us safe and save lives on a daily basis earning too much money if they make a 6 figure income. Nevermind that the educational costs and requirements and job-level knowledge are astronomical in comparison, we view these people as undeserving. When these people espouse a political view that contrasts that of our favorite athlete or entertainer, we blow them off as 'idiots' that aren't smart enough to assemble two cognizant thoughts. I mean, WTF? As a public mass, our priorities and what we're willing to reward the truly important fellow citizens relative to those who steal the camera shots is astounding to me. We're a bunch of lemmings marching off to sea.

[cj001f]

Vote all the rotten bastards out. Vote against every incumbent. Repeat at every election until only people truly interested in serving their country run.

As a general rule, politicians are scum. There are very few who aren't doing it to line their pockets or feed their ego. This, and the attitude of the average knee-jerk reactionary who gets their opinions from talk radio is why our country has gone from being widely respected to widely reviled.

Viva la revolucion!

yeah, that'll produce some real useful policies.

Most politicians truly believe they are doing whats best for the country, scary as that may be. Most of them are sacrificing their income to be there - the same skill set would make substantially more in private industry. If you want people to do it as a charity.... prepare for government run like a charity, i.e. more incompetently than currently.

[GoldMember]

I have no idea what this has to do with the original post, or the direction that the thread took afterwards. You don't need to be a liberal to disagree with the current administration.

Regarding the comment about fewer than 25% of people voting: IMO, the problem is not that too few people vote. I think that, if anything, too many people vote. If you don't know about and haven't formed your own opinion on what the issues in a given election are, then you shouldn't go out and cast a ballot. An uninformed vote is no better than an uncast vote, and may well be worse.

I agree with both of your points. First, I generally tend to be a middle-of-the-road, conservative leaning voter. I view myself as fiscally conservative, socially moderate. The problem I have with the parties is that neither is putting up any candidates that I think are worth a shit. While I admittedly voted for Bush, I will also admit that it's a vote I wish I could take back. The problem is, I wouldn't have voted for either Gore or Kerry either as I liked them less than Bush. I haven't really liked any candidate in forever.

On your second point, I propose that, in order for voters to register, they have to pass a very simple civics quiz. Like, what are the 3 branches of government, how many states are there in the United States, etc. I think most people would be surprised at how many voters would fail the quiz just on that first question. We're an ignorant mass and our representative government is a direct reflection of ourselves.

[KQ]

Check out the details of the terrorist bill. Then tell me that it's not fascist. Go ahead.

Classic Nazi Germany.

On your second point, I propose that, in order for voters to register, they have to pass a very simple civics quiz. Like, what are the 3 branches of government, how many states are there in the United States, etc. I think most people would be surprised at how many voters would fail the quiz just on that first question. We're an ignorant mass and our representative government is a direct reflection of ourselves.

The American public is ignorant of basic facts about the Constitution. When asked if they knew any of the three branches of government, two-thirds of Americans said yes; just one-third could correctly name all three.

Those findings are based on a new national survey of 1,002 people.

[GoldMember]

And then we wonder how idiots get elected. Like I said in my post, our government is a representative reflection of ourselves.

[Tippster]

Here's the Borat stuff I shot (not the movie clips, obviously.)

http://today.reuters.com/tv/videoCha...0fbab5f208bacc

[PNWbrit]

The American public is ignorant of basic facts about the Constitution. When asked if they knew any of the three branches of government, two-thirds of Americans said yes; just one-third could correctly name all three.

Perhaps also a little ironic that those seeking citizenship have to pass a civics test?

Raises the average?

[danimal's dead]

I say disolve the federal government, "I pledge allegiance to the state of Montana," I don't give a shit about Texas or Florida or about 75% of the states out there.

The feds got us into the Iraq quagmire not the state of Wyoming, Colorado, Idaho etc...

I'm sick of paying federal taxes, I feel I get nothing in return. Stop building guns and bombs with my money.

I don't feel threatened by Islamic terrorists, I don't really see a need to spend 500 billion dollars in Iraq, which has nothing to do with the war on terror anyway.

But if you think Nancy Pelosi, Howard Dein and Ted Kennedy are going to fix the country then you are sadly mistaken. They will give you nothing but special interest legislation.

[Viva]

And then we wonder how idiots get elected. Like I said in my post, our government is a representative reflection of ourselves.

This is from a few years ago. I don't know how accurate it was. though:

"According to an investigation by Capitol Hill Blue, an online publication that covers federal politics, a remarkable number of U.S.
Representatives and U.S. Senators may have spent as much time in a jail cell as on Capitol Hill.

After researching public records, newspaper articles, civil court transcripts, and criminal records, Capitol Hill Blue discovered that:

* 29 members of Congress have been accused of spousal abuse.

* 7 have been arrested for fraud.

* 19 have been accused of writing bad checks.

* 117 have bankrupted at least two businesses.

* 3 have been arrested for assault.

* 71 have credit reports so bad they can't qualify for a
credit card.

* 14 have been arrested on drug-related charges.

* 8 have been arrested for shoplifting.

* 21 are current defendants in lawsuits.

* And in 1998 alone, 84 were stopped for drunk driving, but released after they claimed Congressional immunity.


Capitol Hill Blue did not list the names of all the individual members of Congress accused of the various crimes, but did note that some were "serial offenders" with extensive tracks records of fraud or violence.

[danimal's dead]

Exactly Viva, Washington is full of the slimiest criminals in the country.

The Assylum is being run by the patients.

Are you surprised that the rest of the world hates us.

Look at the Leviathan we have created, Washington is out of control, unfixable, totally corrupted, and way beyond anything the framers of our constitution could have ever imagined.

[GoldMember]

I kind of remember that article about the congressional statistics. Sad state of affairs but it's worth noting; many politicians (mostly municipal, county, or state) run for office because they have lost jobs and can't find employment. They want the pay but mostly the bennies. Once in a local office, they get elevated by those in their proclaimed party and guess what, they become members of the House and whatever. As a voting public, we do a lousy job of job interviewing, or even understanding the job that we're hiring these people for. It is harder for a welder in my company to get hired than it is for a state representative to get elected.

As for Danimal's Dead's comments. Unfortunately, we do need a federal government for those things that can't be managed locally; namely a national DEFENSE department. But that's the rub. Iraq has nothing to do with defense. It was a 'pre-emptive strike' based on (I'll be nice here) inaccurate intelligence. I'm not going to go into whose fault the level of accuracy was but it needed to be absolutely, without room for error, accurate to justify the raid. It wasn't and the planning and exit strategies were horrible to boot. This Administration has botched the Iraq, and consequently the anti-terror initiatives to a degree that is beyond comprehension. We had the world's good will in our favor on September 12, 2001. We spent that good will and went into debt against it (both financially and emotionally) shortly after. But you're right, the Dems don't have the answers (IMHO) of how to deal with this situation either. As noted in the above study, many of these people in both parties are incapable of managing their own lives let alone our collective good fortunes. Until the public becomes better educated, aware, and interested, we can expect more of the same. Pete Townshend said it best, "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss."

Maybe PNWBrit's got the answer. Make us all re-register for citizenry so we have to be tested to be citizens. Or as I promote, at least make us pass a minimal civics and current world affairs quiz in order to be able to vote. Right now, we're (the public mass) an incredibly ignorant lot.

[cj001f]

I feel I get nothing in return.

Instead of feeling, start thinking. Fucktards like you are ruining the country faster than any politician who's job functions you can barely understand. Perhaps read on the history of Washington and politics, you won't, that'd give you perspective. Like this
http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/topic/40.html

Per dollar of federal tax collected in 2004, Montana citizens received approximately $1.58 in the way of federal spending. This ranks the state 9th highest nationally and represents a rise from 1992 when Montana received $1.46 per dollar of taxes in federal spending (5th highest nationally). Neighboring states and the amount of federal spending received per dollar of federal tax collected are: Idaho ($1.28), Wyoming ($1.11), North Dakota ($1.73), and South Dakota ($1.49).

You get nothing, that's right. Dumbass.

[ski_adk]

The rub of it to me is that the average American doesn't even want to know what's going on with the government, let along geo-politics. Start bringing up verified incidents of the CIA's involvement with a foreign government and you'll be branded as a tin-foil hat wearing nutbag.

In my eyes, the American public isn't smart enough to fix its government. So, eventually, our leadership will push other nations too far and they'll try to fix it for us. It's happened before in history...it will happen again. It sucks, but what are you gonna do?

Are you really willing to start a revolution or something?

[danimal's dead]

Again CJ I say what did I get from the feds, other than highways that I rarely use.

I live in the middle of nowhere, I drive dirt county and old logging roads. I certainly don't benefit from any federal assistance.
As for national defense, that would be the 12 guage automatic in the back of my jeep.
You have no idea what I have or have not read, I don't spend all day editing my posts to make myslef look erudite. But suffice it to say neither of my degrees say marketing on them.

[cj001f]

Again CJ I say what did I get from the feds, other than highways that I rarely use.

I live in the middle of nowhere, I drive dirt county and old logging roads. I certainly don't benefit from any federal assistance.
As for national defense, that would be the 12 guage automatic in the back of my jeep.
You have no idea what I have or have not read, I don't spend all day editing my posts to make myslef look erudite. But suffice it to say neither of my degrees say marketing on them.

old logging roads? If they are on national forest land... you paid for them and their upkeep. Ski Areas pretty much= public land. Forest fire fighting. There's a long list of other things that wouldn't exist if it weren't for the feds.. like quite probably your degrees. but I'm sure you don't want them.

you think I'm in marketing?

[danimal's dead]

No CJ, that was a joke, when I was in school marketing was the major of choice for idiots who should have gone to trade school.

I agree that much of federal dollars in Montana go to th forest circus and the park service if that's what you're saying, but my argument would be that the state of Montana does a better job of managing public lands, and they're all open to backcountry snowmobiling and skiing.

[rideit]

Even the wilderness areas?

WOW!!!

[cj001f]

No CJ, that was a joke, when I was in school marketing was the major of choice for idiots who should have gone to trade school.

Countering facts with ad hominem insults? Running for office? I'm sure you could do an audit of your life to see how much effect your tax dollars have on every aspect, that's not how societies work.

Goldmember has it right - our elected representatives reflect us, as do our media.

[hutash]

Don't forget all the fed subsides for ranching, farming, etc. I don't know the dollar amounts, maybe cj can list them, but we the people of the state of California subsidize half the country. I beat that would change if we ever voted republican.

[mr_gyptian]

Check out the details of the terrorist bill. Then tell me that it's not fascist. Go ahead.

sounding the alarms since 1968.